jim mann was great. the watchman in the night speech that he made. these are all decisions that were in the process of being made at the time. when the president made it much easier by resigning. >> did mr. dorr play any role as a consultant at the time of the clinton impeachment? >> not to my -- i don't know. i wasn't around in the clinton impeachment. listen to me there would be no clinton impeachment. but i wasn't around. the answer is probably not. but i don't know for sure. >> did you know that bert marshall opposed article 3? >> no. i did not know that. he did? that's interesting. >> he and owen fist had a debate about it. owen did support it. >> that was important. see, he -- i was a strong supporter of article 3. and i did know that dorr reached out to other people such as fist and marshall. he didn't rely on my judgment solely. he looked to me for advice and -- but he was looking to other people as well. so if i argued strongly as i did for article 3 i knew he would go to other -- like he should. that's the right thing. just because i say th

jim mann, walter flowers, people like that. key members of the committee. these are democrats, by no means who is constituency, south carolina and alabama, would by no means certain to vote for impeachment putting aside the republicans so. what we were trying to do was get it right. make sure it was as accurate as possible. when they make a decision they can make it in a coherent factual accurate fashion. that's big -- even i didn't think of that till recently. we really were working for both the republicans and the -- sure, it was a republican staff that worked for jenner, then sam guerinson. we had a republican staff working with us, that's one of the great things is meld the staffs together. we wanted -- we were being questioned all the time whether this should be done or that should be done or what the consequences of this is and of that, how do you analyze this and that. this is a very important concept to understand during that impeachment. this is a real joint effort but also an effort where we were subject to checks and balances. as we had to be. so