jim owens joins me. great to have you on the program. >> good to be here. >> you recently retired from your role as ceo and chairman of caterpillar. what trends do you see as far as drivers in the american economy? >> well, i think it's, one, i think american companies have to begin to think more and more about global competitiveness in how they compete with imported products and how they compete when they export from the united states, as well as where they invest around the world to participate. but we're also investing and continuing to invest in america. and we have a very strong, vibrant export business in caterpillar. and a number of other. americans sometimes lose track of the fact that we still have the largest manufacturing economy in the world. >> right. >> and we are one of the top four exporters in the world from the united states. >> it's very a important point that you're making. >> absolutely. critical. >> but those people who say what does america make. so does that concern you? >> we exp

. >> you talk to somebody like jim owens. i referenced him in the rpth for caterpillar. it's not that jim owens and caterpillar say bad guy or a bad company that's nearly a 100-year-old legendary enterprise that's based out of our country. but the economic structure, the taxation caterpillar faces to manufacture tractors here and sell them there because the chinese government is not willing to accept a foreign competitor in that country without creating some sort of investment or jobs in their own country which seems pretty tactically rational. and, yet, our country, america, doesn't basically take that advantage away so as to protect our own industry here. i'm not suggesting overprotectionism so much as i am the end of unfair play and the beginning of reciprocity so that we can at least have a chance for the american people to do what they do best which is work hard, innovate and use their resources. but no one can do it in a rigged game. >> that's right. that's right. and that's why we need to push this. we need to use -- you know, china is in the wto. we need to push

if you talk jim owens of caterpillar, he's got a tariff.where ever you create the money, that's only the beginning. once you've got the money whether you're a rich person with a tax cut or somebody who had some money printing, what am i going to do with it. am i going do the hard work and take the risk of investing with some kids or whoever it is to deal with an innovative concept. >> i think that's pretty fresh thinking. it's my hope thas republicans g forward and you know, you said earlier that republicans got power in the 112th congress. i think the folks that grabbed the power were the american people. i don't see the election on november 2nd as so much a victory for any political party. it was a victory for the american people to grab back the reigns in washington, d.c. and said, we can do better. as we go forward, i think what the american people will be asking is how do we create a environment in the united states that can compete with china, with india. i'm going to run up to the detroit economic club in a few weeks and have a lot t

is jim owens a bad guy at caterpillar for doing that? probably not.s that cost us jobs and productivity? yes, it does. there are -- >> you just answered his question. >> the fact of the matter is this, aside from japan, every major country is a tax haven to the united states because we have the highest corporate tax rate outside of japan. should we look at our competitiveness in the world? absolutely. should we look at ways to keep a company like caterpillar invest here? the fact of the matter is, we have to be open about our competitiveness, our trade policies. >> no one disagrees with that. have you talked to dan domico, largest steel company in north america and ask him how the frae trade agreements have affected his business. if there's a steel contract in brazil, a steel project for a major building development in china, he does not allowed to bid on that. he is forced to compete with everybody else. >> bottom line it. >> we're going to bottom line it. the bottom line, is there a lot of americans that hear washington worship the alter of free tra