jim tisch is here, he's's loews -- wait.to say -- >> because there's the hardware store. >> there's also a hardware store spelled differently. chairman and director for dimon offshort and form are director of the federal bank of new york. so looking at the commit rye now, i think your take is there was some calm and now we're back into a period of worry based position. >> remember all the wrangling took all the attention -- >> there was already a lot of uncertainty and it added to it. >> well, this fiscal cliff is the summer of '11 but on steroid. not on do we have an acrimonious presidential race, but we also have the sequestration of the military and domestic spending funds and we have the end of the bush tax cuts and we also have the social insurance taxes going back up. so the expectation is that -- >> i think you have some obamacare stuff kicking in, too, huge taxes, right? >> so the expectation is that all of that stuff is worth about four points of fiscal drag on the economy. >> and we're at two. >> say again? >> we'r