>> i know joe alba. he is very smart. this birther nonsense. he doesn't need that. robert is right. look, the focus is beating barack obama, the focus -- you can't go so far to the lunatic fringe in the primary. i am joe alba speaking to rick perry, that you alien nate most people you are going to face in the general. on the flat tax, look, i would have two words of advice. this is me speaking now for rick perry. steve forbes. remember how well it worked. steve forbes tried it in 1996. he tried it in 2000. this is an old, old idea. everybody knows there will never be a flat tax. there are too many lobbyists in washington who will shoot holes in it and carve out special exemptions. i think it's a stale idea for rick perry. i'm surprised he doesn't come up with something better. >> isn't the strategy to be the anti-romney, since romney is in the lead. >> well, it is to be the anti-romney but i think with a stronger and a clearer platform. rick perry is talking about privatizing social security, a balanced budget amendment a

i mean, perry today did hire president bush's first campaign manager, joe alba, but, you know, joe supported08 his big savior candidate was rudy giuliani. i'm starting to wonder if rick perry is kind of the rudy giuliani figure of 2012. where he's the guy who everybody thought was going to come in and be the big savior, knock off the front-runner in the end he finished third in his best primary and i think he got one delegate. this is not at this point a winning campaign. >> you know, we had the rock story at the perry hunting spot that they rented years ago. and now we have this confederate license plate. why can't the governor of texas come out and say unequivocally that he thinks the confederate license plate is a bad idea? >> well, he could and he should, obviously. i mean, if he were looking for an opportunity to really distance himself from that awful camp name and to reassure americans that he really stands for fairness, that's what he would do. but instead, you know, he's taking -- it's a page from the haley barbour playbook. because haley, his strategy, he came out and said, i'm not

he hired campaign veterans including george bush's 2000 campaign manager joe alba who is a close friend of karl rove. one article indicated he got tough people behind him now. what's behind that strategy in getting the well-known names? he didn't do it before. >> the campaign was not ready for prime time. perry wasn't and he wasn't prepared for the debates. he wasn't organized and didn't produce a plan as you said until really today. the tax plan and jobs plan is outlined today. he brought in the national talent and people who have been here before. it was with bob dole and tony fabrizio is an excellent guy. that guy headed up the george w. bush campaign in 2000 and is bringing on the pros from dover for a campaign that i think is trying to fight its way back. >> speaking of fighting back, an insider said he was going to show mitt romney what it means to bring a knife to a gun fight. she planning on attack on mitt romney here. >> they are. i think the attack will come from the perry campaign itself and it came today when he talks about his plan is not nibbling around the edges of tax po

the word on the streets seems to be by hiring the people he's hired, including joe alba, who was giuliani's campaign manager and bush's campaign manager in 2000 and we should also mention he was the fema director during katrina, i'm not sure how well that bodes with what he does the storms that might be coming his way with the rick perry campaign, what do you think about the staff changes? >> well, i think it shows a lot. that he's playing for keeps. one of the things that's important to note about rick perry is he has a lot of money in the bank. that's not just going to be spent on negative advertising at the end, bashing mit romney as he tries to sort of reclaim that front runner status for himself. i think it will also be spent on the staff that will help him have smart messaging. the people that you mentioned that he announced he brought on today, several of them had sort of worked on flat tax proposals. this is what he's releasing in the next couple days, he will have the economic plan he pushes in south carolina, which by the way is a state we haven't mentioned yet. also very importan

rick perry has personally, after anita talked to him, anita perry, his wife, talked to him, called joe alba, who ran the operation, be sure the trains ran on time, the organization of george bush 11 years ago, in the 2000 presidential race, and asked alba to come on board and take over the campaign, which he is going to do. so they understand that they have a problem. >> he also -- he also ran fema during katrina, right, wayne? >> no, he ran katrina -- he ran fema right before katrina. he had the good -- >> no, don't -- >> -- wisdom to leave and become a private consultant. >> the interesting thing -- >> great job, brownie. >> the guys that rick perry picked up, a lot of them worked for rick scott, the governor of florida. now, remember, rick scott was head of a company that was charged $1.7 billion in fines and damages for defrauding medicare. and they got that guy elected governor. so if i were mitt romney, or somebody else, and saw these guys coming into rick perry's camp, i would say, maybe this guy does have a second chance here. we ought to be worried about a perry bounce. >> well, i