joe biden, that they don't like to hear this. they don't like to hear a strong man, authoritarian rhetoric. when he said he will root out his opponents like bermanat's problematic. it turns off suburban women, independents. you have this whole campaign going around saying he he doesn really mean this, that's not who he is, and then you have the candidate himself saying, actually, yes, that is who i am, and that is what i mean. >> the biden campaign, they really believe and you hear it in what we hear from the president that they think this really matters to voters. i guess maybe the outstanding question is ultimately when it comes to next november, will this campaign, as unconventional as it is, turn more on conventional things like issues, abortion, the economy? >> well, it depends. if the biden campaign has its way, they absolutely want to make this about issues, abortion and abortion rights are tremendously galvanizing for democrat, as we've seen in a number of these special and off year elections. and you talk to the biden campaign and biden white house, and they want to make sure every day they are explaining this is what a trump presidency