joe kleine, you're with "time" magazine. which is the last standing "newsweek"ly. >> i don't trust myself on this story, on this topic. because this september, i will -- it will be my 40th anniversary in this business. and yeah, i blog now. and i get a great deal of satisfaction from it. but i sure -- i would go into withdrawal if i couldn't pick up the daily newspaper and flip the page and see a story that i didn't expect to see at all about haircuts in burma or something. you don't get that on the web because everything is targeted. chris: all these online groups are grabbing things off the papers like "the washington post" and selling it in the secondary market. when's the post going to get that money to pay the reporters? >> the younger generation is going to figure out that business model. what's missing now, right this year, is a crisis. we're going to have a crisis. the crisis is goi to be big. people are going to turn to television, the newspapers, and magazines. to tell them what the hell is going on. chris: newspap

gloria borger is senior political analyst for cnn and joe kleine is a columnist for "time" magazine. the excitement of the news business runs in the american bloodstream. movies celebrated newspapers and on tv, we love watching this. >> mr. white -- >> who gave you permission to barge in like a bull? >> there's a dirigible with a guy hanging over a rope. >> you get down there, lois, and assign a tote graffer. two of them -- a photographer. two of them. chris: we're down to 1,400 dailies. this year alone five including denver's rocky mountain news and the seattle post intelligencer have printed their own obituaries. major cities like san francisco and boston may soon face a future without a single daily broad sheet. "the san francisco chronicle" and "the boston globe" are in big trouble. they're institutions really, as much part of those santos as rice-a-roni.

joining me now joe klein of "time" magazine. ady written so eloquently about that day in 1980 when you witnessed really the end of his presidential hopes. there might have been a chance four years later but back then he was challenging an incumbent president jimmy carter and you wrote today, i was with him that day. he was liberated from ambition. finally, it was february 26th, 1980, the day of the new hampshire henman. he was losing, an unimaginable event for a candidate, losing in new england. his campaign up to that point had been in fact dreadful. he had famously been unable to answer a simple question posed by roger mudded of cbs news, why do you want to be president? take us back to those days and of course to that really tense and emotional convention at madison square garden when he gave one of the greatest speeches of his life and refused to hold up his hands with jimmy carter? >> andrea, i have to take you back beyond that. i knew the guy for 40 years. he was the first major politician i ever covered. and when i first m

some, the answer revealed kennedy didn't know or just truly didn't want it or as "time" magazine's joe klein today in a column that he sent me, he never really seemed to feel like he deserved it, maybe compared to his brothers or his dad. the ultimate irony is that after his single failed bid for the white kennedy went on to accomplish more in the senate than some men have gotten done in the white house. >>> health care is his issue of today, but during the civil rights movement, no person in congress did as much as ted kennedy. glioblastoma. >>> all right. we told you a little while ago we'd be getting some historic audiotape in from the lbj library. we have received that. this is the president of the united states at the time, 1964, and he's calling ted kennedy right after ted kennedy's really horrible plane accident where a lot of people thought he would have lost his life. kennedy was in the hospital for about ten months after that. let's listen this. >> senator kennedy on line 0. >> hello? >> mr. president. >> my friend. i'm sure glad to hear your voice. >> thank you so much. listen, i

. >> i want to give you an opportunity to respond, joe, but first i want to read what you joe klein wroternment takeover. he says the same people who rail against the government takeover of health care tried to enforce a government takeover of terri schiavo's end of life decisions. when palin floated the death panel canard, the number of prominent republicans who rose up to call her out to be counted on one hand. >> we have to look forward. we can't look back. i don't want to talk about what happened several years ago. what i'd like to talk about are the number of people that are going to be put out of work by an 8% raise in payroll taxes for small businesses under that bill. why rush this bill through? if you want to help people tell them the truth. let me finish. tell the folks who are going to be hurt that they're going to be hurt. the president said it on saturday. he was honest. he said, you know, some folks are going to be hurt by this legislation. let them know who they are and how they're going to be hurt. >> it's very clear what the republican strategy is here, which is to slow t

in our magazine this week, joe klein writes about covering senator kennedy in 1980 when he did run forte house and finding that he was sort of uncomfortable in that role and he never really warmed to his candidacy, really until the very end. i wonder if you feel that by that time, the senator kennedy realized that the impact he was going to make ultimately was in the senate and that he could have more of an impact in many ways than he would if he would become president? >> you know, i think largely he did, but two years ago, spring of 2007, i was talking to him and i basically, you know, spoke the theory that you've just said. i said isn't it great that you found your home was in the senate and you could do so much here and that senators like you can sometimes have a bigger impact than some presidents at certain points? he said -- this is before the presidential campaign began that barack obama won. he said i hate to tell you i think if i was 10 or 15 years younger i might run for president next year myself, so i think evident am bev lent. >> michael beschloss, enjoyed you being here w

joining us now are joe klein with "time" magazine and patricia murphy with politics daily. murph, what do you think of these people showing up at the obama events with these weapons? i think we've got the video, we can put it up again. put that up again in case viewers missed that. that's a heck of a piece there. that's an ar-15, an assault rifle. >> yeah, to me, that's really quite terrifying. i have talked to a lot of people in politics, out of politics, who said this entire debate is inching closer and closer to a place that everybody is afraid to even think about, that anger will turn to violence. i think having an automatic weapon at one of these events is exactly how something like that happens. it may be legal but it's a terrible idea. it's absolutely terrifying to me. >> joe, i don't remember people protesting against president bush showing up with weapons. do you? >> i've been doing this for almost 40 years now, and i have never seen anything like this. there should be like a second amendment equivalent of the first amendment shouting "fire" in a crowded theater. i

so, i would say joe kleine's position is closer to the nihilistic position than the conservative position want to make another point, james? >> i just -- joe is a very smart guy who knows words very well, and i'm sure that he picked that word very carefully. >> i'm sure he did, as well. we all know joe kleine and he is -- >> i looked up the meaning in the dictionary and i think he's closer to nihilists than conservatives. >> there is a popular definition which suggs someone who just says "no" all the time and that may have been the definition he was striving for but we'll ask him at the next occasion. i'm going to change gears completely. the president is heading off to campaign, going to martha's vineyard with his family for a little vacation. james, give me some advice that you could share with the president right now as he gets read d i to head to martha's vineyard. >> you know, it's hard to say a guy is not entitled to vacation and his wife and kids are getting ready to go back to school. i know i took a vacation this summer. but there's some sort of trepidation out there that we've g

in 1976, joe klein said he followed him around in massachuset massachusetts, and said he was out of his that. >> yeah, a funny thing about ted kennedy. gene mentioned that maybe unconsciously subversed what other people are putting you on, and you decide what you want-to-be and you don't want to be it, and you find subtle ways to make sure it doesn't happen. and i think sometimes the presidency is in the american imagination and our historic imagination, it's a mystery, and they find ways to skew up their lives so they will not be serious candidates. have you seen that in washington, those that think about it, and you can tell, he decided along the way he doesn't want it? >> i have actually seen that personally in recent months with a good friend of mine who knew, who knew that the decisions me made -- >> he was being considered presidential timber, and therefore -- >> i don't analyze. i just report. and yes, that happens from time to time. gene, we also have been talking about how remarkable ted kennedy's success in the senate has been considering he spent the last quarter century oper

joining us now is joe klein. a couple of hot things to talk about.th the detainee abuse. eric holder apointing a special prosecutor to look in to an alleged unauthorized and inhumane practices against detainees according to the ci a's inspector general's report. republicans are worried that this could be a witch hunt that goes up the chain of command. but other people believe it needs to have a wide net cast. david cole, who wrote the book, the torture memo said in "the new york times" -- to investigate line interrogators without investigating those who committed the, quote, original sin authorizing the cia to use cruel, tactics in the first place is is subjugating the true responsibility. start at the top of the ladder, joe? >> it needs to start at the top rather than the bottom. the big problem is the bottom of the ladder we have a clandestine service in the united states right now doing important things. we don't want those people to believe they can be called on the carpet. there's a real morale problem at the cia. those people need to be protect

my question is even though joe jackson cannot play a role in the kids life, would he have any type of visitation rights? >> larry: are you talking about dr. klein: oh, joe jackson. i couldn't hear. >> joe jackson has a right to visit the children and plans to visit his children. >> grandchildren. >> and his children. >> larry: so he's going to be involved in their lives? >> absolutely. he was involved in their lives prior to michael's passing, too. >> larry: celebrities and drugs, an age-old problem. there was a blog written for us about this very much and how doctors enabled her mother judy garland. >> larry: londell mcmillan and diane goodman. so we'll clear that up. dr. klein has no standing with the kids today. >> absolutely not. >> larry: if he wanted to see them, katherine could say yes or no. the judge extended the appointments of john branca and john mcclane, the executors named in jackson's will for the next 60 days. how does katherine feel about that? >> i think that's okay right now. somebody has to be in charge and that's what the judge said. we need someone in charge making decisions. it gives us time to have further conversations

klein? >> caller: i'm sorry? >> larry: oh, joe jackson. i couldn't hear. >> joe jackson has a right to visit the children and plans to visit his children. >> grandchildren. >> and his children. >> larry: so he's going to be involved in their lives? >> absolutely. he was involved prior to michael's passing, also. >> larry: an age-old problem, a blog written for us about this very issue and how doctors enabled her mother judy garland. go to the blog via cnn.com/larryking. tom. now, i know the catering business but when i walked in here i wasn't sure what i needed. i'm not sure what i need. tom showed me how to use mifi to get my whole team working online, on location. i was like, "woah". woah ! only verizon wireless has small business specialists in every store to help you do business better. you're like my secret ingredient. come in today and connect up to five devices on one 3g connection. now only $99.99 so metlife removed the guesswork. cop,ining two essential insurances, term life and disability in one surprisingly affordable package. s

joe torre. prominent cancer physician as well. prostate cancer is the subject tomorrow night. first time dr. arnie klein spoke out after michael jackson's death was on this show. here's a quick reminder of some of the things he said exclusively to us. >> to the best of my knowledge, i'm not my father. >> larry: you don't feel you have to take a dna test to prove anything? >> if they want my dna test, they can have my dna. i don't care at this point. >> larry: are you surprised diprivan was found in his home, supposedly? >> i'm very shocked by it. i have to tell you, it's not something that would be unheard of. >> larry: the debbie rowe part of the story. she was your nurse? >> yes. >> larry: met in your office? >> yes. >> larry: was that a real love affair? >> i don't know what love is. that sense, the imagination. i think she loves him very much. she admired him very much. >> larry: let's clear up something. he was not someone desirous of being white? >> no. michael was black. he was very proud of his black heritage. >> larry: we'll have more excerpts of that interview later. now exclusively. we welcom