a good issue to discuss with time magazine's joe klein and cnn's political analyst joe borjer. >> theapon they will use against republicans as the budget debate continues in washington. will it stop responsible bipartisan negotiations on a deficit and debt deal? >> yeah, i am tempted to say probably. democrats have been demagoguing this issue a long time. this is not to say they weren't wrong to block, you know, paul ryan's plan, which was a very, very extreme plan, but there's someplace in the middle, and it involves medicare reforms and revenues, taxes, higher taxes. you know, any society, especially one as prosperous as ours should be humane enough to provide a system of healthcare for the elderly that's no frills and must free. >> paul ryan, the architect of the house plan was there, so was bill clinton, last democratic president that had a balanced budget. what bill clinton told paul ryan, he said quote, i hope democrats don't use this as an excuse to do nothing. >> right. >> will they use it as an excuse to do nothing? >> there's disagreements going on within the democratic part