so joe tacopina was fierce, attackg e.n carroll's credibility cared we will have to see, christian, if that is enough to overcome evidence that e. jean carroll's attorney has provided. christian: there was a supposition that it would take some time to come to a verdict, because, as you rightly say, they have to come through unanimous verdict. does the fact that they have come to a conclusion within a few hours, what does that signify? nada: yeah, well, look, christian, i have to say, if you are donald trump right now, you are taking note at how quickly the jury came to a decision. you would think that if this jury had a few people who work disagreeing that working through those disagreements, going through the evidence what take some time. here we never had the jury come back with ankind of additional questions to review any pieces of the evidence, which really signals that perhaps they were on the same page on this, that there were not too many issues that needed to be resolved. i would think if you are donald trump, that

i don't know joe tacopina _ a criminal case in new york? on't think we can hear. we will watch these pictures and see if we get a microphone on him. i and see if we get a microphone on him. , . ., g ., and see if we get a microphone on him. ,. ., him. i expect that joe tacopina will be thrown under _ him. i expect that joe tacopina will be thrown under the _ him. i expect that joe tacopina will be thrown under the bus _ him. i expect that joe tacopina will be thrown under the bus as - him. i expect that joe tacopina will be thrown under the bus as donald j be thrown under the bus as donald trump tends to do. whether he did the bestjob he could with the information he had my guess is you probably won't see him around too much longer. probably won't see him around too much longer-— probably won't see him around too | much longer._ things much longer. let's listen in. things like donald — much longer. let's listen in. things like donald trump... _ much longer. let's listen in. things like donald trump... the _ much longer. let's listen in. thin

outside the courthouse, his lawyer, joe tacopina said the deck was stacked against his client. >> part of me was obviously very happy that donald trump was not branded a rapist. >> reporter: but during the trial, jurors heard parts of trump's deposition in the case. >> that she is not my type. >> reporter: he misidentified carroll in photograph as his second wife, marla maples. >> that's marla. >> reporter: and was asked about that infamous access hollywood videotaped. >> it is true how celebrities can grab them by the [bleep]? >> largely true, fortunately or unfortunately. >> his deposition could be said to be a disaster in this case. the worse when it's against donald trump was donald trump. >> reporter: trump lawyers say they plan to appeal. the former president is facing a host of other legal challenges, and putting probes in new york,

>>> former president donald trump's rape/defamation trial, his attorney joe tacopina getting a big no from the judge on the mistrial request. we'll go live to the courthouse in just a few minutes. >>> we are going to start in texas where it's day three of the massive manhunt for suspected texas gunman francisco oropesa. so far no sign of the man accused of killing his five neighbors execution style including a 9-year-old boy after they complained he was firing his ar-15 at night. yesterday the police and fbi saying they've come up empty despite a massive contingent of 250 officers involved and a reward totaling $80,000 for tips that bring him in. they say the man they're looking for is armed and dangerous and could be literally anywhere. >> i pretty much can guarantee he's contacted some of his friends. we just don't know what friends they are. that's what we need in the public, is any type of information. right now we're just running into dead ends. >> do you all believe that the suspect is still in the area? >> we do not know. like i said, right now we have zero leads. >> that attac

and trump's attorney, joe tacopina, was focusing today on her actions after this alleged rape. was going through some of her behavior, essentially asking her to explain for someone who was so traumatized, why did she continue doing certain things, one of them continuing to shop for goods, and they showed receipts, showing that she had been to the department store more than 20 times after the alleged assault, where she said tens of thousands of dollars. you will support it to some facebook posts of hers in which see she was saying she was a big fan of the apprentice, the television reality show that starred former president trump. now, carroll said she was interested in it for the competitive sphere between the aspiring entrepreneurs, and she said she stopped watching at the end of each episode, where trump did the, you are fired, piece of it. they also asked her why did she ever report her alleged assaults to the police? you know, she had advised numerous people who wrote into her, asking jean column to do that very thing. she explained under redirect from her attorneys that tr

jean carroll had to say earlier about an intersection she had with trump's attorney joe tacopina. to congratulate me and i said he did it and you know it. >> trump's team is saying they will appeal this. how do you see this moving forward from here? >> you have to differentiate between the merits and what trump sees as a victory by kicking the can down the road by delaying. you know that for trump as well as i do, delay is often a win, and particularly -- >> this case was years. >> this case was years in the making. she originally brought her first defamation case in november of 2019. that case actually still hasn't been litigated and e. jean carroll has to decide whether she wants to press forward with the defamation case based on her claims while he was president about her. on the appeal, i think the merits of the appeal are extraordinarily weak. they have to do with the judge's decision to exclude dna evidence, mostly on the ground that trump himself didn't cooperate with that until joe tacopina came into the case in february. there are a number of other pretrial rulings that j

joe tacopina straight ahead.eed is a phone and a finger. just go to vroom.com, scroll through thousands of cars. then, tap to buy. that's it. no sales speak, no wasted time. go to vroom.com and pick your favorite. our customers don't do what they do for likes or followers. their path isn't for the casually curious. and that's what makes it matter the most when they find it. the exact thing that can change the world. some say it's what they were born to do... it's what they live to do... trinet serves small and medium sized businesses... so they can do more of what matters. benefits. payroll. compliance. trinet. people matter. [applause] >> former president donald trump was cleared of all rape charges from a civil suit in new york city in a courtroom yesterday. but the same jury did find trump liable for abuse and defamation. and president trump told fox news.com, that he does not know e. jean carroll and plans to appeal the verdict, joining us is joe tacopina. how are you. not liable on big allegation that she ma

is that the tone that joe tacopina -- let me ask you this.ith you when you were on the witness stand today? because he's performing for his audience of one, which would be trump. >> yes. basically, he went over the length of time between when this happened and now or 2016 when i came out. and how could i possibly remember? and just questioning my veracity, basically. >> and donald trump has done that obviously with yourself as well. my understanding is that joe tacopina's tenor including with e. jean carroll was to ask, why didn't jow scream, why didn't you call for help, why didn't you ask for security camera footage? were you asked those kinds of questions as well? >> yes. yes, absolutely. of course, the real answer is, again, back then in the late '70s, early '80s, at that time there was no place to go and complain. the stewardesses were not going to do anything. the airlines were not going to do anything. my company was not going to do anything. it was -- there was nobody to tell. >> yeah. >> the police would not take you seriously. you w

>> he's strong. >> okay, that's joe tacopina. i think sometimes when you cover the trump story long enough the truth seeps out. quote, i'm happy donald trump was not branded a rapist. at the end of the day i'm not sure for donald trump there was too much more than that on the line, andrew weissman. >> yes. i mean, let's just cut to the chase here. you had three women who were found to be unanimously credible saying that they were sexually assaulted by the former president. he is on record saying with respect to them and everyone else who has made these claims that it's all false. this really is a question of the judicial system or the facts and law still matter coming into -- two things colliding with each other, which is donald trump's alternate universe and a place where reality and law still matter. and i think what we're ultimately going to be seeing when he step back is a continued assault by donald trump and his allies on the judicial system because this is sort of going to be a drum beat of the law holding donald trump to

trump's attorney joe tacopina telling reporters after today that tape a possible ground for a forthcoming appeal. >> the "access hollywood" tape should not have come into this case. there were things that happened in the case that were beyond the peal. >> reporter: he also confused a photo of carroll who he said wasn't his type for his ex-wife marla maples, yeah. that's my wife. >> reporter: a striking moment tacopina never addressed at trial. >> and laura, this case is also breaking rare legal ground. >> that's right. carroll's case is among the first to go to trial using a new law that gives survivors of sexual assault a window to file civil suits even when the statute of limitations has long since passed. many have filed claims under this new law. none with a verdict quite like this. lester? >> laura jarrett, thanks very much. for more i'm joined by legal analyst danny cevallos. danny, let's talk about that deposition for a minute. it clearly wasn't helpful to the former president. is that an issue for lawyers going forward as he faces other potential cases? >> yes. the lesson to be le

joe tacopina, trump's lawyer, said he did talk to him. you know, he did see truth social post by trump stop. he did make those comments in ireland. they were not really raised as an issue in this trial. you know, the reason why the judge wanted him to, stop he wants to protect the jury, and he wanted to protect the integrity of the trial so they wouldn't end up with a mistrial. you, know that's where we saw the judge even telling the jury today, you can speak to anyone you want about this, you can identify yourself, he, said i would advise you not to. he said, if you do decide to talk with someone, don't reveal the names of the other jurors because he wants to protect them. i mean, he said, i would advise you not to speak now and not for a very long time. , so it's something that he's concerned about, given the, you, know the issues even in this case. the case here is about e. jean carroll making this allegation, trump is making those statements. eugene carroll receiving numerous negative tweets, emails, said she was sleeping with a gun i

so certainly it was a kinder, gentler joe tacopina than that.xamination was about the tropes and how real sexual assault victims behaved and not everyone on the jury appeared to be buying that. donald trump has not testified and it's not clear if they will unless they've given an answer which i haven't seen. >> nor have i. >> there are video depositions that we've spoken about. the plaintiff will be playing this, carroll's lawyers. how are those -- how do you expect those to land in that courtroom? >> i think that they'll see a donald trump during the deposition who is belligerent and entitled and even impillsive as he was when he was shown the picture of e. jean carroll and her then husband and ivana trump in 1997 and he looked out and said oh, that's marla. it was not marla mapels, it was e. jean carroll which further undercuts she's not my type and too ugly to assault. seeing that snippet of his deposition will have an impact on these jurors and just how nasty he was in his attack. at one point he even says to e. jean's attorney, you're not m

>> i said it to joe tacopina yesterday. he came over to congratulate me, put out his hand, and i said, he did it, and you know it. >> reporter: the civil verdict carries no jail time, but the political fallout more complicated as some 2024 presidential hopefuls refuse to address it. >> that's something for trump to respond to. >> so i've been -- i've been pretty busy. >> reporter: former vice president pence appearing dismissive of the case in an exclusive interslew with dasha burns. >> i don't think the american people are focused on it. >> do americans believe that the allegations are true? probably most of them do just like the jury did, some will excuse it. i don't believe it's excusable and defensible. >> reporter: chris christie said to be still mulling a white house bid going even further. >> his response yesterday to me was ridiculous that he didn't even know the woman. why do we keep making excuses and why do we listen to his own words. ? and laura joining me. we heard information about one of the jurors in the cas

now, president trump's lawyer in the case, joe tacopina, he told press outside the courthouse today that, quote, he was found not liable for the rape and that's it. we're already starting to see that narrative, the narrative that only focuses on that one finding by this jury, we are already starting to see that narrative take hold in the fringes of right-wing media. and former president trump is, of course, calling the trial unfair and a witch hunt. but check out how fox news reacted to this today. >> a witch hunt is sort of an obsession that you go on forever in investigative fashion chasing after a case that doesn't really exist, whereas in this instance people brought forward evidence and it was presented to a jury not to like a panel of democrats, and they unanimously found that he's liable. >> you're being arrogant if you think that this is nothing. this is not nothing. this is sexual battery, a $5 million finding by a jury. yes, he will appeal it and then appeal as it goes up the food chain, will bring it back to the front page, back again again and again, trump "access hollywood,"

trump's attorney, joe tacopina, was asked if he had spoken with former president trump, he said he did and here's what he said next. take a listen. >> proceed, go forward, obviously, you know, he's firm in his belief, as many people are that he can not get a fair trial in new york city. based on the jury pool. and i think one could argue that that's probably an accurate assessment. based on what happened today. and, you know, again, it's something that we're confident on the appellate issues here. >> and so some of these appellate issues that he raised, he said he's going to raise with the appeals court. one that they weren't allowed to test the dna that carroll said she had on the dress she wore the day of the alleged rape. that was litigated in advance and the judge disallowed it because of delay in their going back and forth, and he was going to challenge the judge letting the "access hollywood" tape come into the trial and be played before the jury. carroll's attorneys relied on that in closing arguments. they said it was a confession. he's going to argue that should not have been

a lot of the adults in her testimony. >> let me get your thoughts on trump's defense attorney, joe tacopinalegal analyst who was in the courtroom today tweeted out during the cross examination, tacopina implied that carols tears during her testimony were fake because she never cried during her deposition or multiple media interviews. what is your reaction to that? how do you view that defense tactic? >> his tactics today were a little bit of this and a little bit of that. go back to the issue of why she didn't call the police, you know, talk to her about why she has sometimes described herself as, i'm doing fine, if this is really what happened. i think he is hoping something will stick. he asked her a lot of questions about how she behaved afterwards. why did you go to a watch party with friends? why did you watch the apprentice? he is hoping the jury will hear these questions and thinks that's not how a real rape victim would behave. if they have bought into that idea of e. jean carroll as someone who goes on with her life, i don't think any of those questions will be -- there was one mom

like joe tacopina told the, jury e.l written my friend. thank you. so what would him say about the times we're in? someone who knows and loves him more than pretty much anybody else towards me next. (seth) not to brag, but i just switched to verizon. (cecily) wow! (seth) and i got to choose the phone i wanted. for free. (cecily) not that you're bragging. (vo) choose the phone you want, on us. during our spring savings event. (cecily) on the network worth bragging about. verizon what are folks 60 and older up to these days? getting inspired! volunteering! playing pickleba...! are you tired of clean clothes that just don't smell clean? downy unstopables in-wash scent boosters keep your laundry smelling fresh waaaay longer than detergent alone. if you want laundry to smell fresh for weeks, make sure you have downy unstopables in-wash scent boosters. the subway series is taking your favorites to the next level. hold on, chuck! you can't beat the italian bmt. uh you can with double cheese and mvp vinaigrette. double cheese?!

there's some question about why joe tacopina has been the one to do this cross examination.she's had an answer for. her own attorney is trying to get out all the evidence, in anticipation of where he would go. it's a lot less heated than it was on the stand last week when she was sobbing and she was very upset. today she's very composed, calm. there aren't raised voices. it's interesting to watch the judge in this case checking tacopina repeatedly about some of his questioning, essentially telling him to move on. >> in front of the jury, obviously. >> in front of the jury. >> the judge is a really important arbiter here because he did deny the request for the mistrial. what was the substance? >> the idea was that some of his rulings hadn't been favorable to the defense team. joe tacopina filed it earlier this morning undoubtedly knowing he's not going to win it, but is laying the groundwork for appeal. they have to make a record of all the evidentiary objections that the judge didn't go for. the judge didn't describe why he was denying the miss stliel manner. it was done in

trump attorney joe tacopina knows, says the village people should be thankful that trump allowed them to get their names back in the press. in texas gun violence leaves a one year old in the hospital after police say he was shot by his four year old brother. investigators say the older child got his hands on a gun while he was at home with his mother and other adults in north houston. the one year old is said to be in good condition. his injuries are not considered life threatening. so far. no word on any charges to that incredible scene from a youth baseball game in florida, a dust devil spinning at home plate. and an umpire coming to the rescue of the young catcher. the hero is speaking out, and reporter zack wilcox has the details. i've never anything like that in my whole entire life on and off the field empire and a baseball player in wild sees plenty of breaking balls with plenty of spin, but the air around the ball spinning now that's a new one. i was looking at the pidge and then i looked to my right. and see this dust storm. the rocks, scratched up his chest in his stomach as

not joe tacopina, not her lawyers. carroll commanding the courtroom, and including the judge. the judge, the jurors, the observers, the lawyers, everyone's attention is focused on e. jean carroll. >> let's talk about e. jean carroll, some of the things joe tacopina tries to take her apart on. the fact she watched the apprentice and tweeted about the apprentice. the fact that the not screaming part is so horrendous, i don't know where he's going with that. the fact that she declared herself a fan of the show. how did she respond to things like that? >> you know, i thought that some of her admissions, joy, only made her more credible. for example, she said she had been a massive fan of the apprentice. she had never seen a competition show like that, and that she wasn't all that bothered by seeing donald trump on camera, that it wasn't until 2015 when he declared for president and his face was suddenly everywhere that she really had to confront what it meant to sort of get used to seeing him constantly. >> and so she talk

that's the real thing that joe tacopina is betting on.mination, he was extremely aggressive with this witness and so beyond his back and forth verbiage and banter with miss carroll, what he's trying to do is basically pull in independent things she did or said that are inconsistent with her being a survivor of sexual assault at the hands of former president donald trump. >> let's turn to another legal fight for trump. his attorneys yesterday argued that the manhattan district attorney's request to prevent the former president from discussing evidence in that case, this is the hush money case, that it was extremely restrictive. what do you think the judge does with this? >> well, this is a very, very complicated question for a number of reasons. on one hand, the defense is basically saying that they want to have it both ways, they basically want to be able to have their client talk about whatever it is he wishes to talk about. at the same time, what they're not saying is this could potentially influence the trial in a way that could create

his lawyer joe tacopina wrapped up a two-day cross-examination of carroll. of law enforcement svu. paula reid has been tracking this trial and joins us now. what are we expecting to happen here in what have we seen playing out not just in this cross-examination but now as they're trying to establish this pattern to back up her allegations? >> what was so interesting yesterday when i was in court is last week was very emotional. at times she answered questions through tears. yesterday was very technical. joe tacopina, what he was trying to do is present evidence to her to show a pattern of what he alleges are discrepancies between what she has said publicly and what she said in this courtroom. for example, he threw up a facebook post she put up describing herself as a massive fan of "the apprentice." she asked her followers on a facebook post if they would have sex with donald trump for $17,000. she responded saying, look, yeah, i like the show and, yes, i made jokes about having sex with donald trump. then he went on to press an issue he has pressed repeated

there may have been jurors that joe tacopina said don't like trump.process was about the truth under the law and that's what the jury found. >> i don't want to make this a political conversation but the dissonance between the moment yesterday on the front pages of all. newspapers, getting your life back. something you have been thinking about and going through for decades and at the same time looking over and seeing that that man is also the frontrunner for the republican nomination for president and you listen to republicans who were asked about this yesterday and some version of what we heard for six years prior, don't want to talk about it, dodge, say there is something corrupt about the process. how do you kind of reconcile that moment, i guess? >> here is how. yesterday the old view of what the perfect victim looks like totally changed. >> what do you mean? >> the old view of the perfect victim was a woman who always screamed, a woman who immediately reported, a woman whose life is supposed to fold up and she is never supposed to experience happi

this morning, trump attorney joe tacopina asked the judge to declare a mistrial in the e. jean carroll rape and defamation cape. the judge denied it and carroll is back on the stand. tacopina is trying to cast doubt on carroll's motivation. you received lots of love from this trial, people planning watch parties of your case, he said. >> yes, she said. you wanted more publicity when you book came out. yes, she said, my book wasn't selling. you went back to bergdorf goodman, at least 23 times after you say donald trump raped you, he said, you weren't concerned to go back? no, she said. i've made that clear that bergdorfs is not a place that i'm afraid to enter. you posted a facebook poll in 2012 asking would you have sex with trump for $17,000 if you could give the money to charity or close your eyes and he's not allowed to speak. you joked about having sex with trump for money, you said. yes, she said. in your advice column, you told me who said they were assaulted to go to the police, he said, you didn't go to the police, he said. i didn't call the police after donald tru

joe tacopina represented him in the stormy daniels case and in this case. one of the things he argued is that miss carol's memory of this incident was not accurate. she couldn't remember exactly when it happened and that he claimed that she lifted the story line from an episode of "law and order". so your thoughts as he is now on his second case that has not gone the former president's way, jonathan. >> he's a experienced trial attorney, this is fairly conventional defense. there's no way to defend donald trump without attacking the memory and the voracity of the witness. he had to do it alone. he didn't have his client with him. so you know, it was very interesting. the first clip you showed where donald trump said, you know, just anyone that knows the store, it's implausible that i or anyone else would have done that. that is a very -- a perfectly plausible defense he could have made on the stand. in the rest of the deposition, he made statements that further the narrative of the plaintiff. i'm sure played badly to this jury. i'm not too sure you can blam

meanwhile, trump's lawyer, joe tacopina, attacked e.e used the accusation to sell books and she colluded with her friends to go after trump politically. trump denies all of carroll's accusations. you have to remember that this is a civil case, a civil trial, which means the twice impeached, disgraced ex-president will not be arrested even if the jury sides with e. jean carroll. but he will be forced to pay her damages. carroll's lawyer said today this. quote, for e. jean carroll this lawsuit is not about the money. it is about getting her name back. the jury is set to begin deliberations tomorrow, and it is where we begin the hour with some of our favorite reporters and friends. "new york daily news" courts reporter molly crane newman is back. she's just outside the courthouse. also joining us, legal analyst and msnbc host katie phang is here. and with us at the table molly jong fast, special correspondent for "vanity fair" as well as the host of the "fast politics" podcast. we'll get to the fact that that guy in the depo was the countr

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joe tacopina has advised the court he's going to chip away at the credibility.d that's all he's going to do in this case. the jury will only hear certain pieces of evidence. the judge has already told them what the lawyers say in the course of a trial is not evidence. so it's a lower burden of proof, it is not a criminal case, it is a preponderance of the evidence standard and i think that's the reason why you're not seeing donald trump in trial. he not only have to defend his actions from carroll but from two other alleged victims. i don't think he'd be able to convince this jury of what the reality is, which is what he's alleged to have done. >> and they are allowed to hear donald trump describe sexual assault in his own words on the "access hollywood" tape. right, katie? >> they are. and just like the fulton county georgia case, there's a tape of the defendant, donald trump, in his own voice stating how he can just take. the last thing i'm say is on cross-examination there's this grilling of e. jean carroll about what she didn't do and how she responded, et c

donald trump's defense focused on carroll's ac, and joe tacopina, a name you may recognize -- let's go back to the wider shot. here you see. this is joe tacopina, and that is donald trump's lawyer in the other very big case, the criminal arraignment of donald trump. he's also his attorney in the civil case. i mention that. he was the person donald trump put out to close down the case before it goes to the jury. he told the jurors, the accuser's story is unbelievable fiction. he also tried to bear down on the age of this acquisition, what he called a story saying, how do you prove a negative? how do you prove you didn't do it? where were you on some unknown date some 20 years ago? he also hinted at political motives that might be used against donald trump he said, quote, they want you to hate trump enough to ignore the facts. this is a case about donald trump's conduct, not his politics, which many people may hate for various reasons, not for his many other offensive statements by themselves. there are potentially valid arguments from donald trump's attorney. these allegations have been

joe tacopina in his closing today reiterated so many things we saw in his opening and one of the thingsas we don't have to mount a defense because how do you prove a negative, this never happened, i'm even going to show you excerpts where he said emphatically this never happened. and our sole defense is going to be by cross examining their witnesses. and poking holes in all the evidence provided by the other side. >> do you think this was an additionally traumatizing event for e. jean carroll having been there in the courthouse this week? i mean it's an act of remarkable bravery for her to have brought this case if her accusations are accurate. was this case just as painful as it seemed from the outside? >> i mean, look, i'm not a psychologist, right, and i don't have any degrees to say whether someone is telling the truth but i believe her story was true for her. the emotion and intensity she experienced all throughout the trial including from the very openings when she turned around and looked joe tacopina directly in the face as to if to say to him how dare you say this about me was

. >> i said it to joe tacopina yesterday, he came over to congratulate me, he put out his hand, and i said, he did it, and you know it. and then we shook hands, and i passed by. >> as e. jean carroll noted this morning, donald trump's well established pattern of sexual misconduct and depredations should be as obvious at to trump's lawyers should've been to the nine jurors who took just four hours to find the ex president civilly liable for sexual battery yesterday. there is one group of people who will not acknowledge the obvious. it's the republicans who want to defeat trump in 2024. >> i really can't comment on a judgment in a civil case. i have no knowledge of those matters. in my four and a half serving alongside the president i never heard or witnessed behavior of that nature. >> i'm not going to get into that. that's something for trump to respond to. i think the focus has to be not to be distracted. it's why we've got to leave the baggage and negativity behind. we've got to focus on what people are talking about. >> i've been pretty busy. i know there's different stuff in the n

>> so, joe tacopina, it was interesting in court, he went over and shook e. jean carroll's hand, her attorneys hand. given that this was such a hard-fought battle this was -- >> that's a classy move. >> a very classy move, and he said afterwards, none of this is personal. and he essentially respected them and their lawyering. so, they've come out and said they are going to appeal. tacopina spoke to reporters afterwards. here's what he said. >> obviously, you know, he's affirming his belief, as many people, art that he cannot get a fair trial in new york city. , beast on the jury pool. and i think one could argue that's probably an accurate assessment, based on what happened today. and you know, again, it's something that, you know, we're very confident on the appellate issues here. >> so, tacopina had spoken to us after he got off the phone with donald trump. so, there he is telegraphing what trump and he had just discuss. so, he was talk about these appellate issues. there are a couple things they're looking to appeal. one of it is what they could not get in

i think joe tacopina, he is an experienced lawyer. he is skilled. jury clearly did, when you sit down and think about them and pick them apart, they can't all be true. if none of them -- if they can't all be true, then none are true. i think it didn't take the jury long to figure that out. >> was e. jean confident? she seems like someone very sort of humble, doesn't get ahead of a moment. was she -- did she have an expectation for what was going to happen yesterday? >> honestly, after four or five years of preparing for that day, i think she was cautiously pessimistic. i think she was really feeling like, okay, if it doesn't work, we will put on our lipstick, we will get a new pair of tights and we will do it again. i think this is very overwhelming in the best, best way. i mean, she put a dent -- i thought of this last night. i haven't said it. you may have heard me. she put a dent in his teflon. there has never been any. >> totally. totally. >> this is forever. >> the likes of mueller have tried. i asked that question because i think some of the p

today she faced cross examination by trump attorney joe tacopina. tacopina concluded a cross examination late today. we don't have cameras in the courtroom. under traditional new york rules. the focus we're told inside based on the information we have is an attack on her credibility. he basically through the questioning suggested that this was a way for her to use this case or these allegations to seek attention, status and even money. he asked about the income she's made as an vice columnist. he questioned why she went to social events with antitrump figures around the court appearances. he asked about her exchanges with kathy griffin. tacopina questioning why carroll did not call police about what she alleges was the assault at the time. carroll's response is i am a member of the silent generation. women like me were taught and trained to keep our chins up and to not complain. at another point tacopina asked about a conversation with george conway, a lawyer who's known to be also critical of trump trying to suggest that basically maybe conway had

joe tacopina did a "great " job. mr. not to present, yet i don't have any questions other than one. are you to bring a claim against donald trump? her answer was no. that is it. we are here to deal with a case against ms. carroll, and you are talking to me as if donald trump was convicted of , when he was actually cleared of it. >> i am not talking -- >> okay, i am not talking to you and if he was convicted of anything. this was a civil trial. this was specifically about a sexual assault today and defamation. before i let you go -- >> right, it was money. back my final question to you is i mentioned that there are 15 women altogether who have alleged that donald trump sexually harassed or assaulted them. are you concerned that more of this -- >>:, are we talking about 2015? >> all told, all told, not that you have received complaints, that have become public. are you concerned that this case -- >> are you talking about 2016? is that the situation we are at right now? >> are you concerned that the case we saw today, that it may be just the beginning, that other criminal action could

joe tacopina today reiterated so many of the same things we saw in the opening.ove a negative? this never happen. he said it never happened. i'll even show you and perpetrates where he says emphatically, this never happened. therefore, we're not putting on a defense. our sole defense is by cross examining their witnesses. we can't prove that something that didn't happen didn't happen zblfl so our whole defense is that it didn't happen regardless of what evidence there is. >> and poking holes in all the evidence provided by the other side. >> do you think this was an additionally traumatizing event for e. jean carroll, having been in the courthouse this week? an act of remarkable bravery to have brought there case if the accusations were accurate. was this case just as painful as it seemed from the outside? >> look, i'm not a psychologist and i don't have any degrees that would allow me to say if someone is malingering or telling the truth. i believe her story was true. the emotion she showed through the whole trial including the opening when's she looked joe taco

joe, okay. the court, that may well prove to be the case, but i will wait and see. mr. tacopina, and then the court, i'm not implying dishonesty on your part. ta tacopina, no, i know you're not. i know you're not, but you understand what i am dealing with. and the judge goes on to say, joyce, that he's going out of his way to run the trial fairly and appropriately and to make sure both sides have a fully fair trial. do you read that as the judge saying, you're not going to try to catch me on appeal and say you didn't get every opportunity to testify, because he's literally in europe, a couple of days ago saying i'm going to come back and face my accuser, yet his lawyer says no he's not. >> this is the judge making every effort to hold trump accountable. in a civil case, e. jean carroll could have subpoenaed trump to testify. her lawyers chose not to, i think likely because the deposition testimony is just so startlingly good for them. trump can voluntarily choose to testify if he wants to. he did not. he relinquished that right, but after he made those comments on the golf cours

trump's attorney joe tacopina telling reporters after court today that that tape is the possible grounds for the forthcoming appeal. >> -- the access hollywood case tape should not have come into this. case there were -- beyond the pale. >> in his deposition mr. trump also confused a photo of carroll, who he had said was not his type, for his ex-wife, marla maples. >> that's my wife. >> -- >> a striking moment tacopina never addressed at trial. >> we are also following another legal bombshell this evening. sources tell nbc news that new york republican george santos has been charged with federal offenses. nbc has also learned that he will appear in federal court on long island tomorrow. santos has admitted to lying about parts of his background and has been the subject of multiple investigations. and tonight, house minority leader kevin mccarthy had this reaction to the news about george santos. >> in america you're isn't innocent until proven guilty. but what we have watched and heard past behavior here to, when there was another indictment -- i never put santos on a new committee. that

joe tacopina is closing today reiterated so many of the same things we saw from him in the opening.was, we don't have to mount a defense, because how do you prove a negative. this never happened. he said it never happened. i am even going to show you excerpts from his deposition where he says emphatically this never happened. and therefore, we're not putting on the defense, our sole defense is going to be by cross examining the witnesses, because we can't prove that something didn't happen didn't happen. >> so, our sole defense is his assertion that it didn't happen, ignore this, whatever evidence the other side provided. >> and close all the evidence provided by the other side. >> do you think that this wasn't additionally traumatizing event for e. jean carroll, having been there in the courthouse this week? i mean, it's an active remark of bravery to bring this case, for accusations are accurate. was this case as painful as it seemed from the outside? >> look, i'm not a psychologist, right? and i don't have any degrees that would allow me to say whether this woman is telling the t

trump's lawyer, joe tacopina, has a problem. he has to undermine the credibility of e.d the two witnesses. and lisa birnbach's testimony will be difficult. carroll told her about the rape and she explained why a traumatized carroll refused to report it to police at the time. she doesn't have a motive to lie about her conversation to know that she is a democrat, but that's not enough to say she is lying under oath. >> i have about 30 seconds. you called tacopina a bull in a china shop so far in his approach. how would you have handled this differently? >> do you remember the johnny depp/amber herd case? amber herd said she was a victim of physical abuse. who do they have cross-examining her? camilla vasquez. you have a guy that looks like he's out of the movies and a bull in a china shop. i don't think in a post-#metoo era that's a good look. >> ron allen, i appreciate your reporting, as well. that's going to do it for us today. thanks for being here. see you back here tomorrow, same time, same place. reporting from new york, i'm ana cabrera. >>> jose diaz picks up right

a lot of argumentative questions from joe tacopina, and a lot of efforts by the plaintiff successfullyquestioning. he's definitely getting some small admissions from e. jean carroll. for example, that she made 18 purchases at burgdorf goodman between -- i'm sorry, 23 purchases in an 18-year period of time that post dated the alleged assault or, for example, that she posted on facebook that she was a massive fan of "the apprentice." he's trying to show that she wasn't so traumatized by whatever happened between she and donald trump that she couldn't have gone to bergdorf's. when he tried to ask her why she didn't call police. she said i am a member of the silent generation, jose. >> and so, lisa, what would be -- i'm just thinking from a legal perspective for tacopina to be talking about whether she liked "the apprentice" or whether she went back and purchased things after the alleged incident, what would be the legal logic behind that line? >> i think he's trying to show, jose that if she were truly sexually assaulted by donald trump she would have a problem revisiting the scene of the

the president's lawyer, joe tacopina is talking to reporters. >> there's plenty of issues to appeal. happens. we're one sense gratified and some people in this camp are very happy that, you know, the rape claim was rejected. i'm not. i'm happy about that but not happy he was found liable. >> [question inaudible] >> he's ready to move forward. he wants to fight this on appeal. he was successful in one appeal before with judge kaplan and thinks he will be successful on the second one. he's got a town hall tomorrow night. he's moving forward as he always does. >> is this going to derail -- >> nope. >> [question inaudible] >> i don't think so. he seems to be a survivor and move forward and will continue to move forward. again, this case will be up on appeal. we'll see what happens. >> what did you think about the anonymous jury? you think it was fair? >> no, i didn't, actually. you know, there's been mafia cases where there's anonymous juries but the lawyers get to know who the juror ares. we didn't even know who they are. in this case a strong reaction people would have to politicians p

joe tacopina, an attorney for the former president, doubling down on the defense theory that carroll made up her sexual assault accusation against mr. trump to gain notoriety, playing this old interview on cnn for the jury, where she describes bumping into mr. trump at bergdorf goodman and helping him pick out a gift. >> he was going to get lingerie i'm like, i could dine out forever on this story. >> reporter: today carroll told the jury it was such a new york story and such a happy story, and then of course it turned tragic she says the former president raped her in the dressing room, an allegation the defense again tried to undermine monday by saying she never tried to call the police, despite telling others in her advice column to do so carroll explaining in court, i'm a member of the silent generation. women like me were taught to keep our chins up and not complain tacopina also confronting carroll with old posts on facebook years after she said she was assaulted where she calls herself a, quote, massive fan of mr. trump's tv show "the apprentice." but carroll told the jury she

and then once the judge left and the jury left, joe tacopina came over and shook her hand and the attorney's, and it was cordial, and very respectful, and so trump's attorney shaking e. jean carroll's hand. and the judge said that they could talk to the press if they wanted to, but he said that if they chose to, which he advised them not to, to not give the identity of any other jurors, and he made the jury anonymous, because he was concerned about the public statements that the former president has said and he took a precaution in the case, and so it is up to the jurors to see if they wanted to discuss how they came to this cop collusion, jim. >> i wanted to point out that donald trump has apparently sent out a message on truth social. it is in all caps claiming not to know who e. jean carroll s and he calls verdict a disgrace and he says a continuation of the greatest witch hunt of all time, and the former president is clearly not thrilled of this verdict, and found him liable for roughly $5 million of damages. >> witch hunt is the phrase he has used of wrongdoing, and the not knowing some

joe tacopina took a playbook from her generation to attack her. you didn't scream, you didn't go to the police, and i think we have had a really national discussion about no, women don't scream when they're having somebody stuff their fingers up inside their body when they don't want it. no, women don't go to the police. and this -- joe tacopina proved every reason why they don't go to the police. because they're abused in the public, and trump proved that as well. it's opened up a discussion that's exciting for me as somebody who has tried a lot of sex crimes cases and i want victims to feel empowered. i think it's been very good. it's going to be very difficult for lawyers after this or it's more difficult for them to try to use this playbook from the '70s. >> one of the things that did surprise me, this is a jury with mostly men. six men and three women, the women were 55, 62, and 64 years of age. they were getting closer to the age of the victim here. the men were 26, 31, 37, 46, 60, and one of unknown age. a jury of twice as many men as women

woman is raped in the very same department store, bergdorf goodman and in the dressing room, and joe tacopina looked incredulous at the jury and said you gotta be kidding me. lawsuit is one of a slew of recent cases found under a new law in new york state call the adult survivors act that allows alleged sexual assault victims to seek justice in decades old cases. and so what the adult survivors act does is it creates a one year window where victims of sexual assault when it happened in new york can hold their accuser accountable. and it doesn't matter when the assault happened. it could have been 50 or 60 years ago. the case will soon be in the jury's hands. but the outcome may have little impact on trump's political future. he could be held liable of both defamation and battery or one or the other or or neither. the jury could have a verdict as early as tomorrow. abc news will have continuing coverage of the case coming up lapse of luxury were behind the scenes of the miami grand prix. some call the gala of sports. with hiv. i learned i could stay undetectable with fewer medicines. that's wh