now let's check in with john avlon in new york. john, what are your thoughts? i'm curious about your thoughts of lobbying dollars going from industries to committees that regulate those industries. >> well, the growth of lobbying over the past decade in particular has been a real problem. many people point to it for not just the increased spending that we've seen but things like the lobbying that has watered down the volcker rule. much of it was pursued by jpmorgan chase. so lobbyists do have their thumb on the scale. and it's a growing problem in washington, and it's contributed to a lot of the frustration people feel at home. the sense washington isn't working. lobbyists are part of the reason why. >> so do you think, john, that we'll be able to get reforms or what's your sense? >> well, look, follow the money. that's one of the tougher things to do. certainly in this specific case calling for a hearing is a step in the right direction. the question is, is it not just about asking regulators what went wrong but bringing members of jpmorgan chase. this is all

and john avlon. good to have both of you with us. david walker, let me just start with you.some really terrifying numbers here. first of all, you have a number for our overall debt obligations which makes the $15.7 trillion formal debt number look like peanuts, and you note our financial hole in this country is growing at the mere rate of $10 million a minute. >> that's correct, erin. if you look at the financial statements, the u.s. government for september 30, 2011, our total liabilities of unfunded promises for social security, medicare, et cetera, were $65.5 trillion. in addition, if you look at the latest trustees report which came out two or three weeks ago, i expect that's going to rise to about $70 trillion by september 30, 2012. and when you do the numbers, the federal financial hole is growing by over $10 million a minute, 365 days a year. >> john avlon, is this something that they can do as john boehner heroically said before the election? is there any hope? because by the way, lame duck, six weeks after between then and the end of the year. come on. >> the whole

john avlon is here, michelle goldberg and hoa communications director for rick santorum. this is a big headline. this is a -- this is a blow, a slap. >> this is a bombshell result, a huge margin for richard mourdock. it's important to remember these are most possible not in the general election where mourdock's appeal would have alienated than they attracted, but in a primary in may. but a significant blow back against the centrists in the senate who believe in reaching across the aisle. you see the ads that murdoch was running, saying the time for collegiality was over. it may work with the far right base, but it will alienate the centrists in the general. >> i don't think the issue is that aren't centrists in washington, but there aren't sen tris republicans. we talk about it as if it's symmetrical problem with polarization. norm orstein points out in the book, a center left democratic party and a republican party as far to the right in 100 years. so i think this is another sign of the radicalization, a kind of unprecedented radicalization of the republican party. >> ho

. >> well, dimon got to keep his chairman title and a pay package that netted him $23 million john avlonlon is with us. it's unclear whether everyone voted today or a lot of votes had come in before the incident for the pay package, but do you think that was a possible big mistake that he's made as he tries to kind of climb out of this hole and rebuild the reputation for the company? >> well, he obviously didn't feel the pressure to do that. and didn't feel that that gesture would be necessary to either publicly or privately reassure markets or shareholders. but he had one of the strongest reputations in the banking business. nationally really. so the real problem for jpmorgan chase and jamie dimon here is that the credibility they have taken into arguments going forward has been fundamentally compromised by this loss. but clearly he did not feel he had to make confessions to that today at the shareholders meeting. >> and poppy harlow reported it was sort of a 9:1 margin in favor of the pay package. so it seems like the shareholders were behind mr. dimon. but can you explain, paul, why t

none of us investors are being successful if we don't make the businesses successful. >> john avlon, the problem in all of this for mitt romney is, and it seems to me why aren't they coming out with thibault. why did i find it? i can see why corey book mother is an ardent democrat and believed in president obama also has positive things to say about private equity. the two things are not mutually exclusive, right? >> they're not at all. especially if you're trying to turn around a city or state and you need investors in companies that are in danger of going bankrupt, especially if they have been struggling in your city for a long time. the point of this line of argument, the president is drawing a clear line in the sand saying this is what the election is going to be about. it isn't simply about trashing private equity, it's about appealing to middle class voters who have been feeling squeezed for decades. squeezed by big government and they see high finance coming in and possibly presep tating a massive economic downturn. it's about whether or not mitt romney as a former head of bai

john avlon is here and tim punk is in washington. john avlon, pretty interesting quote there.does seem to fly in the face of "the washington post" story in that one individual's case. >> that's right. and in that one individual incident. i think that's what's isn't it cant. obviously his overall impression of mitt romney may be different than mitt romney's worst moment in high school. none of us are the sum total of our worst moments, but what's fascinating is why it's rippling so much. it's because romney doesn't have a character narrative into a young man and in -- and this sticks because it seems to pull back the curtain a bit in a way that seems horrifically revealing. not that this is indicative of his values now -- >> people are starving for mitt romney, the man. >> we all do stupid things in high school. but we don't all do stupid things of this nature, pinning down a kid and cutting off his hair because he's different and that's why it's resonating now. >> and "the washington post" article came out the day after the president's announcement that he supports same-sex ma

john avlon and reihan salam joins us. maybe some of the things that the president said didn't add up to the military experts, but it's a poignant speech and sean said for a third of his life we were at war. that was beautifully put. >> that was an extraordinary point. world war ii lasted for four years. we have been at war for ten. he talked about the responsible end of the war, but the terms of the debate on al qaeda where it began in afghanistan, where it began. that is a powerful argument that's going to resonate with the american people and it's an achievable goal as well. because it's more modest essentially than some of the goals that have been set out years previous. >> reihan, i thought he was trying to be specific. that it's about al qaeda. nothing else. and in fact, went so far -- i was a little surprised in a national speech to say i'm not trying to completely eradicate the taliban. if some of you want to work with us, that's okay. on obviously that's a pragmatic thing. >> i see a strong historical parallel her

john avlon, risky or not risky? >> this was considerable political risk. there's no question.ou look at some of the swing states at play in this election. north carolina, which last night overwhelmingly voted to ban same-sex marriage. virginia, even ohio, pennsylvania, so this is high stakes. but this is also moments where character is revealed. you know? i'm reminded about a quick story of lyndon johnson when his advisers told him not to do civil rights after becoming president because it wasn't pragmatic. he said what the hell is the presidency for? i think we just had one of those moments. >> here are the differences. lyndon johnson signed a law passed by congress. we talked about all these national polls showing that the majority of americans support same-sex marriage, yet there have been 32 referendums where the voters have gone to the polls. same-sex marriage supporters are 0 for 32. >> there's the political risk. >> it's hard to sit here and say what a poll says when really in politics, votes matter. >> people are not pro the issue. >> we have 2.1 million people who vot

. >> john avlon, jamaal simmons, i have to say, you know, cory spoke from his heart on "meet the press'm sure what he would say in the youtube in a thoughtful and considerate manner this should be discussed. if you're watching, cory, maybe i got it wrong but that's my bet. the point is it is rather nauseating. >> yeah. look, the reason there was all this outcry is because he took the risk of breaking from partisan talking points and you're not supposed to do that but that's what people do when they have the courage to sort of say what they really think. >> he went out to actually say why private equity contributes to -- >> guess what? there is a positive and minus. but the point is that the overwhelming tide of negative ads intentionally polarizing that people are already being subjected to does disgust people, it is nauseating, it is what people hate about politics. for calling that out all of a sudden he gets slammed by some folks for being disloyal. it is also called telling the truth. >> john, people hate negative politics but they also really, really respond to it. negative politi

. >> john avlon is here and so is reihan salam who as of tonight is a cnn contributor and we love it. >> thank you very much. >> the light's bright. he's blinking. thank you very much, erin. i've never seen you so reserved. >> well, i'm very grateful to you guys and i love being on the show and i look forward to jousting with you and my colleagues, you know, for many days to come. days and months to come. >> we love having you. michael waldman is here too. former speechwriter. michael, i have to just ask you because you know joe biden and have worked obviously with many democrats here. he is a man of passion. but that was true passion. >> that was true passion. i think he really feels it. i think he really is offended in a way by the vision of how the economy works. that governor romney has put out both with his record but also with his economic plan. and when you see that kind of passion, it's a political question of does it come off as very hot. but i think he really meant it and i think you'll hear the democrats pound this theme, pound it, pound it over and over and over again. two

john avlon, reihan salam and jamal simmons is with me right now.itt romney probably pretty upset right now. >> as well he should be. you remember the pitch for the dinner with trump and romney was the idea of reaching out to donors or making donations as small as $3. >> right. you win a dinner or something like that. >> who knows what would be served at this dinner. some trump stew perhaps. you are looking at $3 donations and mitt romney has not attracted small dollar donations. the reason the donations are important is partly because those are voters who say i buy into this campaign. i'm vested in the campaign. and then you have a list of people who are more active and engaged supporters. you can use that list for a variety of reasons. is donald trump the best way to gin up and active and engaged voters? >> he's not. that was theory is that he would help raise money for the campaign. these low dollar donors. here is the point. donald trump made himself completely radioactive to the romney campaign. he's stepping all over his story. a guy whose nam

but the spending is going to be insane, john avlon.een more than $2 billion, super pac spending. $133 million. it's pretty unbelievable. >> it already is insane. >> how do you get a clean, pleasant election when you've got all this money. and a lot of it kind of the hide behind the fig leaf kind of money. right? >> re. >> i didn't say something nasty, it was the super pac. >> there's going to be a tsunami of sleaze coming across our air waves for next six or seven months. >> tsunami of sleaze? i love it. >> it's going to be because of super pac money. anybody that thinks it would have been spent on positive ads, get real. this is going to be ugly, it's going to be negative, it's going to be on both sides. already we've seen 70% of the ads this year so far have been negative. only 9% positive. outside money, five times what it was when president bush was running for re-election. we've got a problem, people, and it's going to degrade our civil discourse. it already has. >> will this be something that back fires on one or both of the cand

ed conner is former manager director of bain capital and author of "unintended consequences" and john avlon joins me as well. thanks to both of you. i really love the richard gere thing. got to get "pretty women" references in. >> always a win. >> ed, let me start with you. you spent a long time at bain. you are an unapologetic defender of free market capitalism. obviously your book takes aim at that, but can you just answer the fundamental question here. mitt romney is trying to say he created jobs, but let's be clear here, his number one goal had nothing to do with creating jobs, right? >> i think that's a cartoonish portrayal of business. people want to forget. people want to pretend the only thing business is doing is working for investors but what's left out of that, the half truth is businesses are working for customers. customers decide what businesses are going to be successful, whether businesses grow or don't grow. in the end if you satisfy the customer, you will end up satisfying the investor. but you can't jump straight to the investor without first working for the customer. >>