was quoted so often during the debates over the 14th amendment as you describe in your book on john bingham james madison of the 14th amendment and then in a moment, i'm gonna ask you walter what the influence of this decision was on chief. justice chase during the civil war so bush road road washington says in 1823. we feel no hesitation and confining these expressions to privileges and immunities which are in their nature fundamental which belong of right to the citizens of all three governments what these fundamental principles are it would perhaps be more tedious than difficult to enumerate they may however and this is the sentence that was always quoted be comprehended under the following general heads protection by the government the enjoyment of life and liberty with the right to acquire and possess property of every kind and to pursue and obtain happiness and safety subject nevertheless to such restraints as the government. they just they prescribed for the general good as a whole. i'm speaking with excitement here because i'd forgotten because i haven't read this pause for a bit th

congress about what they understood the 13th amendment to be able to do with the exception of john bingham and a couple of other, you know, hardline antebellum federalists who had a conception of congressional power that was more limited the idea. was that the 13th amendments simply by flushing slavery would enable the creation of republican citizenship without any further constitutional amendments the 14th amendment was a recognition both of the limitations of the 13th amendment as well as an effort to go above and beyond the 13th amendment in actively creating citizenship this by the way is exemplifies why it has been so wonderful to collaborate with evan on this book as a co-author because this is the kind of interaction we have all the time in writing this book. i don't disagree with a word that evan just said i didn't disagree with it. he isn't that he's just persuaded me but i don't disagree with the word. he said but notice i expressed myself in one way and then he came back and did a bit of editing into how i expressed myself and this is how we work together for i don't know maybe