john cox, i just threw a lot at you. ion to get information, to handle the families and to figure out who is onboard that plane. john, are you with us? lost john cox. that's okay. we're working still -- go ahead, mike. >> if we could get a google map somehow of the area between barcelonaette and digne, france. if we can get a -- we're working on getting a map of that area. but it sounds as if it is an extraordinarily remote area in the south of france in the french alps. and mika just indicated that there have been reports of some debris being found in barsonette. not barcelona. barcelonette. it would be helpful to find out where those two town i assume they're towns, are in relation to the exact crash site itself. >> again, what we're looking at here and where all the questions are really centered on in terms of covering this tragedy is exactly what happened when that distress call came in what caused this plane to disappear from radar and desscent. and experts who talk much more than us about this type of plane which ha

and john cox is we me and tom costello in our news room. tom, john just pointed out the very careful briefing from the french aviation official to all questions about the possibility of an attack from the voice recorder information. he said, i have zero information on that hypothesis. >> yeah i think it was very clear that he was trying to avoid hypothesizing on any scenario whatsoever. other than to say that the wreckage is not in any way consistent with a midair explosion. that seems obvious that this plane did, in fact crash into a mountainside. and it appears the plane was on a very deliberate and programmed descent all the way down. and there was no deviation from it. the flight went straight into a mountain. i thought that it was also important to note and just underscore that the recording from the first box that they now have recovered, while the box is significantly damaged, they can say it's a digital recording and they have had success in getting some of that data off of the digital recording. so he would not characterize what he

captain john cox is an msnbc analyst and joins us by phone. tell us about that runway and what the plane was likely experiencing given the weather? >> well the runway is about 7,000 feet long both of the runways in laguardia are pretty much the same length. and laguardia is considered what i would call reasonably short airport, it's one that pilots were very aware of the need to get the airplane on the ground and get it stopped, particularly in conditions where you have ice and snow involved. it is a place because of the surrounding environment that you put the airplane on the ground and get it stopped. the md-83, this type of aircraft has been in service for many many years. it's a very proven design. the shall this is the time of landing they would have made numerous times before. it's something professional pilots deal with with some regularity. the best news is that the evacuation appears to have gone smoothly. this is something airline crews train for and it looks like the training paid off. >> with the amount of ice and snow on the runwa

tom costello is in our washington newsroom and retired airline pilot and msnbc aviation analyst john cox stands by as well. first to you keir the families have arrived and come from barcelona and dusseldorf embarkation and destination of this doomed flight. tell us what you know the latest from the investigation as well. >> reporter: well, andrea i just was down the road here watching those families arrive at what i guess you could describe as the closest place they can get to to the crash site because it is so difficult to reach apart from in the helicopters that you can hear flying overhead. really gets you to stand and see people on these buses that are being bussed around see faces of these families who a week ago had no idea this was going to happen to them. that their relatives were going to go through this. now they are being taken around can't even get to the place where their loved ones loved ones final resting place. it's just absolutely well it takes your breath away. i have to tell you, the place where the plane went down is in this mountain range behind me. you can see it in

john cox, as we look at the protocol of what is mandatory for pilots here in the u.s.r pilots in europe and elsewhere? >> well europe utilizes a different system than the u.s. does. they have a system where somebody enters into a program. they're extensively tested evaluated, then they're brought into a training program where they're taught to fly the airline's way to fly airplanes from day one. it's much more similar to the u.s. military's approach. the u.s. military has very low-time pilots flying very very highly sophisticated airplanes, even into combat. so this type of training can produce high-quality aviators in a short period of flight hours. in addition, the licensing process that the europeans use is somewhat different. they use a multicrew license system. that means that unlike the u.s. system where you're first a private pilot, then an instrument rating you learn to fly twin-engine airplanes, finally a commercial license, then up to the airline standard of an airline transport pilot certificate. all of this is folded in. the training is different. as a resu

greg and john cox, thank you very much. come back in the next hour, that will be great. thank you very much. >>> up next from one prison to the another, former taliban captain bowe bergdahl could spend leaf behind bars for allegedly deserting his post in afghanistan and endangering his soldiers. we go live. [ male announcer ] legalzoom has helped start over 1 million businesses. if you have a business idea, we have a personalized legal solution that's right for you. with easy step-by-step guidance, we're here to help you turn your dream into a reality. start your business today with legalzoom. [ female announcer ] when you're ready to take skincare to the next level you're ready for roc®. new roc® multi correxion® has an exclusive 5 in 1 formula. it's clinically proven to hydrate dryness, illuminate dullness lift sagging diminish the look of dark spots and smooth the appearance of wrinkles. together these 5 elements create ageless looking skin. roc® multi correxion® 5 in 1. it's high performance skincare™ only from roc®. ♪

let's bring in analyst john cox. john, with a welcome to you. let's talk about the depression and the mental stability of mr. lubitz here. how do airlines in this country and around the world go about certifying the health and mental well-being of their pilots? >> well alex when a candidate shows up for employment with the airline as a pilot, you go through a whole bat of tests, academic, practical, and medical and psychological. so there's a pretty good indication of how well this individual will fit into the airline. and as they go through training they are carefully evaluated by instructor pilots and pilots that they fly with. once they're qualified and they're flying what ends up happening for the most part is what's known as a peer review. that is pilots work very closely with each other. you're on the road you're traveling together you're working in close physical proximity to each other. and if someone is not meeting the standard or seems preoccupied, it is not uncommon that one of the pilots will ask the other, are you doing okay? do you

captain john cox flew the a opini-320 and spent 20 years in safety and crash investigations. let's pick up where tom left off there. first of all the plane gets to 30,000 feet. it reaches its cruising altitude. is that a time where it would be unusual for the pilot to leave the cockpit and secondly, do you know about the protocol in europe in terms of the member of a flight crew, taking that pilot's place in the cockpit? >> well, first, it would be a normal time for somebody with a physiological need, once the airplane attained its cruise altitude. if they're going back to the lavatory, that's a good time to do it. the work load drop down and you know as you approach your destination, in this case, dusseldorf that the work load is going to increase. it makes sense as far as the timing goes. the protocols in europe for security requirements and how the cockpits -- the protocol for managing a pilot coming oust a cock hit and who comes in, in most cases a flight attendant will come in so there are two people in the flight deck. as far as, was this required of this operator, the

joining me now is former ntsb investigator greg fife and ceo of safety operating systems john cox. thank you, gentlemen, for joining us. greg, let me start with you. what do we know now about what brought this plane don't? >> right now, we don't have a lot of valid information. we have a lot of speculation. there's information on the internet with regard to the flight path, the altitudes, and times. but until they read a flight data recorder, we won't have a solid story line to talk about, and that will probably happen depending on which flight data recorder they did recover, within the next 24 to 48 hours. right now, we don't have a lot of solid information other than the aircraft attained the crew's altitude of 38,000 feet and then the descent portion of that flight looked to be controlled. that's the speed at which the airplane was coming down as far as its vertical rate and its time and distance looked to be normal. where it becomes abnormal is that the airplane continued to descend into an area of high terrain. >> there were either very involved with something with the airplan

i want to bring in msnbc aviation analyst john cox and faa licensed commercial pilot anthony roman. thanks for being with me. john what does all of this new information tell you? i mean the fact that bill neely said the prosecutor says under no circumstances do they believe it's terrorism but really don't know much more right now? >> no they don't. the motives are something that the criminal investigations, they will delve into in great depth. what we know based on what the prosecutor said is that this individual took a deliberate act in all likelihood using the auto flight system and flew the airplane into the ground killing everybody onboard. for a professional pilot to do such a thing is almost incomprehensible to me. i'm struggling even conceptionally to get my head around it and i just -- i find it unimaginable. and so it's -- the entire focusen the investigation now shifts from an accident investigation, this was not an accident. into a criminal investigation. and i think it will proceed forward that light from here going forward. >> and anthony, i want to play more of what tha

captain john cox once flew the a-320. >> something obviously occurred within just a few minutes at 38,000 they needed to come down and xa exactly that is i don't know. >> reporter: the airbus a-320 is among the world's most heavily used planes more than 6,000 flying. a computerized plane with a good safety record. in december an airasia a-320 crashed into the java sea killing 162 on board. the cause is still under investigation. in 2009 the miracle on the hudson in new york caused by a bird strike everyone survived thanks to some expert piloting. this particular plane was 24 years old, it had just gone through a maintenance check the day before. we can tell you the priority for french investigators is to actually listen to the cockpit voice recorder and analyze flight data recorder. the hundreds of pieces of data on the flight data recorder and only then will they be able to say what happened to this plane. there clearly is not much in the way of evidence on the ground. on the cockpit voice recorder they will hear the pilots talking to each other. it will tell them an awful lot t. flight

joining us is tom hatter a former ntsb director of aviation safety and analyst john cox, a former u.s. airways captain and ceo of safety operations. and thank you for being --. and tom, if i could start with you. and there was no distress signal given and how unusual that to occur when a crash of this type happens? >> it is not terribly unusual. the crew will first fly the airplane and communicate when they can. the indication is something happened catastrophically. whether it is a fire or rapid depressionde de -- depressioncompression. and why this happened hopefully we'll get the voice recorder and we'll determine that. and what happens is the crew is busy and they don't make a call at the moment. >> and from the time this occurred to the moment of impact a few minutes within that time period it seems the plane stayed on the normal route versus veering right or left to an airport. does this stick out to you as unusual? does that leave a question mark in your head? >> not necessarily. i think that it says that the airplane quite possibly was still on the auto pilot and using the flig

joining us now from tampa is msnbc aviation analyst and former airline captain john cox. here at the table is retired senior british officer and pilot with more than 3,000 hours in the air, mikey kay. john i'll start with you. we're talking about the post-9/11 protocol put in place to keep us all safe. then something like this happens. how quickly is it going to take for everyone to get on the same page here to make sure that, you know maybe we need two pilots in the cockpit at all times? >> well i think first we need to get the right people in the room, and i think that you're going to see that as one of the recommendations that will come out of the investigation, is to put together an industry task force of regulators manufacturers, operators, pilot unions get them together and to recognize and see what if any, but what changes need to be made in the protocols for dealings with pilots going through the secure door in flight. there are a variety of them around the world, and i suspect this task force, this specialized group of experts will be able to make recommendations

captain john cox has spent more than 20 years in safety and crash investigations. >> it's a loud warning and one that pilots take very seriously. that adds a little bit of additional evidence to the crew being incapacitated. >> reporter: french investigators are now analyzing the sounds and voices recovered from the cockpit voice recorder. but they need the flight data recorder to unravel what happened to the plane and in the cockpit, a process that could take weeks. >> translator: we're not in a position to give the slightest explanation as to why this plane began to descend, unfortunately, until it slammed into the mountainside. >> reporter: we still don't know if the crew programmed the plane to descend from 38,000 feet. if so, why didn't they program an end to the descent? and why did the crew fail to respond to radio calls from callers concerned about the descent. both pilots were trained by lufthansa. the plane was checked on monday and another captain who flew the plane on monday said it performed perfectly. also today, clarification on a 30-minute delay that flight took just befo

captain john cox once flew the a320. >> something obviously occurred that said as soon as they got to 38,000, within just a few minutes, they needed to come down. and what exactly that is, i don't know. >> reporter: the airbus a320 is one of the most heavily used planes. more than 6,000 flying. a computerized plane with a very good safety record. but there have been some recent high-profile accidents. in december an airasia a-320 crashed into the java sea killing 162 on board. the cause is still under investigation. in 2009, the miracle on the hudson in new york caused by a bird strike. everyone survived thanks to expert piloting. this particular airbus a320 was just 24 years old, had just gone through a maintenance check yesterday. they have to look at what the cockpit voice recorder says and the flight data recorder. those two black boxes may be the tale to what happened during this flight. >> tom costello, thank you. we're learning more tonight about who was onboard the plane, including that large group of german high school students on their way home from barcelona. nbc's katy tur

captain john cox once flew the a320. >> something obviously occurred that said as soon as they got to 38,000, within just a few minutes, they needed to come down. xat exactly that is i don't know. >> the airbus a320 is among the world's most heavily used planes more than 6,000 flying. a computerized plane with a very good safety record but there have been recent high-profile accidents. in december an airasia a320 crashed into the java sea killing 162 on board. the cause is still under investigation. in 2009 the miracle on the hudson in new york b caused by a bird strike. everyone survived thanks to some expert piloting. this particular plane was 24 years old, had just gone through a maintenance check the day before. we can tell you that the priority for french investigators is to actually listen to the cockpit voice recorder and analyze flight data recorder. the hundreds of pieces of data on the flight data recorder. only then will they be able to say what happened to this plane because there clearly is not much in the way of evidence on the ground. on the cockpit voice recorder they'

captain john cox once flew the a320. >> something must have occurred when they got to 38,000 they needed to come down. and what exactly that is, i don't know. >> reporter: the airbus a320 is one of the most heavily used planes. more than 6,000 flying. a computerized plane with a very good record. in december an air asia a320 crashed into the java sea killing 162 onboard. the cause is still under investigation. in 20009 the miracle on the hudson in new york caused by a bird strike. everyone survived thanks to expert piloting. this plane was 24 years old. had just gone through a maintenance check yesterday. they have to look at what the flight cockpit recorder says. >> tom costello thank you. we're learning more about who was on plane, including the large group of german high school students on their way home from barcel katie tur tells us more. >> reporter: as candles line the school steps, silence fell over the small german town. an entire high school spanish class feared dead. two teachers and 16 students coming back from a week-long exchange in barcelona. this girl's cousin was one of

. >>> back with us today investigator greg fiej and john cox. hn we are hearing indicators that the pilot was not well and the company did not know about that. but what does it fake to get a pilot grounded when folks around them are saying i'm not sure about that guy? >> well it varies from country to country. but in most cases and particularly in north america, what you have is a professional standards group and if somebody indicates they are having difficulties because of a family crisis and usually this is like a child that is ill or has been in an automobile accident or a spouse that is ill, it is something that distracted them from flying the airplane. the other pilots in a peer review will make that known to a standards group without putting that person's career in jeopardy and this has been done for decades. it is quiet and not publicized and most airline pilots in the united states or north america have this capability. and this is to a varying degree true in other parts of the world. but it is increasing. which is a good thing. because t

let me bring in msnbc aviation analyst john cox. his news conference by the german prosecutor there is no suicide note. there is no indication even with these visits that he had had to doctors in months and even days previous to the incident that he was suicidal or was aggressive towards anybody else. it just -- it just seems odd. doesn't it to you, john? >> well, he had an obligation to report. >> right. >> any and all of the visits to these doctors to their, not only his employer but to his medical examiner, and failing that is beginning of the breach of trust that this individual broke with his employer his passengers, with all of us in the profession. so what i heard from the german prosecutor this morning was a continuation of methicallyodically putting the puzzle together of a picture of what it is what he knew and try to understand this heinous act. >> john cox, thank you for being with me. appreciate your time. we are, of course going to keep monitoring the situation in germany as well as what is going on in southern france i

joining us from tampa, florida, kormer commercial pilot and nbc news aviation analyst john cox and heref staff michael goldfarb. thanks to you both for joining us. john i'll start with crew this time. what are the key questions about the co-pilot that you still have this morning. >> first and foremost they will go back through his records to see the screening process which for lufthansa and germanwings is very, very extensive. are there any key indicators in the screening process that needs to be revised. this investigation has transitioned from being an aircraft accident investigation to a criminal investigation. and so the normal police protocols are now going to take precedent. the aircraft accident investigators are going to finish their work up doing the routine normal things, collecting all the information about the flight, the maintains, crew training those things. but the joined arms are going to now take the lead and they're going to look at every aspect of this individual this rogue pilot in as much detail as they can to try to come to some understanding about why they would c

joining me is aviation analyst captain john cox. this is my challenge this week.n the midst of this tragedy and all of us feeling horrible about it but sometimes our reaction to air disasters is to make sweeping policy change and it's not the kind of thing we do if there's a single car accident no matter how upsetting and sad it is. i'm wondering is it an overreaction to make policy change about what in this case is a horrible thing, but a one off thing. >> absolutely a knee jerk reaction in aviation safety is almost always a bad idea. after 30 years of being an aviation safety professional, we have seen time after time after time of these knee jerk reactions and they haven't turned out very well. so in the wake of this tragedy, and you're very correct, the likelihood this is a one off, it's a very very rare event, the likelihood of this being an ongoing problem is extremely remote. we need to take time we need to be exhaustive in gathering the right group of experts together and doing what we normally do and that is to continue to evaluate update and move forward

. >>> i want to bring in john cox. as this investigation unfolds, particularly the criminal investigation being done by the police bits of evidence continue to add that this was a very troubled individual that this rogue pilot, and as such it sounds like it is a very unfortunate situation for the individual it is incomprehensible that a pilot could take such actions. it is so far from the way that professional pilots conduct themselves, i really struggle with understanding it. >> a lot of questions i have been getting are, for example, when someone is going through training and take a break because of burnout as claudio was saying allegedly this pilot took time off because he was burned out, you would think that that would have raised some flags, but john the fact is that a lot of people have burnouts and take a pause from training. >> a break in training is not that unusual, particularly if there's a family emergency or crisis of some sort. for example, a sick child or someone involved in an accident it is not uncommo

. >> john cox and greg feith, thank you both for being with me. we'll continue following all the developments. >>> and back to a live picture from the crash scene, very near the crash scene where we expect to hear from the world leaders gathering there today to monitor this now mission that is very difficult and very somber one. you can see the first responders and the helicopters that are there. we're going to be continuing to watch this scene very closely. i want to now take you to two developing stories involving law enforcement officers killed in the line of duty. the first in california where just a couple of hours ago the man is suspected of killing veteran san jose officer in a shoot-out found dead in his home. police found the suspect scott dunham dead on his balcony with at least one gunshot wound. officers say dunham shot them they responded to a call about an intoxicated man threatening to kill himself. the omp johnson was a 14-year veteran of the san jose police department. >>> in wisconsin, a state trooper killed in a shoot-out with a

. >> joining me now to discuss all of this nbc's katy tur in germany and claudio lavanga and john cox from tampa. let me start with you, obviously word from the german prosecutor that the pilot had, mr. lubitz, in fact suicidal tendencies. what more do we know. >> reporter: we don't know for a fact much more than that, other than what the prosecutor out here has confirmed to us on the record, that they didn't find any evidence of what they call an organic illness basically a physical illness like cancer or heart disease. they did find evidence of a psycho somatic disorder suicide tendencies before he got his pilot's license and he has seen doctors since then. there has been no proof since then that he had suicidal tendencies after that or exhibited any aggressive behavior towards others. they do add right now they have no motive for why he did this allegedly did this. they've interviewed a number of his close friends and family and so far they've not been able to discern exactly what was going on in his head or what would lead him to not just commit suicide but to allegedly commit mas

i'm joined by a triple 777 pilot and scott hamilton and john cox and anthony davis. i want to start tonight with a picture of the cockpit of the a-320. now to the layperson out there who doesn't fly, you look at this cockpit and you think, wow, this is a lot of stuff. actually this is a relatively easy aircraft to fly and it is set up systematically in most of the a-320s the same way. this aircraft was built in 1990 so obviously there's probably been a lot of upgrades in the cockpit as far as technology since then but this is a basic set up of an a-320. the instruments look the same. there's a lot of redundancy in this cockpit. when it-- you hear a lot about squawk codes and transponders. they are related. a transponder is a piece of equipment that you'll find in the cockpit right here and there's two of them. that's part of the redundancy. the pilot and the co-pilot would each have a transponder to operate. if the aircraft is hijacked the transponder code would be 7500. the pilot would digitally punch in 7500. air traffic control would know right away there's an air

tom costello and john cox join me. tom, i start with you here. the data on that voice recorder how long typically does it take to get that critical information downloaded. >> if the recording is in good condition, they should be able to get that within an hour or two. that's not difficult. the concern is when you look at the pictures and see the condition of that box, i want to point out that box is different than this box. it does the same thing. there are different varieties of flight data and voice recorders. but the box has been as you can see pounded and significantly damaged. i think the question that the french are wrestling with is how much can they pull off the cockpit voice recorder. they have extremely sophisticated equipment to be able to do that but that could be a big challenge. i think we want to hear from the french exactly what they're able to get. to answer more directly two hours is the amount of length of time or length of time that that recording should contain. two hours' worth of conversation. that would be the entire lengt

. >> an aviation consultant captain john cox. >> this pilot was treated as any other passengers who is disruptive and who may be need to be restrained. >> the way they restrained the captain on that flight when he was going nuts is that they locked him out of the cockpit on that jet blue plane. the incident happened three years ago in march, 2012. it was long after the post 9/11 results went into effect mandating that the cockpit door be reinforced and bulletproof. the reason that flight landed safely three years ago the reason it was not crash landed somewhere is because passengers on that plane were able to grab tackle and ultimately tie up the pilot while he was having this scottic episode. and the only reason the passengers were able to get to him and do that is because the pilot either left the cockpit on his own nutty volition or possibly the copilot realized something was wrong with the pilot and tricked the pilot into leave the cockpit whereupon the lockable door of that cockpit many they could keep that apparently psychotic guy out and prevent him from getting back in to contr

nbc's claudio lavagna is near the crash scene and captain john cox is an aviation analyst who worked in aviation for 30 years and also with me lester holt who was covered aviation for much of his career. we'll start with claudio at that scene. first of all, claudio, let's talk about the effort obviously to retrieve the remains and any parts of that plane that can be recovered at this point. >> we've been told this morning tamron, that the first body parts or bodies have been airlifted from that crash site but certainly the news of the day is that revelation the shocking revelation that the co-pilot may have downed the plane voluntarily. must have come as a massive shock to families who just arrived here 15 minutes ago in seyne-les-alpes. not too far from the crash site and not far from this airfield in a makeshift chapel where they are attending a special ceremony for the victims. later they will be taking to the mountain where they will set up a makeshift memorial. we've seen some flags and many of the nationalities that were on the plane being set up there. some would just walk to

industry veteran john cox is joining us now. good morning to you, captain.s story? what do you think actually happened inside the cockpit? >> well we don't have all the information yet. overnight there was initially one report. now there's a couple more. we're going to know a lot more from the official process conference that's coming later in the morning. and i think that we need to be a little bit patient with that. the fact that one of the flight crew members got up to -- and left the flight deck that's not that unusual. physiological needs. and that's a reasonable time in the flight to expect that to occur. >> beut not being able to get back in. when you see these reports, do you think first subterfuge meaning the pilot inside was looking the other guy out? do you think he fainted, had a heart attack lost consciousness and that's why he wasn't responding? and then there's the issue of a key pad on the outside of the door which apparently would let the pilot in if he could plug it in. do you think he forgot the code? i mean walk through some of the permut

. >> john cox and bob haeger gentlemen, thank you so much for your time. i appreciate that. >>> let's go to more developing news at this hour. the iran nuclear talks. there are less than three days left for leaders to strike a deal. in the background, the crisis in yemen leaping close today to all-out war. in his cabinet remarks this morning, benjamin netanyahu put it gravest. the iran-yemen axis is very dangerous for humanity. joining us live is andrea mitchell. a good day to you. what's your outlook at this point? >> reporter: i would say rainy to gloomy to cloudy and overcast. not just the weather. the talks, alex. this is not going that well. officials say they can still get this together. it may just take until the very last moments. we're told expect to be here through tuesday night into wednesday morning. tuesday night, midnight, of course is the unofficial deadline they'd all agreed to. the president has said in the past they didn't want to extend for a third time this deadline. they may have no choice. there are some obstacles. one sticking point

. >> captain john cox, thank you for your perspective having flown this very plane. thank you.arly scheduled program. for the rest of you, there is more of "today." . we continue now 8:10 on the east coast on "today." we have been following this breaking news overseas. this disturbing story that a pilot put down this commercial plane on purpose. >> no question. there is a big story. here is a threat of more severe weather after a tornado is down in arkansas and other places oklahoma over the last 24 hours. >> fortunately, nothing quite as severe as we had been seeing over the last 24 hour. at least seven tornadoes touching down. at least one person killed several critically injured. >> that heavier weather now starts to make its way into the northeast and on the back side of this system we are actually looking at some showers and we're also looking at some snow in central indiana, into parts of michigan and ohio as well as we watch as pittsburgh right now, foggy, as the rain gets ready to move in we're going to be looking at some showers and thunderstorms. afternoon highs today