us our cnn political correspondent, former federal prosecutor, former nixon white house counsel john dean and cnn political analyst carl bernstein. let me start with you, john. the fact that the now resigned ambassador special envoy to ukraine kurt volker is a mccain guy, was never a trump guy to begin with, now less than a week after he's resigned he is ready to testify this coming thursday. should the white house be concerned specifically because there are a lot of folks out there who are suggesting he may be what you once were, another john dean. >> well, wolf, one thing is for sure. i don't think the effort to get him not to testify, to not appear, to not say anything, is going to work. there is no privilege to do that, although some members of the white house staff, former members of the white house staff have done that. in the house judiciary inquiry. i don't think he is going to fool with that. i think he is going to get right down to it and tell them a lot about what was going on. >> yeah. he'll be under oath so he has to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

so john dean, let me just start with you. do you think speaker pelosi is right.'s referring obviously to the attorney general bill barr who was named in the complaint as worked with my attorney general and rudy giuliani often in the same sentence with the ukraine president. >> i think her assessment is correct. it's a question of where he's gone rogue or from whom, and i think it's from the american people and into trying to be a defense counsel for the president, and that's not been the post watergate tradition. there's no law that spills this out, but after watergate, the justice department took a lot of independence and there were rules and regulations about contacting and dealing with the department that seemed to have fallen apart under this president. >> i mean, dana, bill barr has repeatedly defended the president on controversial issues. he's been his wingman and been his supporter, just a couple of times like this. >> my administration is finalizing a plan to end the rampant abuse of our asylum system. >> where people are abusing the asylum system. >> i'

it's not like john dean's road map in watergate.lations of alex butterfield that there was a white house taping system that led to nixon's doom. what we have now is that this whistleblower has talked really about a lock box system that may contain more and more evidence of the president's construction. we already got today paragraph after paragraph of real corruption, real abuse of power by the president of the united states. john dean talked about a cancer growing on the presidency. this one seems to be the president is the cancer if we are to read that whistleblower's complaint adequately. >> if weir -- where does the investigation go? there are a bunch of folks who are saying this shouldn't be a long investigation that goes into the election year, that essentially there is a lot of stuff out there and people need to come forward and talk and testify and it can be wrapped up shortly. it sounds like there are a lot of issues about whether other white house officials will be allowed to speak because of executive privilege by this wh

it's not like john dean's road map in watergate.velations of alex butterfield that there was a white house taping system that led to nixon's doom. what we have now is that this whistleblower has talked really about a lock box system that may contain more and more evidence it sounds like there are a lot of issues about whether other white house officials will be allowed to speak because of executive privilege by this white house. that lock box system, is it clear to you that that can actually be looked into since it's highly classified? >> i don't know. but there seems to be a good number of witnesses to all kinds of events and all kinds of memoranda that were recorded. we'll see. but what we have now is a whole different dynamic about the future of this presidency that was not there a week ago. if there is any doubt about it, we see not only the president's words about abusing power in the whistle-blower's complaint, we also heard the president live today on tape talking about killing spies, talking about offing the people who broug

michael cohen's testimony was a bust, john dean's testimony was a waste of time. speaker pelosi's decision to pursue impeach on allegations only shows that the speaker has suck comed to the socialist wing of the democrat party. this was never about russian collusion, it's all about undoing the 2016 people and the will of the american people. we will hear from kevin mccarthy in 15 minutes and he will make a statement. and we will have it live for you. joe is on the democrats' line. caller: i'm so proud of the speaker here and the king is not the law the law is the king. and imamazed at the calls you are receiving. we watch different media and have a different bias. i don't want to sound craft but i don't want to make up my mind before the facts. if you don't fight hide enough, at the end of the day you don't believe in them. and i really believe that my congressman has been listening to me and my congressman has done what i have asked and that's to wait, to wait patiently until we have enough people and enough facts have come forward to change the americans' opinio

john dean is here. john dean was, by the way, white house counsel for president nixon.as well, and rick wilson, the author of "everything trump touches dies." good evening, one and all. so let's get the conversation started with rick. lewandowsky frustrating democrats, refusing to answer lots of questions. watch this moment, please. >> either you were willing to break the law for politics and mr. trump, or you're some kind of a forrest gum relating to corruption. so maybe let me ask you this. did the president pick you his enforcer? he thought you would play whatever role he wanted because it was illegal? is that possibly why he chose you to take this message to sessions? >> that would be a question for the president, congressman. >> what did you think, rick? did democrats get played by trump, team trump? >> they got rolled like a cheap rug, don. this guy was in contempt from the hot second he walked in the door. he acted in a -- he lied to their faces. he went right up at them. he did everything but take a dump on nadler's desk today by pushing the contempt that he sho

water gate changed dramatically, because of the urban hearing, when john dean got up and testified and alex butterfield and howard baker did a superb job, the whole thing was handled very, very well and it sank in with the public and the public realized the solemnnity, the gravity of what is going on of and the white house might try to block and not let anybody come up. i personally believe they will wave the executive privilege but i think this has to be done with an eye toward television. >> and not the first time we've heard someone raise the john dean testimony there. and the question, will there be a john dean here, someone from inside the administration with a moment of conscience saying this shall not stand, in effect. patrick healy, you say trump is acting more like a banana republic dictator than an american president. specifically to this exchange yesterday, i want to play it for our audience, the president describing the whistleblower as a spy. have a listen. >> i want to know, who's the person that gave the whistleblower, who's the person who gave the whistleblower the info

kaitlan, and back with me now is nia malika henderson, john dean and kerry cordero. the president said he will release the transcript and he'll meet with the ukrainian president and the ukrainian president told cnn tonight when our alex marquardt stopped her by the u.n. and they're private and confidential. i guess not. so do you have a sense of what we could get here? is this going to be a readout of the call? do -- there wouldn't usually be a tape and we trust that that's what it is. >> in most cases it's not a transcript, it's probably notes. advisers were listening on call. the idea that it was a transcript suggests that you will get everything accurately represented from the call. the president wants to release what he calls a transcript publicly and not to congress, why? because he wants to be able to personally and have his supporters in congress and certainly in friendly media make the case that this is ridiculous. pay attention today to something that nancy pelosi said and what she didn't say. she never said that the underlying allegation here has to be a qu

joining me to discuss is john dean and also jack tarmaccio. he's with homeland security in the george w. bush administration. good evening, gentlemen. appreciate having you both on. jack, you first. you say the way this whistle-blower campaign is being handled makes watergate look like kindergarten. why? >> well, what i'm seeing here, don, is already a pattern of obfuscation. you've got rudy giuliani out there kind of running interference and it just seems like it's going down the road of trying to hide very legitimate questions. and i think it would be well served for the president, certainly well served for the country for them to come forward and have a little transparency here. i think we learned that mistake back in 1973 and '74 but apparently this white house doesn't remember the history. >> the person that can speak about that is john dean. john, obviously you have firsthand experience with watergate. where do you rate this? >> i -- it's really in a whole other dimension. the level of playing with national security for personal gain is

john dean joins me now. thanks so much for joining us, mr. dean.u were president trump's counsel rice out in, what would you advise him? >> actually today i'd have an obligation to go in, white house counsel, his client is the office of the president, not the person to occupy, the office. so pat shipaloney should go in and do what i tried to do in an hour at 50-minute conversation, tried to take the president through every problem he confronted with the watergate cover-up and sell him on hoping he would bring his fist down on the table and say this has got to end. he did exactly the opposite, jake. this is the morning i think i first met richard nixon, actually. >> based on the facts of what we know now, not the speculation, but just the facts of the whistle-blower complaint, which, you know, it's not, has not been 100% kracorroborated. credible but we don't know it to be fact, based on reap lealeasee transcript, is there a cancer growing on the trump presidency? >> i think there is very much a cancer growing on this presidency. there's a malignanc

. >> cnn contributor watergate veteran john dean joining us with more.o that, nancy pelosi clearly saying she trusts the committee and the panel they're on. do you see a path there? what is the path? >> well i think what they're trying to do is develop evidence to see if there, indeed, lie witnesses that will support what's in the special counsel's report, showing potentially impeachable offenses. i think they're going within the bounds of the special counsel's report right now, but they've indicated they're going outside of it. they're on an impeachment inquir inquiry. no question. >> no question on that path. when it comes to corey lewandowski in contempt. so much talk during that hearing, and even the moments after, right? about possibly holding lewandowski in contempt. it is a much more involved process, i think, than many of us had realized and actually involves separate participation from corey lewandowski himself. can you walk us through what this would entail? >> yeah. i used to be counsel of that committee. so i'm very familiar with these proced

the john dean hearing didn't work for them. the mueller report and mueller hearing didn't work for them. the lewandowski hearing didn't work for them. let's do a press conference and let's talk about something we haven't even seen because maybe that will work. that's how desperate and ridiculous this has gotten. i think the american people see through t they see clearly the job that this president has done and they appreciate that and they think what the democrats are doing is ridiculous. frankly, the precedent it sets is dangerous as well. look, we'll look at the document. but i think the facts are that they got nothing else and they are doing the kind of things they did yesterday. 160-some democrats are wanting to move forward about something they haven't even read or seen. i don't know we have ever seen that in the history of the congress. with that i'll yield to our leader who is doing a great job leading our team, that's chairman mccarthy. mr. scalise: yesterday was a low point in nancy pelosi's speakership. when you see a

but tapes came out as witnesses came forward john dean what have you. things started to change. i think if you get the whistleblower coming out if you have other people who can testify as what was going on. sir coming forward the american public. we'll start to move and that's what they're gambling. >>do you think if this whistleblower complaint doesn't include dramatic elements that go far beyond the summary of the call with ukraine's president. do you think if this if complaint doesn't have bombshell items beyond that that the needle will be moved at all i think if you look he leave the transfer of this call. it's pretty dramatic you you essentially have the president going saying its own hey, you know, we've been good to that good us we've been good to you. >>and by the way. this is what i need and then he goes into the ask me that. >>mean >>the fact that just before that phone call he froze the 8 with out to ukraine without any explanation where the state department's trying to gin up excuses to congress as to why this happened and they were scrambling trying to figure out.

the rules, him.ng else has worked for michael cohen hearing was a flop for them. 17 times.ied the john dean hearing was a flop. mueller ed the bob hearing. we all know that was a flop. so they have to come up with some way to go after this because they are bound and determined to do it even though the country thinks it's not warranted. and the country says in every poll don't do it. they change the rules in the middle of the game. the underlying president was the alsely accused of -- jim comey investigated for 10 months. after 10 months he found nothing. we deposed mr. comey and he told us that in the deposition. but he still leaks information his special counsel counsel, bob mueller, he investigates after 20 months and no coordination between the trump campaign and russian influence. 2 months, putting the country through this, and what do democrats want to do? change the rules so they can investigating and go after the president. it's ridiculous. it is wrong. deepveryone in the country down understands that. unfortunately, the chairman of the judiciary committee doesn't. is look at howdo t

. >> they bring in john dean from the nixon era has nothing to do with anything.ot bring in the ig, id testifies routinely. that's the point, they testify many, many times. i want to get to the formae fbi james comey tweeting and attacking president trump, and 1867, federal douglas said we may have some time to be in the hands of a bad man. even when in the hands of a bad man, we shall be safe. do we shape it well enough? the test is underway. what is your reaction to that? >> i'm not a psychologist or psychiatrist. joking aside, i cannot tell you why this guy is behaving the way he is. no sooner than the ig report, out to say he violated protocols and not try to be political but the report said that. he doubles and triples down so look, i'll be diplomatic, his behavior is puzzling and you heard experts say that, i don't know what he's doing it, maybe has public relation where if you go scorch the earth in every instance it works. liz: molly firing back tweeting, this is precisely why it was so dangerous to the republic for you and your cohorts to invent the rest

the john dean hearing was a flop. you watched and we all watched the bob mueller hearing. we all know that was a flop. so they have to come up with some way to go after this president because they are bound and determined to do it even though the country thinks it's not warranted. even though they know we shouldn't do it, and the country says in every poll don't do it. they change the rules in the middle of the game. and understand the underlying issue here. the president was falsely accused of conspiring with a foreign state to influence the election. jim comey investigated for 10 months. after 10 months, he found nothing. we deposed mr. comey and he told us that in the deposition. but he still leaks information to get his special counsel, bob mueller, he investigates after 20 months and said no coordination between the trump campaign and russian influence. -- and russia to influence the election. 32 months, putting the country through this, and what do democrats want to do? change the rules so they can keep investigating and go after the president. it's ridiculous. it is

. >> michael cohen didn't work out the way they wanted, john dean didn't work out the way they wanted and the bob mueller hearing, that investigation didn't work out the way they wanted but that doesn't stop them. they will continue to push this impeachment narrative. >> what about the argument that it's time for democrats -- >> democrats can do multiple things, they can do the constitutional duty of oversight of the executive branch, chuck schumer and nancy pelosi were calling on the senate to put forth legislation on background checks which has 80% support, 90% support. later in the week they will introduce legislation on drug pricing could. they are doing both things. republicans when they had control of the house took the majority in january 2011. by february they were investigating obama. not a single day of obama's presidency where republicans did not have an investigation going. the fact is you can investigate and legislate at the same time. republicans are afraid what they may find. donald trump is afraid of it. >> it seems impeachment talk except a lot of oxygen in this town.

he's bringing john dean of watergate fame.igh school. >>> iran's president says the u.s. offered to remove all sanctions against iran in return for negotiations. hassan rouhani says he did not act on the offer because of what he called the current poisonous atmosphere. president trump denied making that offer in a tweet. rouhani today returned to iran following the united nations meetings in new york. tensions between washington and tehran have increased since the u.s. pulled out of a nuclear agreement with iran last year. >>> she shot a man in his own apartment. that dallas police officer took the stand during her own trial. amber geiger apologized through ti tears. she shot and killed jean. she thought he was trying to break into her apartment. >> i never wanted to take an innocent person's life. >> she lived in the apartment right above his. geiger is on trial for murder. the jury could begin deliberations as early as next week. >>> nearly a month after 34 people were killed in a dive boat fire off santa barbara, the cause

a household name the way butter field and john dean over night became famous during the nixon years. >> hold on. what do you mean it can't be doctored? >> pardon? >> the transcript. >> well, they will be under legal jeopardy if that's doctored. i'm worried about it. i'm worried they will say these are a memory notes and see what it comes out tomorrow. see if anybody has a recording. since 1974, with the nixon tapes. most presidents claim they're not recording things but a recording would be best. the tapes are what dammed nixon in many ways in the end. we'll get some kind of transcription here. we'll have to see what the whistleblower has. so i think the nixon parallels will be large here. except for the fact nixon had a select committee. people like sam irvine and howard baker. this is going to be nancy pelosi trying to jam this through as fast as she can. working in a stealth fashion before you get into the caucus and primaries in early 2020. >> interesting. thanks for clarifying that. nixon resigned before he even made it to the house vote. clinton and johnson were impeached by ac

remember it was john dean who had been saying this went to the very top and then eventually mr. butterfield who exposed the existence of the secret recordings that were happening. >> you have the house speaker this is the cover-up of the cover-up. >> what democrats need to do is try not to overplay their hand. find actual evidence. and i think they've done a decent job of it. nancy pelosi in particular has been very careful in all of this. and then i think you see things like adam schiff where, you know, we had that parity of the phone call which is undermining democrats and i bet he got the call from nancy pelosi saying let's play this straight. don't make this a parity. >> evidence can come by way of testimony and giuliani has given contradictory answers today. just happened today when asked repeatedly if he would testify if subpoenaed by congress. take a listen. >> i wouldn't cooperate with adam schiff. i think adam schiff should be removed. if they remove adam schiff and put in a neutral person, a democrat who hasn't expressed an opinion yet, if i had a judge in a case and h

john dean, former white house counsel to president nixon this morning, let me read you his tweet if we can pull it up. speaker pelosi has greenlighted holding lewandowski in contempt. they should do it before the weekend. make a statement, democrats. the rules apply to republicans and their games are over. is he right? should lewandowski be held in contempt this week? >> absolutely. here's my personal statement. i am not going to speak on behalf of my 200-plus colleagues. lewandowski should be held in contempt. there has to be a clear consequence. we can't continue to have an investigation mock our powers of congress. >> let me end on guns because this is something that is important to keep at the fore despite all of the other news that is going on. attorney general barr was on the hill talking to lawmakers about potential gun proposals coming out of the administration. at this point, this is personal for you. you lost your father to gun violence. i'm so sorry for your loss. i know what you have proposed. i wonder what you make of the chances of expanded background checks getting throu

they had witnesses, john dean testified in public.hat had been admitted and had the evidence and became more supportive. the support for impeachment started to rise as the facts started to come out. also, you had a difference, because it was bipartisan. at that time, actually democrats and republicans voted for impeachment and worked together to bring it about. you didn't have the fox news bubble where people who are listening to fox news have a completely different take on what is going on than those people who are watching this show right now. >> uh-huh. >> people watching us have one view. people watching fox have a completely different view. >> jill, through all this, you saw the doj reaction and saying bakaly start an official impeachment inquiry in order for them to hand over all of that grand jury testimony and information. is that the case? >> it isn't the case and during watergate, the actual official start of impeachment happened after the hearings had already started, and after we had turned over the documents. so i think t

it's president nixon ordering john dean to pay hush money to the burglars. that's a cover-up.hether or not you think it's impeachable, a cover-up is asking betty curry to retrieve gifts from monica lewinsky and then she hides them under her bed. at the cover-up. >> laura: you are taking us back to impeachment. when you say betty curry and then we are all getting all back to that. johnny, you are a law officer. you've been watching this entire thing unfold. this has gotten into cover-up mode. they are releasing all the documents. i think they are releasing too many documents frankly but they are releasing documents, former leaders are complaining i understand. but in impeachable offense behind a shadow of a doubt, we have heard that length from democrats all day long. >> that's what i want to pick up on, that last piece. the foreign leaders to be upset about this and that president to be upset about this. as professor dershowitz pointed out, the executive power is invested in the president pretty is our sole organ on foreign affairs and what the democrats are doing here and pla

really be able to get some key players up there, and it may look a lot like what our memories of john deanbutterfield and others testifying back in watergate. >> and carl burpstein, cnn is reporting that the whistle-blower has tentatively agreed to testify before members of congress in closed session if acting dni, the director of national intelligence maguire agrees. and i think as well if his or her lawyers can be present. that seems like a pretty good deal. >> it's a very big deal as is the release that's coming tomorrow of the whistle-blower -- of the inspector general's report. because what we are seeing here is that donald trump has lost control of the narrative. up until now he's been able to a large extent especially in the mueller investigation to keep the press, to keep investigators, to keep his own party and even to keep the democrats fighting on the ground that he has laid. he has laid the battlefield, and in the mueller investigation, that's one of the reasons he wasn't able to prevail to the extent he did. now he's up against nancy pelosi and a set of facts that is absolutel

connections with ukraine and rudy giuliani and the president, some are even suggesting he could be the john deanhe could. he could. i was communicating with somebody who knows him. he is the head of the mccain institute. he is like minded with john mccain on the region, particularly ukraine, meaning making sure that they have what they want, trying to help them navigate the politics of the region and the politics of russia and helping getting the u.s. to help more and he comes at it from that perspective. having said that, he did, if you believe the text that rudy giuliani screenshotted and sent to me and practically every other reporter in this town, he did help giuliani make a connection, and what was he doing that for? why did he do that? did he do it kicking and screaming and you're exactly right. he will be fascinating to watch because he's someone that has a lot of experience in this town and he has a reputation to uphold separate from donald trump. >> to laura and dana's point. even in this, we will have volker in front of the house foreign affairs committee next week. i mean, the mueller

joining me now joel bremer, former assistant secretary under president obama and julian kay yem and john dean. you've been in this situation in inspect or generals where you've had various people fighting over what should be revealed and the inspector general here for the intelligence community admits that this is a credible and urgent threat. team trump fighting to keep it hidden and not allowing the inspect or general to say anything about the substance of it to congress today as you just heard. could the ig just throw his career to the wind and put this information out there or will we find another way? >> the ig is not, i've known mr. atkinson, and i think he's a very capable and level-headed man. he's not going to compromise classified information and the question might be whether he might disclose it himself behiebd closed doors to the intelligence committees, but that would be an act of civil disobedience and he would have to take the consequences of that and one of the consequences, i'm sure, would be losing his job and i don't know whether he believes he ought to be doing that or whe

joining me now to discuss is jim sciutto, kaitlan collins, john dean.of you on this evening. thank you so much. kaitlan, i'm going to start with you because you're outside of trump tower right now, and i'm wondering if you're hearing anything from the white house on this new reporting about other white house officials who corroborate the whistle-blower's complaint? >> reporter: well, don, this is what's interesting because over the last several days before we really knew the details of this whistle-blower's complaint, you heard from the white house, from president trump and his top officials that they said they believed this whistle-blower was someone who was partisan, potentially disgruntled, someone who was essentially out to get the president, potentially a career employee. and now today as we're learning more about this whistle-blower's identity, as we're seeing this complaint start to take shape, you're seeing that the inspector general interviewed other white house officials who were involved in this, who apparently were giving some kind of a head

. >> neilmichael cohen when he ret work out, john dean hearing did not work out the way they wanted andring and that investigation did not work out the way they want to. that does not stop. they will push this ridiculous impeachment. >> neil: all right, jordan calling out all house democrats as they unveil a plan to pursue the impeachment today. those who are doing that. where is this headed? "washington examiner" mookie. and what i understand the real focus on the judiciary committee wants to do and it seems to be just the beginning of whether it starts, the formal impeachment proceedings. do i have that right? >> right, for months the democrats talking about impeachment, but that is exactly what it's been. all talk. and now, finally getting serious and they will try to do something about it. whether republicans or democrats get on board with that, that is something we will find out. >> neil: they say they are 100 votes or so for impeachment come exclusively among democrats. but even allowing for the possibility of 25, it's not as though they will make progress in the senate. if they w

. >> years ago i went through and went to see where john dean made the movie and there's lot of idles and a lot were talking about the depression, never going to intelligence come back if i go there now it's insane. what happened? >> well, shale happened. so we came up with -- the united states came up with a new way of producing oil out of formations that simply was not available before that's a technology thing. that's happened over the last ten years and because of that we can produce oil, gas and ngls at rate or unit costs far below what we could do before and you put that together. that's where all the production is coming? >> talking about 18 million barrels. where the hemingway will we put the oil? >> sorry, ceo of -- >> we'll put the oil overseas. but the 18 million, you know, i think scott's backed off a little bit the past couple of case, not by much. we do several scenarios and our scenario that we've got right now says if crude oil prices hang there for the next five years at 55 bucks we'll get up to around 15.5 but if crude oil prices for whatever reason get to $65 the e

to borrow john dean's haunting metaphor, cancers if not removed only grow.gress bears the duty to use the tools provided by the constitution to remove that cancer now before it's too late. ron and the table are back. claire, what do you think not just about where this conversation is because we've had pretty granular conversations about nadler's handling pelosi's reluctant. but i can't help but tie it back to parenting. you know, and i have a 7-year-old, but if you say no and then the child gets to yes, then the next time you say no, it's a bigger transgression and a bigger one. this would seem like the most outlandish behavior, the scariest behavior and behavior with real serious consequences for our country. and i know elizabeth warren who we're going to talk about later talked about congress being complicit. do you think that's where we are? >> well, i certainly think that there has been a slowness to reality, a slowness to realize how bad this guy really is. that he actually would knowingly do something like this is startling. now, they have asked for th

the john dean hearing was a flop, the bob mueller hearing was a flop. a flop, the lewandowski hearing was a flop so they're trying to figure out, maybe this transcript. but even they have said there was no prick, quid pro quo. the chairman themselves have said there was no quid pro quo here, there was no talk about holding up foreign aid from the president. it. zelinski, the president of the ukraine, said he wasn't pushed, so this is just a democrat out to get the guy we elected president, plain and simple. >> bret: here is a compilation of some of those democrats today and you rightly point out that it depends on which prism you're looking through how it was perceived of this transcript, and here are the democrats. >> when you ask someone to do a favor, you owe that person something in return and when that person is a foreign leader or that means the president of the united states one day you will have to put a foreign leader's interest ahead of american interests. >> this is a powder keg. >> coercing a foreign leader into digging up dirt against a pol

. >> look, the michael cohen hearing didn't work out the way they wanted, the john dean harry didn't work out the way they wanted and of course the bob mueller hearing that investigation didn't work out the way they wanted but that doesn't stop them. they're going to continue to push this ridiculous impeachment narrative. >> mike: josh, what about the argument that it's time for democrats to move on? >> democrats can do multiple things. they can do their constitutional duty and they can introduce policy. today chuck schumer and nancy pelosi were calling on the senate to put forth legislation, 80% support, 90% support. later in the week i believe they're going to introduce legislation on drug pricing. so they are doing both things. you remember republicans when they had control of the house, they took the majority in january of 2011. by february they were already investigating obama. after that point there was not a single day of obama's presidency where the republicans did not have an investigation open. the fact is you can investigate and legislate at the same time and republicans a

is there another john dean and a person who can turn around and say i can't do it anymore?u have a whistle-blower taking a courageous step and going this far. remember, what the inspector general deemed to be urgent and credible and that's important because this is an independent lawyer who is looking at all of this and protecting this process, so presumably, this inspector general may or may not have spoken to others who were involved to try to rcorroborate this and that's where so much of the focus should be at the end of this day because you can focus on the whistle-blower if you like, or if you're a republican or the president you can threaten him and others, but it's the fact that there were others going to these great lengths to protect the president from himself that i think now becomes the heart of the matter. >> and bob, to that point. in the appendix of the complaint and there's some information in the appendix which is redacted and we can read in full. the whistle-blower claims and this is important. according to white house officials i spoke with again, plural,

joining me now to discuss is jim sciutto, kaitlan collins, john dean.of you on this evening. thank you so much. kaitlan, i'm going to start with you because you're outside of trump tower right now, and i'm wondering if you're hearing anything from the white house on this new reporting about other white house officials who corroborate the whistle-blower's complaint? >> reporter: well, don, this is what's interesting because over the last several days before we really knew the details of this whistle-blower's complaint, you heard from the white house, from president trump and his top officials that they said they believed this whistle-blower was someone who was partisan, potentially disgruntled, someone who was essentially out to get the president, potentially a career employee. and now today as we're learning more about this whistle-blower's identity, as we're seeing this complaint start to take shape, you're seeing that the inspector general interviewed other white house officials who were involved in this, who apparently were giving some kind of a head

. >> who is going to be john dean? who is going to be in the white house and say, i can't do this anymore? >> or somebody who left the white house. >> who is going to say there's a cancer on this presidency that i am no longer going to be a part of? it's not just the white house. it's not just the white house. look at how the justice department, it appears, has been corrupted by their involvement with this presidency. look at how they became part of the coverup of this process. >> to your point, the question about quid pro quo -- how could holding back on a presidential visit, one, but at the saum tmee withholding military assistance in light of what the president wanted from ukraine, how can that -- >> it's a willful ll lly obtuse reading of the complaint. it's right there. they are talking about aid. then he says, do me a favor. you don't get more quid pro quo than that. there was an understanding. i think we cannot get caught in the trap of unless it says only if you investigate the bidens will i give you the money.

really important for the democrats to be able to get a series of witnesses, as they did in watergate, john deanhe sort of people coming up. it really drills home to the public. >> you think sort of rushing this would be a bad idea? >> rushing this and trying to have a vote in the next ten days is crazy. they need to pin this down because the republicans are saying with justification, this is mostly hearsay. the big issue, and i refer to jeffrey on this, is whether the white house will resist and whether they can claim and uphold executive privilege. that's going to be what they want to do. i think they've waived it. that's what i defer to jeffrey on. >> listen, we'll get to jeffrey in just a second. a lot more on that clear complaint release. how tough is the white house going to be? can they stop people from the white house from testify? including a quote now from unnamed officials who say the ukrainians were told their president could only have that call with trump in july if he was willing to, quote, play ball, unquote, on investigating the bidens. my grandfather had an amazing life, but anc

the john dean hearing was a flop. and everyone in the country knows the bob mueller hearing, they saw it, that was a flop. so let's change the rules in the middle of the game because we've got to find something. we've got to find something. never forget how this whole thing started. never forget how this whole thing started. a false accusation about the president of the united states, saying the president coordinated with a foreign country to influence the election. jim comey investigated that for ten months. guess what? he found nothing. and we know he found nothing because we deposed him and he told us after ten months they didn't have a thing. but that didn't stop it. 22 months later, bob mueller does a special counsel investigation and he investigates it for 22 months, and what does he tell us? other members have already said this. he found nothing. no coordination between the trump campaign and russia to impact the election. 32 months of investigations, they find nothing. but what do democrats want to do? what do

they tried with john dean. they tried with bob mueller himself, the mueller report.ict or impeach the president. now they're inventing this. steve: never let a good whistle-blower scandal to waste. brian: time to call carl bernstein if you're on another network. steve: if it exonerates and him is clear, probably. at the same time if there is gray language in it, it might be like, i don't know what -- brian: he said he did bring up joe biden during the conversation. steve: 100%. brian: there you go. that is one issue. the other issue, does the whistle-blower come forward? adam schiff come forward, i don't think the whistle-blower come forward. i demand they go forward, that is standoff. they work their way through the courts. you listen to john yu last night, teaching at berkeley, used to work with the judiciary with president bush he says the legal case is on the president's side. steve: go to john roberts outside of the united nations right now. john has been on the phone working his sources. what do you know right now, john, regarding the fact that yesterday the st

and it was michael cohen didn't do it, the john dean hearing didn't do it for him, the bob mueller hearingell apart, the corey lewandowski -- so now they come with this. the latest attack on the president. >> so -- there's a lot you said there. there's a lot of people that would look at what's in the mueller report and say, that's not nothing. >> you watched the mueller hearing. >> let's talk about today. let's talk about today. you just described this individual, this whistle-blower, and i'm really actually surprised, because i've covered whistle-blowers when you were on the committee during the obama years, and there was a lot more reverence for whistle-blowers during that period from republicans than i'm hearing today. you said that he was a bureaucrat who hated the president or disliked the president, biased against the president. there is no evidence of that. let me read from the inspector general's report. it says, "although the icig," that's the intelligence community's inspector general's -- political review unveiled some indicia, such evidence did not change my determination that

. >> he's not john dean and while he is an object of scorn, inside the beltway he cuts through everything outside the beltway when you go to warren, ohio, people hear him, respect him and listen to him. >> lebo? >> i think they hear him because he is everywhere he is a proxy for the president. he's his personal attorney or sometimes he's a free-range chicken as senator kennedy would say, right but he also is someone who -- the fact that he's out there so much is emblematic of the fact that a lot of republicans are not comfortable being out there very much. the defense of president trump has not come to any kind of coherent message look, whatever rudy giuliani says on a given day becomes the message and he becomes the lightning rod here. >> when you talk to rudy giuliani, the issue with that is he's also talking about other people that he says were involved he says the state department called me. >> he keeps inviting -- he basically says, here, adam schiff, here are more people to subpoena. >> here a more people to subpoena, and there's this idea that there are a long list of people that r

. >> he's not john dean. one thing we have to be careful of is while he is indeed an object of controversy and scorn. inside the beltway, he cuts through everything outside of the beltway. when you go to warren, ohio, people hear him and respect him and listen to him. >> i think they hear him because he is everywhere. i think what he is emblematic of is he's a proxy for the president, his personal attorney or sometimes a free range chicken, but he also is someone, the fact he's out there so much is emblematic of the fact a lot of republicans are not comfortable being out there much. the defense of president trump has not come to any kind of coherent message. and look, whatever rudy giuliani says on a given day becomes the message and he becomes sort of a lightning rod. >> when you talk to rudy giuliani, the issue with that is he's also talking about all the other people he says were involved. he said the state department called me. >> he basically says, here, adam schiff, here are more people to subpoena. >>

former democratic presidential candidate and dnc chairman howard dean and cnn senior political commentator former republican ohio governor, johnthis taken together, are democrats making the president's job easier for him here? >> you know, i'm not sure what they're doing. in terms of the impeachment stuff, look, you have to get to the bottom of what really happened and you need the facts. so i don't think kavanaugh is going to get impeached. i think people are upset with what's happened with the supreme court over the last 20 years. 71% of young americans 35 and under believe the supreme court is more interested in politics than they are in the law. that's a big, big problem for the country. so the kavanaugh stuff is a symptom of that, certainly not the cause. >> governor kasich, i mean, how important -- obviously, this is very early stages in this election, but how important is it that the democrats at large or any party is cohesive in its message, or at least not making unforced errors as it heads into an election year? >> yeah. well, first of all, i always like being with howard dean. he's a smart guy, and he's -- you know,