although, frank lucas, the chairman of the house agriculture committee, says in the end on the food stamps, it's going to have to be an agreement between president obama, house speaker john boehner, and senate majority leader harry reid. they're going to have to decide on a number and that's what the rest of the congress will accept. host: overarching issues of the day such as the debt ceiling and everything else, could this affect negotiations between those three men? guest: well, it certainly -- it certainly could. because if they're looking for cuts, if they're looking for money to save, then it's possible that they -- that they would look to the farm bill for part of those cuts. but it's also possible that the farm bill could be attached to one of these pieces of legislation and that would make it easier to get it through congress. host: 40 -- i'm sorry, $74.6 billion when it comes to the snap program, as it's called, food stamps as it's commonly called, about 46.6 million people on it, about 22 million households. the average benefit per person, $133. per household, $278. jerry hagstrom, that figure today, how does it vary from years past in terms of the amount of m