and--and, also, according to his--john oxford's adult daughter, esther oxford, john oxford's wife was also getting a little bit concerned. when kirsty duncan's marriage broke up, the first person she called was john oxford. john oxford, by that time, had gotten her grants from the--from the british for her and--and paved the way for a lot of her work. he had a falling out with her and he--i think he's still a member of the te--he is still a member of the team, but he no longer is--i--i--whatever their relationship is, and as far as i know--i have no reason to believe it's anything other than just letters, faxes, telephone calls. i--i don't believe it's anything else, but it's not what it used to be. there is sort of a chill in th--in their relationship. c-span: before i ask you about the center for disease control, what is your conclusion up till now about what's gone on with all this? do--do we--do we know, and was all this worth it? >> guest: yes, i think so. i--every time i speak to--to scientists about the 1918 flu, i say, 'are we going to see another flu like this?' and they say,