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host: you've talked about christopher spencer, he's the only person who hasn't survived in history with an arms manufacturing name attached to him. why not? john: he had a marvelous spencer repeating rifle that worked well in the civil war. it didn't survive the development of modern cartridges. there were several problems with it after the civil war. one is that so many of them were made. he won the unofficial contest with winchester for repeating guns used in the civil war. his repeating weapon could not take large, heavy cartridges of the time. it was used to a certain extent out west, custer's scouts used them. the company foundered for a while. they try to get into other ventures, sporting rifles. but an industrial shark came along and eventually ended up taking over the company and all of its assets and patents. that shark was oliver winchester. that was the end of the spencer company. spencer himself continued to invent. he was a passionate inventor and he kept on inventing. he invented a shotgun later that was perfectly good but did not succeed in the marketplace. so his name did not survive other than in those interested in historical