that "wall street journal" report earlier this week saying johnny ive's departure triumphs innovation over design and questioning the innovation going forward. is that a concern? >> look, the numbers speak for themselves we've talked about this for some time back in 2012, the company spent about $3 billion on r&d and was only 2.2% of revenue since that time, the r&d budget has quadrupled and the revenue growth has only grown 60%. obviously, that's good overall growth, but they're investing a lot more in what everyone's hopeful to be new products everyone keeps saying, okay, if the iphone can grow a little bit, maybe we'll drop some new innovative product but year over year, we haven't seen anything that innovative. but you can't invest in apple on the hope that this massive r&d budget that's quadrupled since 2012 and now represents whatever, 5, 6% of revenue up from 2% of revenue, is going to deliver a product. you have to invest on the basics is the iphone replacement cycle going to stop lengthening? are service s going to resonate with their 900 million active iphone users globally?

design is in apple's dna, so i think they'll be able to overcome johnny ive's departure.ut an amazing career at apple for johnny ive and i think the company is still well positioned, going forward >> great we'll leave it there gentlemen, thanks for joining us, brent and tom. >> thank you >>> when we return, the winners and losers from the g-20 summit. why apple might be this weekend's biggest winner more on that and this morning's cease-fire rally, straight ahead. >>> and later, inside the secret koch brothers' summit. tooladspngt coro ris after the break. stay with us >>> welcome back the president restarting talks with north korea and china on denuclearization and trade over the weekend. kayla tausche has been all over the story. she's in washington on the difficult road ahead of negotiations kayla, the big topic today is, yes, a truce is nice, but how do you actually get a deal from here >> that's the work, deirdre, that's being done behind the scenes right now president trump says the negotiations with north korea will take place at the staff level at the next two to

. >> what do you make of the chatter around johnny ive leaving and what's left of the company?urvive on services or does it need this next innovate product? >> i think the conversation has gone back and forth between, is his leaving a symptom of where apple is at right now? in other words, is the cutting edge design and the product-centric focus is not really where the company is, or was it just they weren't utilizing him correctly and he's offer to other things? i think obviously apple can survive it, but the question is, can the market pay up for that services business, when it isn't really purely a distinct edge that apple has, except for the fact that it can harvest from this ecosystem the same kind of things that people are getting from theirs, it just happens to have a bigger one. >> chris, the same question to you, your reaction to johnny ive making his departure last week and to play devil's advocate on the heels of that "wall street journal" report last week and some of the other coverage we've seen, could it actually potentially be a positive catalyst for this company

i think that is the case with johnny ives.nk he along with steve jobs a portfolio of amazing products. the products that have become iconic and society changing. but, he wants to do something else. apple has the kind of move on too. apple is becoming more of a mature, older company which is not as much as a revolutionary the way it used to be. a big company, a trillion dollar company. it has to behave like one. i talked to you about this previously. johnny ives or summit else, people will come, people will go. this company has to figure out a way to last longer. sort of how it goes from being apple of steve jobs to apple of the future, like walt disney of walt disney to disney company up-to-date. that is the transition apple needs to make. emily: do you think we will see apple continue to innovate radically in hardware and/or software or no? om: radically is a very strong word. i think they will try a lot of interesting things. they still have the design dna. those days of taking wild gambles probably are not going to be there

couldn't think of anybody better to discuss this than you considering that steve jobs told you that johnny ives met his soul mate. just your thought in and of itself of somebody like johnny ive leaving apple. >> i think the word virtual and soul mate are right on target. they had not just the mind melt but an emotional melt. everyday when jobs was in the office he would go at midday to that sort of big locked door that went to the desiep studio, be brought in they would feel not just the phone but the plug, the jack the way the wire coiled. everything else. and jobs at his core was a product person who loved johnny ive. i think what you're seeing now is a company that knows how to execute pretty well, but it doesn't have at its core these two spiritual core mates who lived and breathed the beauty of products. >> don't you think that what has been delivered at apple has been transformed into tim cook? he's been there a long time. he seems to get the ethos what they have been all about >> well, we'll see i think it would have been better to have the design chiefs report directly to him the user

a lot of current and former employees about his management style with johnny ives leaving.basically the entire design team reporting to him. tell us about jeff williams and what you have learned. mark: williams is a very respected manager, ceoo of apple. he does more than what his title seems to indicate. he oversees all product development at apple. he is in all the meetings with a lower level engineers. he's also a pretty modest guy. his big beach house in coastal california, he calls his shack. he has a knack for being pretty modest. he used to drive a toyota camry even though he was at an executive level. he would cycle between office meetings with far more junior employees. he's pretty much on the ground with the engineers, visiting the factories very often. he is a big part of what keeps apple running. if something were to happen to tim cook in the near term, he would be able to step in and there likely would not be any hiccups. emily: wink-wink in your story about him possibly being the heir apparent. tim gurman thank you so much. coming up, improving document workfl

we're at this moment where johnny ives steps back there was thatarticle in the journal saying he wasause he was distant, he was frustrated, a company that was more focused on operations than design. and cook, of course, pushed back on that article very publicly and forcefully, called it absurd, in his words i wonder if, you know, if it's operations and design, whether one supersedes the other or whether apple in 2019 is just so much bigger an broader an the company that johnny ive first joined maybe it's just that a company that doesn't sell tens of millions of products but hundreds of millions of products, it's that operations design just have to work more closely hand in hand more than ever >> josh, thank you very much apple closing at 200 bucks today, down a couple percent >>> a news alert on a potential bank deal. seema has the details. >> piper jaffray is nearing a deal to buy privately owned sandler o'neill. both investment banks are well known for orchestrating smaller deals, sandler with its expertise and advising banks on merger, equity offerings the deal could be announced

carol: he became the second most important person after it was announced johnny ives would leave the. jason: there is reporter mark gurman in los angeles. mark: at these major tech companies, apple included, there are two types of succession planning. there is what happens if something happens to the ceo tomorrow, and then there is the long-term replacement succeeds the ceo if he retires at a normal age. jeff williams is about three years younger and fits the mold for both. if something were to happen to tim cook, everyone we talked to says jeff williams would be able to slide in without the company missing a beat. in terms of long-term succession planning, it depends how much longer tim cook will be around. if he will remain the ceo for the next five or seven years, he is almost 60. jeff williams would be able to slide in. so he is the heir apparent. he is very likely to the next ceo depending on what happens to tim cook, not that there is any reason for him to step down in the imminent future. but very much long-term, 20 years from now, i don't think that person is even at apple ri

after the exit of design chief johnny ive, two design veterans are going to be reporting to coo jeff williams who did lead the development of the watch back to you. >> all right thank you. josh lippon in san francisco >>> let's trade this -- apple, tim? >> i just think that, first of all, there's nothing new that came out today with all due respect, as we like to say god bless their heart. i'm not coming after the analysts here. >> the service revenues are going to decline for the first time in four to six quarters >> i -- maybe that's new although i think a lot of people question -- dan's talk about this, that the service numbers was front loaded by replacement screens and things that are not necessarily a regular revenue stream what i would say is this is a company that's outperformed the s&p by 17% this year this is a company that tends to swing from overly -- the market dynamics are overly e-buhlients and overly sick lake like -- cyclical it's not going to be good. you have to believe that services is the future of the company. and you have to believe in a services blended multip

. >> we've heard that before >> jony ive, here's jony ive, johnny live is leaving, he's the design chief "the wall street journal" writes this piece that says that ive had grown frustrated with cook's leadership and alleged lack of interest in the design/production process, to which cook responded, which he rarely responds to this type of stuff. he called that story absurd. quote, a lot of the reporting and certainly the conclusions don't match the reality. so we made the point the other day that with all due respect to jony ive, the notion that ive is the only person in that that beautiful new building that knows how to design anything -- >> ludicrous >> absurd. >> ludicrous i agree with that. there's a strong management team there. and i think the conversation, the direction of what apple does, comes down to you philosophically, do you believe there's perceived weakness because of a slowdown related to a trade dispute with the chinese, and in addition to that, is there a fundamental slowdown in the business >> i feel like cook -- when cook told you, what was it, like a month ago now, w