there's an awful lot of raw fear. >> jon meacham?re looking at this as a time line where was the inflection point for the movement of what we think of as the religious right, the evangelical community, how ever you want to put it? where do you think the people of god became the interest group? >> that's -- you know, i would say if you look at it objectively i think it's before 2016. it was just exposed in 2016. so it's hard to know when exactly that occurred. but i would say there are triggering events in the obama administration that were legitimate threats to religious liberty that gave people cause for concern, and then there was a lack of perspective to elevate that concern beyond all reason. i can't tell you the number of people who i spoke to, i was against both trump and clinton, if clinton wins the constitution is over. america is over. there was just this atmosphere of fear and sometimes even almost hysteria that underlay -- that was in part of the undercurrent of the church. i feel like it's going to rear its head again in

and pulitzer writer jon meacham. he newest work. songs of america. lucky for us, he leaves the singing to a professional. welcome to you both. it appears democrats attached all of their hopes and dreams to robert mueller like something of a christmas tree. democrats were hoping for the movie companion to the book, and it certainly wasn't a marvel movie. i fear it was closer to "golden pond." and the question to you is, how has his legacy been affected? how will we look back on him and how might it have changed if he had simply not appeared? >> i think his legacy aside from the great service he's performed for his country during his entire life depends most recently on the report he wrote. i don't think it's going to depend on that performance and that hearing. but he was never going to be someone who had the performance skills to go into that room and deliver perry mason moments and convert american opinion from being at least on the fence about impeachment to being strongly for it. you know, compare it, brian, to let's say with richard nixon in the

i want to go to jon meacham on this. there are 47 million people here who are african-american, whose roots go back to before many european americans got here. 56 million hispanic people, many of them are color, almost 100 million people. this isn't a marginalized group of people in new york city, this is a big chunk of this country he's talking about today when he makes fun of people and says they should go home. >> and even the premise of the question, which is entirely fair, is giving him too much of a victory. giving the president too much of a victory. it's long been said -- president reagan said it quite well, that america's the one place on earth that is not about a birthright, it's about the ascent to an idea, an idea that was written in one of the most important sentences ever written in the english language that all men were created oil aequal and end by their creator with certain inalienable rights. that journey of a more perfect union is the story of the country. and what the president's done here is yet agai

and rogers professor of the presidency at vanderbilt university, jon meacham. he is of course an nbc news and msnbc contributor. mika of course went out to iowa yesterday to interview joe biden. we'll be showing you an extended interview today. she caught a late flight back, so she won't be with us today. but we're going to be bringing you the key moments of her sit down with the vice president straight ahead and throughout the morning. but jon meacham, before we get to all the nonsense and the chaos of yesterday, this sort of reminds me what trump has picked up on here is what we saw as little kids, bumper stickers during the vietnam war, which is america, love it or leave it. and i suppose it might be a more effective coming from donald trump if donald trump didn't build his entire political campaign over false conspiracy theories that lied about the presidents of the united states, that lied about america's crime rate. that lied about our standing in the world, that lied constantly to try to tear this country down. the man has spent his entire political care

jon meacham and tim mcgraw, thank you so much. second thought i do like to brag because i am mighty proud of that ragged old flag. old flagng. that's why there's otezla. otezla is not a cream. it's a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. with otezla, 75% clearer skin is achievable. don't use if you're allergic to otezla. it may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. otezla is associated with an increased risk of depression. tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. upper respiratory tract infection and headache may occur. tell your doctor about your medicines and if you're pregnant or planning to be. ready to treat differently with a pill? otezla. show more of you. but prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory. prevagen. healthier bra

. >> jon meacham, what did we witness this week?pter in the reflexive tribalism of the age. it is different even from, as michael was saying with nixon where it took a tape, it took the supreme court saying that the smoking gun tape ah had to come out to finally force the last act of the nixon presidency. even there, you know, you had into the summer of '74 you had a lot of partisan support for nixon, at least among republicans. we're now living in an era where that seems quaint, and there is an extraordinary number of folks who are simply impervious to contrary data. they don't care what director mueller has to say or what he and his team have written. therefore, you end up back in this place where it's the political nature of impeachment becomes the determinetive narrative. one of the big things to me at this point, it's also yet another example of politicians are far more often mirrors of who we are rather than molders. that's a pretty tough thing to think about, because if you are unhappy with the way things are going in the cou

jon meacham -- the question was they didn't have an zesters, and lincoln said it's the electric cordlaration of independence, and if you believe in equality, you're flesh of the flesh and blood of the blood. that's the vision of america. it's just sad. what's sad about the president is his ignorance. that's what america is founded on. that's what our caucus believes in. we're going to be an aspirational vision, and i guarantee that's going to win. you know how? i was the son of immigrants. i grew up in bucks county. i had teachers who believed in me, little league coach who is believed in me. i now represent the most economically powerful district in the world possibly. that's the story of america. not this president. >> ashley parker, you're a pretty close observer what's your view inserting himself into this divide? part of it are he just can't help himself, right? there might be a smidge of that, but the president no matter what right now is running a base turnout strategy. they talk about expanding the map. what they are doing is hoping to energize they core supporters who attrac

. >> and jon meacham who interviewed carter will be coming up.t the weather with bill. >> if i say mudslides, what would you think? >> california. >> this morning minnesota. highways are closed. out here in western portions of minnesota. they've had about 4 inches of rain overnight. police are reporting that highway 19 is closed. there is one here in southern areas of wisconsin. leaving a little dent. waves of storms with a lot of rain. minneapolis has been in the lighter portion. there is even more behind it. until about noon today, flash flood watches are up. we could even see isolated severe weather through nebraska, and mostly wind damage. maybe an isolated tornado. the peek is in april or may. it trails off in june. we don't usually get a lot of strong ones. you may get a weak one. that is about it. today's forecast is mild and warm. boston is one of the coolish type spots. typical showers and storms tuesday's forecast, not a lot of changes. in the rockies, 80s and 90s. the heat will turn on especially into wednesday. up to 90 degrees in ral