we're back with jon meacham. occasionally advises president biden. mark mckinnon is here as well. jon meacham, david brooks arrives at almost the exact conclusion that you sort of displayed for us about what he was trying to do. how do you sustain that? >> it is the great question facing the republic, and, again, it is not a joke. that's it. i mean the biden view, as david put it there, is that perpetual warfare is not a sustainable governing strategy. and i understand why a lot of people find that to be a vision that is incommensurate with the reality on the republican side. one of the problems we have in this country, and it could possibly be a fatal one, is that we don't have two functioning parties. this is not the both sidisms, one of our besetting sins. it is not true. i get in arguments with conservative friends a lot when they say, well, yeah, the capitol, but what about portland, you know, or what about, what about, what about. well, one party sustained -- created and sustained a lie that led to the most

jon meacham has been our guest tonight. thank you so much for coming. on coming up for, us this was the week the debate over children wearing masks in schools in our country, turned vicious. that story when we come back. story when we come back hey, i just got a text from my sister. you remember rick, her neighbor? sure, he's the 76-year-old guy who still runs marathons, right? sadly, not anymore. wow. so sudden. um, we're not about to have the "we need life insurance" conversation again, are we? no, we're having the "we're getting coverage so we don't have to worry about it" conversation. so you're calling about the $9.95 a month plan -from colonial penn? -i am. we put it off long enough. we are getting that $9.95 plan, today. (jonathan) is it time for you to call about the $9.95 plan? i'm jonathan from colonial penn life insurance company. sometimes we just need a reminder not to take today for granted. if you're age 50 to 85, you can get guaranteed acceptance whole life insurance starting at just $9.95 a month. there are no health questions so you ca

shirley is reading james watson's endad of days napoleon hill's -- jon meacham's franklin winston and michael dobbs one w minute to midnight. a lot of history titles there mr. shirley that one stood out to me and that was napoleon hill's think and grow risk. what is that about? >> that book it's been around for 100 years. my grandmother in georgia first turned me onto it when i was a young boy. it was kind of similar to other motivational books but it's different to. the power of positive thinking by norman vincent peel. similar to his book and its inspirational about how you achieve different means through spiritual means an economic means and social means. it's a book we read for pleasure and just to reenergize every couple years and i have for many years now. as a matter fact for many years i also whenever i hired a new person my pr firm i gave them a copy of it he does it contain so much useful information. >> host: another bookie tells you are reading reading his cf luis -- >> i love cf luis. he can be spurred so and be a libertarian. it teaches about ward's work is the devil and