. >> jonathan rauch is a columnist that supports same-sex marriage and believes a sweeping ruling inavor of olson and boies could backfire. >> then the issue is how do we feel about the supreme court ramming that down our throats. rights, durable, solid, lasting rights do not come from courts, they come from public consensus. they come from the fact that your fellow americans believe in this right and will help you enforce it and seek it. >> i remember when you two first took this case, and you came under a lot of criticism even within the gay community saying this was moving too quickly, and there wasn't any reason, this shouldn't just go through the state process. essentially, why rush this? >> part of our response to that is these people are suffering from discrimination every moment of every day, and if you tell them, yeah, you are a victim of discrimination and it's unfair and we believe it's unconstitutional, but why don't you live with it for a few more years? this is not what you do in this country. >>> coming up, an exclusive look. the high stakes and high pressure of going

. >> you can watch the entire program with jonathan rauch and all the programs featured here online at booktv.org. next, a debate about same-sex marriage. >> let me ask your question. often said by those who oppose same-sex marriage that it would, and this is a fairly common phrase, threat marriage as an institution. that is what you're suggesting in your introductory statement. now, what does that mean? in other words, how does it threaten marriage? an angry with you that, by the way, marriage is an institution that is not in great shape. we have a growing number of unmarried couples who choose not to get married. many of whom have children. granted all that, why does the authorization of same-sex marriage threaten that institution? >> number one, it requires us, as we heard, to redefine what marriages. it would require us to say that marriage is no longer will we have noted to be but, is instead , a specific commitment of love in other words, the redefinition is that no to people who have a commitment to one another is what marriages. in all of the public authority and the institutio

before we do that, i want to turn to jonathan rauch. jonathan is with the fraud section of the criminal division. is an expert on research into these types of frauds. donovan, i want to ask you about what the research that you're familiar with has shown with respect to these type of scams including romance scams. >> thank you jeff. i think one of the things that traditionally law enforcement has lacked is an understanding of how prevalent these types of consumer scams can be. as chuck noted a few moments ago, many times consumers don't report the types of consumer schemes in which law enforcement would be very interested, partly because embarrassment given the amount of money they may have paid out to one or multiple scams, and perhaps because they feel some sensitivity about what will happen if their adult children, others they know, learn how much they have lost. interestingly, the united kingdom last year the university issued a result of a study they have done specifically focusing on online romance scams targeting residents in the u

issue has been the extraordinary and lovely and moving ceremony she gave for my oldest friend, jonathan rauchutiful event for 100 people. i'm delighted to be here also with my friend margaret hoover who spoke first, you know if? if you had been so minded, you could have staffed this, you could have had a list of speakers entirely made up of hoovers, eisenhowers, bushes and cheneys. it wouldn't be quite the republican convention, but pretty close. and, in fact, i speak here today as one of the more than 130 republicans and conservatives who signed ken mehlman's brief in favor of equal marriage rights. [cheers and applause] and i think if ken had had another week, there'd have been twice as many. you know, republicans and democrats in this country have enough to disagree about. no shortage. yet there are many issues that are the property of no one party. the freedom of every american to pursue happiness as that american sees it under the law, that promise signed in the declaration of independence so many years ago is the promise that is coming true if our time. in our time. [cheers and applause