pennsylvania's attorney general is a democrat named josh shapiro.ded to this today by something that has the technical political term of calling bull pucky on it. he said today, quote, donald trump lost the 2020 election not only at the ballot box but dozens of times in court and his lies won't change that. if he and his crew of dangerous harrisburg republicans try to pull this bs in pennsylvania again, they will have to go through me. and they will lose. again. joining us now is pennsylvania attorney general josh shapiro. mr. attorney general, thank you for taking the time tonight, i appreciate you being here on a friday night. >> good to be with you. i didn't know you could say bull pucky on cable news, but i'm glad to know you can. >> i'm willing to endure the fines. i'm willing to do it in order to give the technical term for what you have done today. let me ask about what you meant by two things you said. number one, you called this a crew of dangerous harrisburg republicans. what did you mean by dangerous and what did you mean by they're going

joining me is josh shapiro, the attorney general of pennsylvania. ag shapiro, nearly every state undergoing this. in the case of states like georgia, both. now republicans in your state, some of whom visited the arizona audit, may be attempting to replicate what they saw there. in your state's case, there are some gop leaders basically saying, enough is enough. not here. what's your take on this, sir? >> we really have become the epicenter now here in pennsylvania. it's a continuation of the work they have been trying to do over the past year. remember, just prior to the election, there were 19 different lawsuits that were filed to make it harder for people to vote. we beat back every single one of them. after the votes were cast, there were more than 20 lawsuits filed to make it harder for certain people's votes to count. now what you are seeing is a continuation of that effort to try to make it harder for people to access the polls and to go back and relitigate an election that was safe and secure here in pennsylvania that joe biden won and donald

josh shapiro is a friend of mine. he's my mentor. he served in the pennsylvania house and i had the honor of serving in the pennsylvania house in his very seat for six and a half years, so i know the pennsylvania legislature and those legislators very, very well. attorney general shapiro said it very, very well. we're at a moment of just trying to figure out whether we want to rely upon truth or lies. you know, democracy is not about certainty, it's about possibility. and so what we have to decide is whether or not we will stand behind the truth and search for the truth, as we did today with mr. mcgahn in front of the judiciary committee, or we allow these elected leaders, would-be leaders, to continue the big lie. i reject the big lie. i just it's extraordinarily dangerous and for the pennsylvania republican legislators who went down arizona to take a look at the cyber ninja fraud of an audit, shame on them. sadly, i hear they know no shame. >> professor, i echo the congresswoman's sentiments. reading your material makes us a whole

with me now is pennsylvania attorney general josh shapiro. thank you for being here because it is easy to laugh at and mock giuliani for being mocked by trump and yet lying for him and losing his law license. i think what the judge said is the key and it's the point you've made as well. this resulted in actual death threats to real people, to real people who worked in elections. talk a little bit about that. >> it did. it not only resulted in actual death threats to great public servants here in pennsylvania, but as i've been saying now for months, it led directly to the violent insurrection on our capitol on january 6th. and in fact this panel who suspended his law license today made that point, that by abusing our courts and feeding them the big lie, presumably on behalf of donald trump, it stoked the fire and led to january 6th. this is very, very serious, as you correctly state. now, there's some good that came out of the news today, right? number one, it shows there is accountability in our system. number two, like i've been saying all a

joining us is pennsylvania attorney general josh shapiro.e have called on you auburn as pennsylvania is ground zero for the efforts on the ex-president's part to invalidate the election. do you feel that this moment is as ominous as any since election day? >> i think it's a scary and i think it's a dangerous moment not just in pennsylvania but across the country. right now the country needs some real truth telling. moral clarity. we need leaders willing to stand up and say and do the right thing. i think the lawmakers that you have been talking about here on the show today going to arizona on a hunt for donald trump conspireing to overturn the 2020 election is not only dangerous but distracts us from the very real irses here in pennsylvania and united states. they try to find votes for donald trump that simply do not exist. and what they're doing is dangerous. >> i have been on winning and losing presidential campaigns and the work of a losing campaign is usually to find out why people didn't vote for you and this is not that. this is to go

josh shapiro remarking, quote, the fact is these republican conspiracy theorists would rather travel across the country in service of the big lie than tell the trout to pennsylvanians, unquote, and as cnn's sara murray now reports for us, this is just the latest way trump supporters are trying to undermine faith in the u.s. voting system because one former president with a i a parentally brittle spirit cannot admit that he lost. ♪ >> reporter: alternate universe where voter fraud was rampant still luring in republicans as trump supporters trying to find new ways to upend democracy. trump attorney sydney powell saying trump could wind up back in the oval office. >> it should be that he could simply be reinstayed, that a new inauguration date is set and biden is told to move out of the white house and -- and -- and president trump should be moved back in. >> reporter: it's something trump believes could happen by august, according to meg haberman of the "new york times." >> there are people who are telling him things that are possible that are not possible which is exactly what we saw

i'm joined by pennsylvania attorney general josh shapiro. mr.ral, your reaction to senator masstriano and the sort of performance art performed there with gary tuchman. >> it's speak some truth here. i think that was not evident before. there are no legitimate lingering questions from the 2020 election. and let's also speak some truth. there have been two audits done here in pennsylvania by law. i heard the word "transparency" thrown around quite a bit a moment ago. you know what transparency would be? not lying to your constituents and not denying the simple facts that we had a safe and secure and free and fair election here in pennsylvania. so the question isn't why do another audit. i actually think the question is why are so many leading figures in the republican party, particularly here in pennsylvania, so focused and captured by the big lie. we are seven months after the last election. and they're doing that bidding for donald trump instead of doing the work on behalf of the good people of pennsylvania who deserve their services. and look,

pennsylvania's attorney general josh shapiro told rachel maddow this last night. >> this is who the

pennsylvania's attorney general josh shapiro told rachel maddow this last night. >> this is who the modern gop is, certainly who the modern gop is here in pennsylvania. heck, one of the three people who went down there is the leading republican candidate for governor. these are folks who are dangerous. these are folks who are trying to undermine our democracy. if they were to go forward with this sham audit, they would have to go through me. they will not succeed, and they will be violating their oath of office and i believe also committing a very serious, unethical conduct. >> well, according to e-mails released by a watchdog group late yesterday, the republican president of the arizona senate, karen phan, who ordered the ridiculous cyber ninja audit reportedly told constituents she was in cahoots with trump's personal attorney, rudy giuliani, and that then president trump personally called and thanked her for, quote, pushing to prove any fraud, which is an interesting way to phrase it. speaking of rudy giuliani, in addition to making hour-long videos on ufos and schilling foam pillows, a

let's listen to josh shapiro. sylv>> i don't think we can just simply dismiss these folks as french. this is who the modern gop is. certainly who the modern gop is here in pennsylvania. heck, one of those three people who went down there is the leading republican candidate for governor. >> and he is talking about somebody who is running for governor in pennsylvania. this has now moved from fringe into mainstream, and it is definitely now looking like policy of the gop. you've been up close and personal with this in the impeachment. what do we do about this now? >> number one, i am delighted to be with you. and professor, i'm delighted to be with you. i have to tell you that your book raises is on my coffee table, and it's heavily marked up. joshua pirro is a friend of mine. he is my mentor. he served in the pennsylvania house and i had the honor of serving in the pennsylvania house in his very seat for six and a half years. so, i know the pennsylvania legislature and those leopard legislators, very, very well. att

. >> pennsylvania attorney general josh shapiro said it won't happen in his state.nt's followers want to rep kate -- replicate what's happening there. >> here in maricopa county, the board of supervisors declined to repeal. and if they had appealed, i don't know what outcome would have been but we might not be in this place right now, so challenge at every turn that's possible, and looking ahead, tighten our laws to make sure we can't have this type of thing happen again. >> arizona secretary of state, we know you're busy, we wanted to talk to you this week, and we're grateful you made time for us today. thank you so much for spending time with us. >> thank you. >>> when we return, that remarkable report from the united states government about, yes, ufos, while there's no evidence that those strange flying objects are alien spacecraft, they're not ruling it out either. that story is next. t ruling it out either. that story is next [sfx: fire truck siren] onstar, we see them. okay. mother and child in vehicle. mother is unable to exit the vehicle. injuries are unknow

pennsylvania's attorney general josh shapiro, always great to talk with you about all of this. thank you for spending time with us. >>> joining our conversation, reporter katy benner is here. "the washington post" contributing columnist, donna edwards is here, lucky for us both msnbc contributors. last night you scooped the documents released to the committee today, but it builds on earlier reporting, two pieces, one of this bizarre inside threat at doj, this individual that donald trump wanted to roe place mr. rosen, and the effort about meadows' efforts to overturn the election results in six states. just tie three of those pieces together with today's revelation. >> sure. we saw today the president himself reached ute. he was pressuring hem to use the justice department to legitimize and reinvigorate two different legal cases that had fallen in the courts. one was brought by sydney powell, you know, claiming there was election fraud in a state that had already done a hand recount, showing there was not. the other was a bizarre supreme court brief that already failed and had