joyce vance, barbara, and kimberly atkins. first, what will happen. what is at stake and how did we get here? the 100 united states senators will decide this case. 67 are needed for a conviction. that means if all democrats vote for conviction, they need 17 republicans to join them, which may seem daunting, but that's before a single piece of evidence has been presented. there are certainly some key republican senators to watch. the ones who have already suggested they may be open to conviction, but others who are either retiring or have a good deal of time before they actually face voters again. and, of course, there is always the wild card, senator mitch mcconnell. >> you go into the impeachment trial still having an open mind about -- >> look, i want to listen to the arguments. i think that's what we ought to do. >> so the case house managers will present is simple and straightforward as well. a single article of impeachment. that's basically accusing donald trump of inciting insurrection. saying, quote, he is singularly responsible for the january

attorney joyce vance in a little bit. ten house republicans joined democrats in voting to impeach mr. trump and still feeling fallout from that. wyoming democratic party voted overwhelmingly to censure liz cheney. she said her oath to uphold the constitution does not bend or yield to politics or partisanship. cheney is third ranking republican in house leadership. she kept that position last week after gop colleagues voted to keep her as chair. we'll dig into the politics of it. first weekend of black history month, this observance of the past aims to help us build a better future and could help us fight two of the biggest threats -- covid-19 and conspiracy theories. we'll explain and give chance to share your story. >>> covid relief, after long week of debate, house and senate passed a budget resolution. what does that mean? doesn't mean they passed covid relief, nor that the window for bipartisan action has closed. mostly means that democrats decided to pass covid relief with a simple majority and to do that had to use

attorney joyce vance. everybody, welcome. leann, majorie taylor greene yesterday sounding like she was contrite, sort of, on the house floor, distancing herself from those conspiracy theories. today she sounded like her old self. >> yeah. well, she started her press conference talking about policy. her deeply conservative policy beliefs. but then it took a turn. there's a couple things that stood out to me. it's clear that majorie taylor greene will continue to be a troll. she will troll the left. she's going to troll the media. and even her republican colleagues who she thinks is not sufficiently conservative enough. she said that when she is no longer -- or she will have a lot of free time because she doesn't have committee work do which takes up a lot of lawmakers time around here that she will continue to espouse her conservative beliefs and she says push her party to the right. the other thing that stood out to me is that it was very clear after her news conference that the party is nowhere near united than republicans a

would react if they were angry at how their followers were acting. >> joining our discussion now, joyce vancermer u.s. attorney. she's a professor at the university of alabama school of law and msnbc legal contributor. and she is the co-host of the podcast, "sistersinlaw." joyce, thank you very much for joining us tonight. with your local experience, i don't want to presume to guide you, i just want to open it up for, give us your highlights of what you saw in the senate trial today. >> i think the first thing we have to say, lawrence, is that this was a real prosecutorial dream team. seasoned professionals through and through. just about the facts and the law with an elegant presentation that will create the record for history that we need of these events but the ultimate takeaway here, i think this is your comment, the senate is actually on trial here and the prosecutors very deliberately gave senators the option that they could be in the trump camp, that they could be part of the insurrection or there was a possibility for republicans and democrats alike to stand up for what was good in ou

and joining me now is andrew weissman, and joyce vance, former u.s. attorney.nk you both for being here. andrew, you tweeted today that there's an appeal that is sitting in the supreme court about donald trump's attempt to block cyrus vance and his probe in to him. it seems that the system is gummed up when it comes to trump. we know in the past, there's been indictments of vice presidents, and former attorneys general, never of a president. do you think the idea of indicting a president, do you think that is gumming up the works? >> well, this country has not had a history of that, although, other so-called western democracies have had the experience of bringing their leaders to account. and you know, this, to your first guest tonight, congress woman dean said something i think particularly relevant to this discussion, she closed by saying, if we the do not deal with our past, it's going to be our future. and that applies to donald trump and to any future president. if we are a nation of laws, it means that our president and now former president should be held

joining us now, joyce vance. good to see you this afternoon. thank you for joining us on this.om the "wall street journal" that has new york prosecutors now investigating specifically loans the former president took on four buildings, including his flagship building that you see in the graphics background there, trump tower. all know now the president has called this investigation a witch-hunt as he does all investigations placed into him. and it is led by cy vance. what does this latest investigation speak to what is happening right now in the state of new york when it comes to the former president? >> we don't know a lot about the specific contours of this new investigation, but, yasmin, it follows a very familiar pattern. because as a prosecutor when you begin to look into one instance of misconduct in the white collar fraught or white collar crimes area very often that becomes a path that you follow. people don't tend to just violate or engage in one form of fraud. it tends to be more of an epidemic across their business lineage. so it looks like cy vance in the course of i

and also, we're joined by federal prosecutor joyce vance. suzanne, you have seen more than most. joyce will do the law, but what do you think the d.a. is combing through here? because at a minimum, your intrepid reporting showed a lot of irregularities and a level of payments that's lower than most americans. >> yeah. they have right now, they've got eight years of donald trump's tax returns, personal and corporate. and as well they've got the books and records of the accounts, and that's going to show the communication that went back and forth between the accounting firm and the trump organization, comments that may have been made about what to file and what not to file. in addition, i think they have a lot of other records from banks. i think put together, it's going to be very, very powerful in terms of where they can go with it. our investigation showed that there is a lot there and a lot that they can look at. we found a lot of stuff that was irregular. we would have needed a subpoena to start getting other records which we don't have, but we saw a lot of stuff and i'm sure t

to be in joyce vance's house. t ladies now, the second impeachment trial, of course, of this president. starts on tuesday. joyce, you first. you have donald trump's lawyers who told nbc news he's not going to testify at the trial, he's not going to submit a written statement. and that's in response to lead impeachment manager jamie raskins' request he indeed testify under oath. can, should democrats subpoena him? >> this is not a criminal case where the defendant would be able to assert a fifth amendment privilege against self-incrimination to avoid testimony. so defendants actually could go ahead and subpoena. it will be interesting to see if they do. this is a win/win for the democrats. either the president testifies with all of the problems that we know that would bring or he doesn't respond to the democrats' narrative, in which case think can point to that. so they win either way. >> what happened on tuesday, melissa, when you had donald trump's attorney filing the former president's answer to his second impeac

and then it will be up to the voters to decide how those lawmakers are held to count. >> joyce vance,rly atkins, thank you for sticking around and thank you for your podcast. again, if you haven't listened, you should take a listen. to hae more from their legal minds, tune in to their podcast #sistersinlaw, out on apple, spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. that wraps up the hour for me. the special look at the second impeachment trial of donald trump. i'm yazman vossoughian. "politics nation" with reverend al sharpton is up next after a quick break. our son says, since tide antibacterial fabric spray kills 99.9% of bacteria, he wants us to spray everything every time we walk into the door. it's just to be sure. just to be sure! tide antibacterial fabric spray. time to start brushing with parodontax toothpaste? if your gums bleed when you brush, the answer is yes. the clock may be ticking towards worse... parodontax is 3x more effective at removing plaque, the main cause of bleeding gums parodontax at heinz, every ketchup starts with our same tomatoes. but not every tomato ends

joyce vance, a former federal prosecutor, and juanita tolliver, political director with supermajority. joyce, your thoughts on what a fair, independent, and apolitical constitutional trial should entail. >> it's tough to get an apolitical impeachment trial in the senate because as you've noted, ari, it's ultimately a political creature. this is very different from a trial we'd see in a criminal court where there would be a lot of due process guarantees and traditional formalistic guarantees. rules of evidence, rules protecting a defendant. the best that we can hope for in the senate, because the rules are in fact whatever a majority of the senators say they are, is that we will see a process that permits the evidence to be fully laid out so that the american people who are really a secondary jury riding along the senate here, so that there can be a chance to learn the truth and have accountability if not in this senate courtroom then down the road in the ballot box. >> right. and juanita, as joyce says, those rules really do go wherever the senate takes them. i don't know if joyce was

attorneys and msnbc contributors, chuck rosenberg and joyce vance. thank you for coming to "the sunday show." >> good to be with you. >> joyce, i am going to start with you. and i'm going to ask you the same question, chuck, and that is, what did you make of senate minority leader mitch mcconnell going in on donald trump and his culpability and how he is directly responsible and saying that, you know, his legal woes aren't over. >> it's really hard not to be cynical in the face of a statement like the one mitch mcconnell made yesterday. he did an extraordinary job of laying out the case against donald trump, and he made it plain that case was apparent for everyone to see. that there was very little question about whether or not trump was practically responsible for what we saw on january 6th. so, you know, the question is how much cynicism do we entertain going forward? so many times we've seen this president avoid accountability. we're here to discuss whether there are future mechanisms for his accountability, and people are, i think, right to be a l

would react if they were angry at how their followers were acting. >> joining our discussion now, joyce vanceof alabama school of law and msnbc legal contributor. and she is the co-host of the podcast, "#sistersinlaw." joyce, thank you very much for joining us tonight. with your local experience, i don't want to presume to guide you, i just want to open it up for, give us your highlights of what you saw in the senate trial today. >> i think the first thing we have to say, lawrence, is that this was a real prosecutorial dream team. seasoned professionals through and through. just about the facts and the law with an elegant presentation that will create the record for history that we need of these events but the ultimate takeaway here, i think this is your comment, the senate is actually on trial here and the prosecutors very deliberately gave senators the option that they could be in the trump camp, that they could be part of the insurrection or there was a possibility for republicans and democrats alike to stand up for what was good in our country and to say, you cannot do this, you cannot te

also joining me is joyce vance. become both of you. presenting them to the grand jury, we know initially this investigation was all about mush money payments, what might these documents and tax returns show on that front? >> nobody has seen it, you can rest asure that trump has tried to keep everybody or the district attorney from seeing it. you know the book "the emperor's new clothes" we're going to see a new sequel of "the emperor has no clothes." trump with the hush money payments did not declare it for whatever way that you would declare it. i'm not an accountant so i don't know, but i'm sure you can't deduct it as a legal fee or some other manner that i'm is your honor that is exactly what he did. they say they moved on to investigating other financial manners as well. i know you testified that he inflated his assets according to who he was reporting to. what might these documents refer to about that. >> they might have the ax -- the department of transaction for the populations that could be owned by trump and he will compare th

join me with my panel of legal experts, joyce vance, barbara mcquaid, wine banks, and kimberly atkins as we discuss what you can expect in the coming impeachment trial of donald trump. maybe we will talk a little bit of football ahead of the super bowl. who knows? >>> the "washington post" has put a price tag on president trump's efforts to undermine the election with lies. the price tag is staggering. the paper is saying it has cost taxpayers $519 million. $519 million. by the way, that number is continuing to grow. the post reviewed local, state and federal expenditures tabulating legal fees prompted by fruitless lawsuits, increased security due to death threats against poll workers for instance in the state jaff gentleman. it also includes the costly repairs needed after the january 6th riots at the capitol as well as the expense of amassing thousands of national guard in washington, d.c. in the midst of extremist violence. >>> some republicans are accusing democrats of moving forward on their $1.8 trillion covid stimulus relief beale without their approval. -- said the white house

attorney and msnbc contributor joyce vance with us. you've seen this video.his be convincing enough to get some republican senators to vote to convict? >> this video will be part of a package of evidence that house managers during the impeachment trial will present and the thrust of the argument they have to make here is not just that the events happened but that the president, in a sense, directed them. that the former president was the force that incited the riot either personally or through the events he hosted on the ellipse that morning. impeachment is a funny creature, kendis. it's not a criminal trial where we're talking about proof of a crime beyond a reasonable doubt. it's a political judgment that the senators, who were also witnesses and victims, will have to make. it's difficult to say with certainty what will influence them. i know from trying cases that when juries can see something. when you show them video or when they listen to the person on trial's words on tape, that can have more force than just about any other kind of evidence. >> mcconne

. >> joyce vance and paul butler, thank you both for that analysis. that was great.e it. >>> ahead to the roughly three hours of jumbled argument on the trump team, did it provide enough cover for the trump team? we'll talk about that next. for? we'll talk about that next once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to and stay undetectable. that's when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test. research shows people who take h-i-v treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit h-i-v through sex. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. tell your doctor about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. if you have hepatitis b, do not stop taking bik

peter alexander joys us now and joyce vance, former u.s. attorney from alabama. peter, you sent me my copy. i've been thumbing through it as i can. you've been reading through it carefully. as expected, they are objecting on a constitutional basis first and fore most. >> reporter: this is the 14-page document, that pretrial filing that was due at noon today. we've received it from the office of the former president, donald trump. it boils down to a couple arguments, calling on members of thediiss the case. it says among other things that it should be dismissed as moot and in violation of the constitution because the senate, they say, in the filing lacks jurisdiction to remove from office a man who does not hold office. so this breaks down to a couple different things. one, the constitutionality claim, the claim it's not constitutional for a former president to be impeached since they're no longer in office. on top of that, they said the president's speech on january 6th, the incitement of insurrection as claimed by the house impeachment managers was protected by

still with me, neil katyal, joyce vance, paul butler, elie mystal. joyce, i'm coming to you first.georgia case specifically? >> the georgia case is really interesting, because the statute looks like it was written for what trump did. he notoriously called the georgia secretary of state and said, "i need 11,780 votes." one more than he would have needed to win the election. that is classic solicitation of voter fraud, which the statute addresses. so, i think it's important that we model our expectations about what the d.a., fanny willis, could accomplish in this case. the statute largely has misdemeanor provisions. it's possible that there's a felony involved here. that would be significant to convict the former president of a felony. no one should expect to see him go to jail for a long time, if at all. the statute is a one to three years provision and i think it's likely, given all of the complications involved in putting a former president in prison, what do you do with his secret service agents, that he might end up under home arrest or probation, even if convicted. so, good to

we are happy to have joyce vance, former u.s. saturday morning to unpack it all. joyce, several-million document documents were turned over by trump's long-time accounting firm. and what are you looking to find out? >> well, this is a treasure trove of potential evidence for the manhattan district attorney. the tax documents, themselves. the filings are -- are clean documents. but now, vance has in his hands the records that underlie the tax filings. communications, calculations. it's really a way of assessing, whether or not criminal conduct occurred. and if so, who's responsible? so, vance isn't coming to this fresh. he's obviously been investigating for a long time. he's talked to witnesses, including michael cohen, who may have provided him with some sign posting of where to look for. now, he's got the actual evidence in his hands. and it'll be interesting to see what direction or directions that takes him. >> give me a sense what happens when you get these -- this sort of volume of records. it's tedious work, no doubt. are t

joining me now, msnbc contributor, jill winebanks, also, msnbc contributor, joyce vance, a professor h you. with the news that we've learned, overnight. certainly, from senator whitehouse. that he wants to hear from kevin mccarthy and senator tommy tuberville about what they -- what conversations they had with the president, during all of this. the fundamental question being, can democrats force mccarthy or senator tuberville to testify with a subpoena? how does that work in an impeachment trial? >> so, it could conceivably get messy, if democrats make an effort to have unwilling witnesses testify. but the important thing to -- to think about here is that there are really three juries for this proceeding. this is the senate jury. there is the american public. but there is, also, history. and it might make sense, even though there's very little political will to expend additional time in this trial. but it may well make sense for the jury of history to ensure that democrats leave no stone unturned, in an effort to disclose the truth about what happened in this setting. this would be ti

garrett haake on capitol hill, monica alba in west palm beach, florida, joyce vance. we've been looking at that video of david schoen leaving capitol hill very late yesterday. >> uh-huh. >> followed by, i think, a dozen reporters who did a fairly lengthy interview with him. tell us more about what he said. >> reporter: he's expecting a short set of arguments today, three to four hours and they move to questions and they view their task as relatively straightforward. they want to keep the 44 senate republicans who thought this trial was unconstitutional on tuesday still thinking it's unconstitutional today. and their arguments will also focus on some of those other issues you laid out, the question of whether the managers here, the prosecution in this case, rose to the level of proving this was incitement and, yes, don't be surprised to see them throw some what aboutism chaff into the air here about how democrats reacted to protests over the course of the summer and how they used similar language to what the president has used. but the defense is also going to have to

. >> joyce vance and paul butler, thank you both for that analysis. that was great.ppreciate it. >>> ahead to the roughly three hours of jumbled argument on the trump team, did it provide enough cover for the trump team? we'll talk about that next. >>> lawyers for donald trump had >>> lawyers for donald trump had one main goal, give the excuses they needed so they could acquit. they acted extremely offended with the case against the ex-president and gave themselves cover to not hold trump accountable. did they do enough to keep senators from convicting? i have former senator humphrey and barbara comstock from west virginia. congresswoman, tell us how you think the trump lawyers worked in that scenario. >> i don't think they had much to say. it sounded like a twitter feed. they didn't have a lot of information, and already we know two false things they said, that tommy tuberville did tell the president what was going on there, and also that the president did know about mike pence being in danger. >> senator, i know that you are a strong trump critic. i've had you on t

attorney for the northern district of alabama and msnbc legal analyst, joyce vance. we heard this directly from mitch mcconnell. after he voted to acquit, he said, yes, i voted to acquit but i will leave it to the courts to this impeachment trial. if you are donald trump, where would you be looking first for your greatest exposure and threat? >> mitch mcconnell was quick to kick the can down the road to the justice department not realizing there were two purposes served in the impeachment and criminal justice system. but the former president faces a three-ring circus here. each of the districts poses eta real threat to him in some cases in new york, there appear to be criminal prospects from the state and from the federal government. let's talk about georgia, willie. it seems tailor made for the president's conduct. of course it's on tape, which is something prosecutors like to have when they talk to juries. the charge would be something in the area of solicitation of the georgia secretary of state to engage in election fraud with the former president, who was very s

joyce vance former u.s. attorney, she is also an msnbc contributor.om right there in maryland, donna. and because i think in a lot of ways for me this was sort of the thesis, if you will, from yesterday. we will play the sound and talk about it on the other side. here is the congressman. >> afterwards, overwhelmed by emotion, he broke down in the rotunda and he cried for 15 minutes. and he shouted out, i got called an n word 15 times today. and then he recorded, i sat down with one of my buddies, another black guy in tears just started streaming down my face and i said, what the f, man? is this america? that's the question before all of you in this trial. >> is this america? congresswoman edwards, i mean, we just heard from the president. he thinks minds may have been changed on wednesday. what say you to that? my mis -- any minds changed? >> i hope so. i think that's the compelling question, not just of yesterday but this entire proceeding. is this america? is this the kind of america that we want where a president of the united states can incite peo

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