host: kathleen swarts men, as we enter a new presidency and discussion about trade and revamping nafta, have you reached any conclusions? guest: one of the ironies i think is the way-- i think of it is with the world trade organization and what it promotes, free trade that one branch of the united nations, which is this committee on migrant rights tries to familiar eight, so you have these wto's and the un organization affiliated, but you have the un pushing one way and then other organizations trying to protract migrant rights from the anti- immigrant sentiment that breaks out in countries. it's a bit different than the current discussion about trade, so when i think of what's been done by that food agricultural organization, they talk about important surges. again, this is not about the developed country, it's about the developing one, so they talk about when cotton was the barrier on cotton in india there was like 18000 suicides. these were cotton producers who couldn't make a living producing their cotton compared to the cost of the imported cotton, so the trait theory is elegant.