host: you are on the program with katrina vanden heuvel.ler: i had a comment on the immigration issue. i do not think we need immigration reform because there are people here from turkey, greece, russia, poland, all over the world, and they are able to find their way to an immigration office, take the test, pledge allegiance and try and become nationalized american , iizens, but the issue think, is that we have people from central and south america that come here and they really do not have a desire to become nationalized. they just want to be here and work and send all of their money back. i'm a blue-collar worker, so i have done a lot of food and beverage, so i have worked with a lot of people from central and south america. -- they dom even try not have a desire to become american citizens. they are here, and i think that , because they are existing outside of -- guest: i hate to stereotype and categorize millions of people from a part of the world in one swoop, with all respect. i think many of the people you are describing do want to c

katrina vanden heuvel, richard haase is the council of foreign relations and bret stephens editor for the "wall street journal." we begin negotiations and they get some kind of concessions, life goes on, then they threaten, again, or they cheat and threaten, again. but is there a danger here that this thing will spin out of control? >> certainly a danger, fareed. and it is true, like cue up the north korea column. so, if i cue up the north korea column, it always comes to the same conclusion. one power that could end this story very quickly. human tragedy of north korea and this incredible farce of a regime and that country is called china. north korea gets its food by fuel to china. keeping the border seal would north korea, it basically reinforces the camp. ann applebaum had a post, you open up the border to north korea, just like opening the border to east germany. >> but, of course, that's why the chinese know that. and the south koreans know, in a weird sense, nobody wants north korea to collapse. >> one thing from the chinese, they love north korea so much, they want them to be

in fact katrina vanden heuvel on this program a friend recently penned an article in the washington post recommending use the chair the next chair for the f.c.c. which increasingly sells a great idea to me. do you think that the commission has done its job in protecting consumers and use those an appropriate role for the f.c.c. to be bringing about this vision that your circular to the f.c.c. is statute would allow it to take all of the actions that i've just described the problem is they're under enormous political pressure there is no upside to taking on the incumbents at this point because the budget guys the appropriators on the hill. could be stirred up by the incumbents if they're if the f.c.c. tries to do anything serious and the budget for the agency could be gutted so the political pressure to which the f.c.c. is subject is really extraordinary what station and they are the solution is leadership it took f.d.r. it out it took the president to take on the electrical private companies in the twenty's and thirty's today it would take president obama putting this on the top of the l

katrina vanden heuvel for the at how progressive values are featured in political battles. and later cynthia ogden forrom the cdc and