kerik isn't seeking immunity. if they want him to testify, then the hurdle that they have to overcome so that he won't plead the fifth is they have to give him immunity. >> but you said they publicly identified him but he was an unnamed co-conspirators, wasn't he? >> well it is been pretty clear who a lot of these co-conspirators are. and so when they describe someone like that, co-conspirator number five is clearly mr. kerik and your network has been on top of that as far as identifying all of these people. so simply the fact that they didn't say his name in the document doesn't change the fact that they have identified him by his actions as being a member of this conspiracy. and that is something that then implicates the fifth amendment. >> so you say prosecutors have told you, quote, if we waned to indict mr. kerik, we would have already done so. and your client is one of 30 unindicted co-conspirators in your case. so it doesn't seem like fani willis might suddenly decide to go after your client. it seems like

kerik's attorney says, you know, basically you have two options.nity or we will have a hearing before the judge and he will determine if this is incriminating or not. but mr. kerik's whole point, through his attorney, is that this creation of, yours d.a. willis, that you named me as an unindicted coconspirator. and if you want to retract that and assure me in writing that i am not going to be prosecuted, i will be your witness. it is interesting, though he is on can chaz burrows list too. and there are some issues with trying to get on out of state witness to testify in the state of georgia. it would be much more of a burden for mr. -- to testify. but with him being named as an unindicted coconspirator, i cannot imagine that mr. kerik would do anything other than take the fifth if he were a defense witness. >> amy lee copeland, thank you very much for your invaluable local knowledge of the way things work in georgia courts. andrew weissmann, thank you for joining this discussion. and andrew, please stay with us for the next one, because coming up,

kerik. with the special counsel's investigation, he and his attorney sat down for an interview with investigators working for jack smith in their investigation into january 6th, and efforts to subvert the election. but he is not an unindicted co-conspirator in this case. that appears to be a much more narrow case. of course, former president trump, the only one to be charged as of now. his lawyer says ahead of that interview, he received a standard proffer letter, got the regular assurances, but it's quite a different situation down in fulton county, where they have listed him in that broad indictment. so i think any good defense attorney is going to ask for some sort of assurances before letting their client take the stand. right now parle tori says, if you don't give us these assurances, he'll take the fifth to every single question you ask him. >> paula reid, thank you for the reporting. >>> california governor gavin newsom moved quickly to replace the late senator dianne feinstein. we'll

is former new york city police commissioner bernard kerik prepared to turn on trump?>> tonight, former new york city police commissioner bernard kerik wants immunity in the georgia election subversion case after the district attorney issued a subpoena for the trump ally to testify. cnn's senior legal affairs correspondent paula reid is working the story for us. reported first right here on cnn. paula, how significant would it be for kerik to gain immunity and to actually testify? >> this would be a big win for prosecutors. clearly, they're trying to secure a pretty key witness. he is not named in the indictment, but we have identified him as unindicted co-conspirator number five. and the indictment lays out how he attended meetings with lawmakers from arizona and pennsylvania to states that trump was trying to overturn. he was also present for a key meeting at the white house in late november with mark meadows, rudy giuliani, jenna ellis. so he could potentially provide a lot of really critical testimony for prosecutors. but his lawyer, tim parlatore says today two th

we don't expect that bernie kerik is going to be charged.hat case of january 6th appears to be much more tailored but he does say in this letter to the district attorney's office, look, if they want any grants of immunity they should be coordinating with special counsel jack smith. >> paula reid, goo to see you. >>> we'll, of course, be following the latest developments from a courtroom in the civil trial of donald trump and his sons we'll have a live update next.

. >> did you hear when parlatore was on the other day, represents bernie kerik and said he has testimonyo share that would help with that? >> yeah. i think it's going to be interesting to see the wrangling with the various witnesses. we're starting to see some of that. they mentioned in court today that the prosecution had just offered up a preliminary list of 174 potential witnesses who may come up at trial, and we saw some court filings earlier today with the judge overseeing this case essentially approving the d.a.'s efforts to seek testimony for a handful of out of state -- >> boris epshteyn. >> boris epshteyn is one of the people on the list. lawrence tavis, who is the pennsylvania gop chair who was supposed to serve as a fake elector in pennsylvania but ultimately didn't do so. again, this is the kind of wrangling we're going to see ahead of trial trying to get these witnesses to come in from out of state, trying to force people to testify who clearly don't want to testify. >> i don't know if they watch "the lead" in fani willis's office, but clearly parlatore was trying to signal,

many in the crowd kerik signs with the names and faces of the missing.s held banners saying that prime minister benjamin netanyahu head full responsibility for the failures that led to the terrorist attack and called on him to resign. the continued grief and anger comes as we learn more about the plant behind italy's terrorist attack in israel's history. including exclusive reporting from nbc news at the october 7th hamas attackers carried within detailed maps and plans. top secret hamas documents obtained by nbc show terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and our youth center. joining me now is nbc news national security editor david rohde and with us from israel, the editor and chief of the jerusalem post. david, to start with you. your reporting is -- as a mother of elementary school students, it's really a bad shock of what they were targeting. but it seems like from reading this, how moss knew who they wanted to attack, the head advanced plans, advanced details. it seems like they were underestimated to some degree. and i'm also very s