>> i think that with standards like that, kongman, there is a gray area and then there is a core. and is within the core, there is really no question the people perpetrating acts within that core, they know what they're doing is probably wrong and yet they do it anyway. in the gray area, it's a little harder to judge. and i think we should tread more cautiously in the gray area. so -- but as you say, these are terms that have been defined over decades -- >> actually, centuries. >> well, that's true. and it goes back to the common law in many instances and then when they were codified into statutory law. there's still a lot of years of courts interpreting them further. but some of them is very well-plowed ground at this point. and i think that the main outlines of how people mistreat their customers are pretty well defined. when they see that that's happening or they see that that's very likely happening, they should be hesitating. they should be rethinking. and i think that that's entirely appropriate. >> of you said there are gray areas and core areas. you have enforcement powers

>> okay, thank you, kongman. i want could be careful in my response. that is an open pending rule making for us. we were, as you said, given the mortgage loan originator compensation rule that the federal reserve enacted and finalized last year. but we were given authority under the law, and, in fact, required to do some work in that area, as well, by january of this coming year. this is an issue that we're looking at. there are other issues we're looking at, such as the -- perhaps unintended effects on pension arrangements and bonus arrangements, especially at some of the smaller institutions. we have a whole process on that. we have comments that we're digesting. we'll be glad to speak further with you. i'm not sure how much i should say publicly. >> i'm sure you've been -- you've seen situations where you get ready to close, you prestated your costs up front. the rule they've applied doesn't allow any leeway at all in that. and you have had situations where everybody sits around a table and is saying, well, this is occurring, we need this type of a