lars patrick berg, thank you for joining >> interesting. patrick berg, thank you forjoining me. berg, thank you for joining me. well, that was really fascinating. i really think that something happening, something very big is happening out there. i'm joined by stella santokhi, former advisor to several labour politicians, and ranil jayawardena, amongst other things, a former environment secretary, quite relevant for the debate about water today. but let's just begin with this your native country, greece, you know, there's been such anger at the numbers coming that the millions of pounds to off millions of pounds to the rwandan government, so of course , rwandan government, so of course, the rwanda. >> i mean, you think you don't think , stella, that illegal think, stella, that illegal immigration is a problem, do you? >>i you? >> i think it is a problem. i agree, i think it is a problem. i just think that the rwanda plan was an ineffective, extremely expensive plan that would have costed us £150,000 per person. that's an insane amount of mo