the senate and lbj. senators of both parties who led the debate on each title of the bill, and so many lesser-known figures, all members of the bipartisan team of senate staff who were just as important to the story as the senators they represented. 50 years later, we concluded the senate's debate and passage of the civil rights act of 1964 remains a fascinating and remarkable achievement. thank you. [applause] >> thank you. i'm going to asked my colleague kate scott to join me at the podium. we share responsibility for the brownbag talks and would be happy to take questions or comments. there is a c-span person with a microphone if you want to raise your hand for that. before you leave the room, let me remind you we have two more events coming up. two weeks from today, we have the conversations with the historian. that will be a fascinating talk with the senate historian along with roger mudd and andy glass, who were there in 1964 covering the story. it will be a great discussion two weeks from today at

history has proven lbj dead right on that. before 1964 was a democratic bastion, it was the most reliably democratic part of the country because of reconstruction that brief interlewd after the civil war when civil rights and racial equality were imposed on the newly reconstituted south. the reconstruction ended with the hayes-tildon election of 1976 and the jim crowe era began. literacy tests and all the other forms of legal oppression. legal rekroks had been a republican project, a project of liberal republicans from the north. because of that, almost every white southerner was a democrat, con servetives, segregationist democrats. just how democratic was the jim crowe south? look at this, in 1936, fdr won 19 99% of the vote in south carolina, 99%. you get 97% in mississippi. 87 in georgia. essentially there was no republican party in the south back then, but the civil rights movement changed everything. blacks couldn't vote in the south, but they could in the north. with their white allies up there, they turned on the pressu

. >> all: lbj, lbj, lbj. >>> and hot in cleveland. cavs fans in a frenzy as the greatest basketball player on the planet, lebron james, says he's ready to come home. >> lebron is coming back. >> what's behind the king's move back to the city where he once broke millions of hearts, and who else will be cashing in as all appears to be forgiven? >>> yes. hey, good morning. we're going to talk about the sudden turnaround, the emotional turnaround in cleveland where they're all of a sudden very forgiving. coming up. >> they're very excited. >> they're very excited, as well. >>> but we're going to start here with a traveler's nightmare. you're flying over the water in one of the remote spots on earth when the smoke starts to fill the cabin, alarms are sounding, the pilot comes over the speakers to say the radar is down and they need to make an emergency landing. >> travelers' nightmare. that's exactly what happened overnight to the passengers on board united flight 7 from hawaii to guam and landed on the barely inhabited at an old u.s. mili

i think lbj believed in the basic fairness of most americans.nd he believed that if most americans could see the oppression that people of color faced, particularly in the south, that they would demand change. i think that's essentially what was happening in the summer of 1964. >> and johnson obviously a southerner himself, somebody who grew up in the south, from texas, was seeing this play out really in his own region and knowing he was taking a lot of big risks on behalf of what had been john f. kennedy's legacy in terms of the civil rights bill that was supposed to go through in '63. how did johnson square his sort of own upbringing? how did he come to the place where he saw civil rights as such an important issue for him? >> he'd been a schoolteacher in 1947. he had to teach in order to finish college. he saw through the eyes of mexican-american school children bigotry and injustice first hand. and he resolved at that time to do as much for those kids as he could. he had the power of the presidency, he invoked that memory. he said, i want to

may become the first hurricane of the season on the east coast. 50 years ago clifford alexander held lbj go all the way. james brown on how america changed forever. >> in this society they have to push. if you don't push, you are not going to get it. define laws of physician ex, 25 miles around gravitated today to one 28 inch sphere otherwise known as a soccer ball. all over america, work came to a stop as fans cheered the under dog team usa in its battles against belgium in one of the biggest sporting events of the year the world cup. it could turn out to be the most watched soccer game in u.s. history. it's still under way, belgium leading 2-1. usa still fighting. elaine quijano is on the scene. >> belgium had several chances to score in the first half. veteran u.s. goal keeper was called on to make the big save. he is 35 years old widely regarded as one of the best keepers in the world. this is likely his last world cup tournament. now the second half began the same way with bell annual dominating the game. there was several close calls in front of the american goals, 20 year old amer

. >> lbj! lbj! >> reporter: cleveland fans welcoming home with ope arms the player they once vilified. king james sending the city into a frenzy. after announcing his return to the cavs in an emotional online letter about how much his home means to him. and making fans forgive the way he crushed them four years ago when he announced his move to miami on live television. >> i'm going to take my talents to south beach. >> we love you. we forgive you. and let's get some money in this town. >> reporter: and the money began flowing immediately. call it the new lebron-omy. within eight hours, the cavaliers receiving out of season tickets. >> we go from selling something that's unsellable, i mean, i can't get my hands on enough tickets to sell. >> reporter: once dubbed "the mistake by the lake," the city of cleveland lost $50 million a season while lebron was gone. local businesses here are now hoping for a reversal of fortune. >> downtown cleveland really thrives on our sports teams. it means that it's go

and we would be better off if we rolled back big chunks of lbj's legacy.at cynicism because i have lived out the promise of lbj's efforts. because michelle has lived out the legacy of those efforts. because my daughters have lived out the legacy of those efforts. because i and millions of my generation were in a position to take the baton he handed to us. >> i agree with the president. i reject it, too, because i'm the son of a woman who couldn't drink a cup of coffee in downtown dothan, alabama, where she was from until this act was signed but she raise add son who sat and watched the first black president of the united states be sworn in a few feet away. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. >>> so sue me. let's play "hardball.." >>> good evening. i'm in for chris matthews. let me start with president obama's counter punch at the republicans. less than a week ago house speaker john boehnerer accused the president of abusing his power as commander in chief. he called him

people, the most turned off people, the most disillusioned people, and it will make the p eriod of lbj look tame. i hope we can just keep our eye on trying to get to the truth. >> i recognize the gentleman from massachusetts. for purposes of general debate only. for a period of 15 minutes. summer of 1787, at the constitutional convention in philadelphia, the delegates from my own state of massachusetts consistently opposed including impeachment in the constitution. massachusetts argued on july 20 of that year, that american law, unlike that of england, would provide for a genuine separation of powers. judicial review, and the regular elections by the people. hence, it was argued, the remedy of impeachment, which had been freakily abused in england, would not be necessary in america. the delegates of massachusetts for the more reason on that day that impeachment would impose a penalty in the absence of any specific statute, which would -- tonown and to those all citizens, the punishment they could expect for their offenses. wanted america to aspire to the ideal stated in the constitutio

. >> he knows that lbj was good at twisting arms wanted to get into that talk with him about the vietnam war as he was opposed in he did not want to get into it. so of course, they were non-violence so he is sitting in a restaurant when they looking at a magazine and he sees the bodies of the vietnamese babies and he just drops eating in the middle of his neil and they said if it does not taste good get something else he says know this matter is neither food will never taste good to me ever again i'll do whatever i can to stop the war in vietnam. and it becomes a crusade for him so he talks about what we called the triple threats and that was racism, poverty and military. even since his death racism and poverty in militarism is the same issues that threaten this democracy and right now it is a real conversation he was trying to get us to do that but when he died when his life was taken almost three-quarters of the american people had turned against him. 57 percent of his own people to see what the head of the naacp said about that. and what thurgood marshall supreme court justice said wi

lbj is juggling calls with hoover with that and members of congress about the bill. what you reference is the president's principal domestic le ledge slative priority was to get a tax cut. they thought you should not have a tax cut because you couldn't afford it. one of the people that was most against that tax cut was harry bird of virginia who was a segregationist. so the challenge was to get support from senator bird to move the tax cut along so you could clear it out of the way because linden johnson knew if the tax bill was still pending when the debate of the civil rights bill came up they would be hopelessly entangled. the second point you made the incompleteness of the 1964 civil rights act and the part of the story that is so unfinished is the economic inequality that persists in america today. on the day he proposed the bill president kennedy sited the statistics for a black and white baby born on the same day. they involved life expectancy, access to college. on the questions of access to opportunity, equality, a lot of blacks are infinitive better today.

people, the most turned off people, the most disillusioned people, and it will make the p eriod of lbj look tame. i hope we can just keep ourye

i believe lbj was well intentioned.id right in signing the civil rights act of 64 and the voting retes act of 1965. i applaud the people in the civil rights movement, the freedom writers. i think all-americans can be proud of the fact that they made this country more just. where the government gets in trouble it ensures equal outcomes and not just equal opportunity. that's where we have aired. the open welfare benefits do not help a group develop a work ethic. holding the kids to the lower standards does not help them close the achievement gap. blacks don't need another redistribution scheme. we don't knee slavery repir repirations. they have a poverty rate in the single digits. there is your anti-poverty program. get married before you have kids. >> sherrod are you married? >> i have been married several times and it didn't work out. i dribble and shoot and hope for the best. >> ladies and gentlemen, that's the ending of that segment. i don't even know. why did i ask him? >> i changed my mind. sherrod is not invited. t

lbj is juggling calls with hoover with that and members of congress about the bill. what you reference is the president's principal domestic le ledge slative priority was to get a tax cut. they thought you should not have a tax cut because you couldn't afford it. one of the people that was most against that tax cut was harry bird of virginia who was a segregationist. so the challenge was to get support from senator bird to move the tax cut along so you could clear it out of the way because linden johnson knew if the tax bill was still pending when the debate of the civil rights bill came up they would be hopelessly entangled. the second point you made the incompleteness of the 1964 civil rights act and the part of the story that is so unfinished is the economic inequality that persists in america today. on the day he proposed the bill president kennedy sited the statistics for a black and white baby born on the same day. they involved life expectancy, access to college. on the questions of access to opportunity, equality, a lot of blacks are infinitive better today.

he is the first pitcher to do that since the lbj administration. he allows 4 runs in 6 innings. >>> now, i need the same treatment after a stressful broadcast. [ laughter ] >> now. a birdo 18 to even out the chance in winning. the pro shot, up on the green, going, going, flagstick. martin, in eagle. and nobody, nobody would catch her there. the 31-year-old american wins the major for her first career tour victory. >>> final round, u.s. senior open. the birdie putt lifts out to set up a play off. montgomery, who never won a pga event has now won two major this year on the champion's tour. >>> nas car, jimmie johnson's day ends early. bum tire, knocks him out of the race. with 31 laps to go, brad keslowski got on the inside of jeff gordon. he pulls ahead, never looked back. took the checkered flag. memorable weekend for him. he won the nation wide series yesterday on the same track. congratulations to germany. i remember being there during the uni cup. they never closed. >> so, tonight, it is going to be nuts. >> absolutely. are you kidding me. beer

>> lbj! ♪ fill their bowl with the meaty tastes they're looking for, with friskies grillers.ender meaty pieces and crunchy bites. in delicious chicken, beef, turkey, and garden veggie flavors. friskies grillers. so why are we so,000 obsessed with turbo? card with a new volkswagen turbo. because there's nothing more exhilarating than a powerful ride. and you can get that in places you might not expect. like the passat. and also in the fun-to-drive jetta. in fact, volkswagen has sold more turbos than any other brand over the last ten years. that is a lot of turbo. hurry in and you can get a $1,000 turbocharged reward card when you lease a new 2014 passat s for $219 a month. it made the difference between hearing about my daughter's gym meet and being there. yeah!!! nailed it!! unlike the bargain brand, depend® gives you fit-flex™ our best protection. it's a smooth and comfortable fit with more lycra® strands. hi sweetie! get your free sample at depend.com . >>> you know, just this week 300 people were rescued from one california beach alone. and it is not just on the west coast

that is his second grand slam of the season of the first pitcher since the lbj administration to on do that. he allows four runs and the giants, 6-4. >>> i need the same kind of treatment after a stressful broadcast, are you in ann? >> no. >> now, the approach shot, keeping go, until it hits the flagstick. did not drop, but, it would go down for an eagle and nobody would catch her. the 31-year-old american wins a major for her first career tour victory. >>> final round of the u.s. senior open. watching the finish closely. a chance to win it on 18 but the birdie putt lifted out. setting up a play off that began 4 shots back. this is birdie on the 3rd play off ball and that is a win. so, montgomery, who never won a pga event has won 2 majors this year on the champion's tour. nascar, jimmie johnson's day ended with a bum tire. he is knocked out. 31 laps to go, brad keslowski got inside of jeff gordon. he won a few weeks ago, never looked back and took the checkered flag. a pretty memorable weekend. he won the nation wide series on the same track. >>> the wnba. the -- playing against each

lbj used more than 75 pens to sign the new law, giving one to the reverend martin luther king jr. and another to attorney general, robert ken day. whose late brother john f. kennedy proposed the civil rights law the year before. >>> another anniversary today. it was 77 years ago in 1937 that amelia earhart went missing during her pioneering attempt to fly around the world. she was never found. but today another amelia earhart, no relation, is making the same trip along with a co-pilot and has already made it halfway, spending the night in tanzania. she tweeted that her namesake's spirit of adventure lives on in many women around the world. by the way, you can track her journey on our web site nbcnews.com. >>> and a rocket carrying a nasa satellite lit up the skies in california early this morning. it's on a mission to track carbon dioxide, the main culprit behind climate change. the delta-2 rocket blasted off from vandenberg air force base speeding toward low earth orbit. the satellite is known as orbiting carbon observatory-2. it will monitor carbon dioxide from 438 miles up. the

james brown talked to one of the men who helped lbj change the course of american history. >> the topen was given to me by president johnson. used to sign the civil rights act of 1964. >> reporter: you got a hold of that pen. 80-year-old clifford alexander is still very proud of his time as an aide to lyndon johnson's white house. after graduating from harvard and yale law school, he served as civil rights advisor to the president. one of the few african americans in the white house then. >> the only african american on the staff at the time. >> what was that like, cliff? >> it was like many things from his life where black people were not included as much as they should have been. but in the case of lyndon johnson, he made me as comfortable as he made his white aides. he was a man who was forward looking and who cared about people. >> he was part of the team working on the civil rights bill, but he says it was johnson's passion that produced the historic legislation. >> first of all, his own righteousness. secondly, his skill in dealing with the legislature. thirdly, getting the civi

. >> lbj! >> reporter: how quickly cleveland has forgotten and forgiven. on to the current salary cap rules, lebron james will make under $21 million. the cleveland cavaliers have even moved a couple of players to make room for lebron. it was a classic case of whatever it takes. if you listen carefully you can hear celebrations throughout this city tonight. lebron james is back in town. >> that's right. jenna wolfe on the eve of a very big weekend in the city of cleveland. thanks. >>> another story certainly got a lot of attention in some parts today. the national weather service warning that a summer version of the polar vortex was about to make a return visit next week throwing a wrench in a lot of family vacation plans. temperatures are expected to drop from the 80s and 90s, the stuff of july into the 50s and 60s in some areas of the country. we get our report tonight from nbc's tom costello. >> reporter: think back five to six months ago when many of us developed a deep hatred for a weather phenomenon we had never heard of before. >> the polar vortex a

he finally did get buried because, i think he was then a member of congress, lyndon johnson, lbj that into the act. and we shouldn't -- you know, you talk about, you know, we have our first black president. we have these two terrific young castro brothers who are representing us in congress and in the city hall. we have come a long way but we should not forget the discrimination. [applause] >> thank you. unfortunately we've run out of time, adages wanted to ask you all to please help me thank ignacio garcia and nicholas costs for a great discussion -- nick kotz. take you very much for coming. we appreciate it. [applause] [inaudible conversations] visit booktv.org to watch any of the programs you see here online. type the author or book title in the search bar on the upper left side of the page and click search. you can share anything you see on the booktv.org easily by clicking share on the upper left side of the page and selecting the format. booktv streams live online for 48 hours every weekend with top nonfiction books and authors. booktv.org. >> booktv continues now with an interv

may become the first hurricane of the season on the east coast. 50 years ago clifford alexander held lbje way. james brown on how america changed forever. >> in this society they have to push. if you don't push, you are not

then lbj is juggling calls with j. edgar hoover and members about the bill. president kennedy's domestic legislative priority was to get a big tax cut which he thought would be an economic stimulus. in those days there was a strong caucus in congress that was fiscally conservative who thought you couldn't have a tax cut because you couldn't afford it. one who was most against that tax cut was harry bird of virginia who was a segregationist. so the challenge was to get support from senator bird to move the tax cut along so it could get out of the way, clearing the deck for civil rights. johnson knew if the tax bill was still pending when the civil rights bill came up, they would be hopelessly entangled and you would never make progress on the other and they would be held hostage of one another. but the incompleteness of the 1964 civil rights act and the part of the story that is so unfinished is the economic inequality that persists in america today and that is so racially disparate. he talked about babies beia bla white baby being born on the same day, and a

. >> with lbj we began the war on poverty talk about the census with slavery and the '50s and '60s butwhat kind of jobs? now in midget positions of president with those agriculture agrarian housekeeping. >> host. >> guest: i am not talking about that but blacks are joining the skilled professions prior to the affirmative action policies that after those policies have been put in place. at the higher rate it affirmative-action to increase the number of black college graduates and in fact, has the opposite effect to look at regarding affirmative action policies. at the university of california the racial preferences has been banned in 1896 with a voter referendum the black college graduation rates at university of california rose more than 50% in say also had the most difficult discipline of math and science and engineering. the policy intended to increase the ranks of the black middle class to have more black college graduates than we would have had. >> talk about affirmative action and the philosophy with that. >> again, i a fake clarence thomas or anyone else they will say looking at

funding so we do what other countries do, which is give more funding to kids who are poor, that is what lbjried to do with the war on poverty and with title one. then what happened with george bush, was he said, i am frustrated! let's have,, let's make sure tht kids, actually we know what kids are actually doing. and so the piece of no child lefti behind that was good was, okay, we shine a light on what is going on. but what then happened was the testing system became about rote memorization. lou: which by the way which most americans up until the 20th century were being, late 20thn century were being taught. >>b exactly. lou: it wasn't a bad result. >> no but the difference is this. you can't get a middle class job in america if you don't actually know how to apply knowledge these days. lou: we got 20 million people who are unemployed, who i think of as outstanding folks. they can read. they have got for the most part high school degrees at very least and who can't find a job because that job doesn't exist. >> well, that is, that, my friend is a whole another problem. lou: right. so, i thi

. >> lbj, who brought people in and back slapped them and bill clinton was one of the leaders in that department want >> she will have to talk about policies that appeal to middle of the road republicans. and this is in the early stages. i am not sure what that is going to be. she has tried to do it on issues of foreign policy and critized or publicly supported the traps fer of the five guantanamo it could commanders for bergdahl. but aides locked the report that she was skeptical of the deal. >> she was really saying that's why. and she was saying x? >> and exactly. a lot of triangulation in terms of rhetoric. they will have a difficult time to come up with policies. nchris, what does she do now. finished the book tour and summer in the hamptons and will not be in a swanky place. but does she lay low, her poll numbers have been dropping. what does she do here on in? >> she will not lay low. she'll continue to make speeches and a grandkid on the way and time it will move quickly and she will build up support around the people around the country and make sher are decision and we'll hav

veterans edward wood junior responded to restore e-mails all run across regarding the question of lbj's leg always controversial. she wrote for my generation of world war ii veterans, the social legislation passed under president clinton job leadership helped out some of the ideals we had fought for in the war, expressed in 1941 by president franklin roosevelt's four freedoms. i cried from a long-delayed joy when johnson signed the civil rights that. johnson's other legislation still resonates 50 years later. his initiatives help initiate the society for 1941 to 1945. undeniably the age of roosevelt and the progressive pursuit of the freedoms can be made very long time ago. even now, after so many years of conservative political ascendant then can her to class were from above, more than 30 years of deregulating corporate committee, reducing tax for the rich, stealing labor unions, shattering industries and the click in the public infrastructure, progressive legacy of the generation continues to nurse us. pick any area of american life. the consequences of the generation's commitment to

if anyone the person who had the fondest thoughts about her would have would have been lbj. >> that'sright. madame nhu was convinced he was flirting with her. i think he may have flirted with everyone but the connections between the family in saigon and the kennedy family and washington is really uncanny. on paper they look like they should have gotten along great. catholic families -- catholic families and very anti-communist so they should have really gotten along well but as it turned out they didn't jacqueline kennedy was a real critic of madame nhu. she thought matter knew was just pushy and she called her -- she called her everything that jack found unattractive. in the press she boasted about her own marriage to president kennedy saying oh they had this easy added marriage. >> that's a direct quote. >> what is that? who knows but submissive and madame nhu was anything but submissive so the worst that she could say about her was that she was probably a. >> you talked about also about the kind of idea of the dragon lady. it's a stereotype that applied to any number of powerful wo

hey, hey, lbj, how many kids did you kill today.nia avenue wasn't cordoned off then. you could hear that in the white house where he was living. so i mean it dealt with him to the end of his life and of course it colors his legacy in history and will always color his legacy in history. >> we opened the interview with as an autocratic, authoritative guy got things down. let's bring that to life. contrasting him to obama who does not have those skills. he would not be able to cope with the media today and be completely ineffective. >> well, the thing about political genius is that it always finds a way. you don't know what the way is. johnson whenever throughout his -- until you get to vietnam where he can't find the way and it casts this pall over everything, he finds a way. first when he's in the senate. you know, no senator majority leader has ever really led the senate, really controlled the senate. the senate before lyndon johnson was the same dysfunctional senate that it is today. he comes in, he's majority leader for six years.

because in your intro when you talked about the colossal screw-up of lbj, what we forget is the powerone of us have is clairvoyan clairvoyance. i don't think he knew it was going to be a disaster. but i think that's something strange that thinking that ginsburg isn't a, aware that she's 81. and b, aware that obama may not get re-elected. it's also worth saying this is the woman who is the head of the women's rights division at the aclu, she's not lacking in strategic thinking. i think she just doesn't want to share it with us. >> you know, one thing i wonder about is would you get a real replacement for ruth bader ginsburg through the senate with the way president obama stands with the senate now? that's one issue. you might not be able to get someone who is as good as ruth bader ginsburg from the liberal perspective. the other thing is, the next president, as we sit here tonight, if you're playing the odds, is very likely to be hillary clinton based on what we know about all the possibilities of running for president as of right now. and to the risk factor that justice ginsburg is pl

especially the deep south in the 50 years since then, lbj had no idea just how right he was. that's hardball for now. have a safe and happy 4th of july weekend, all in with chris hayes starts right now. >>> tonight, we are "all in." >> usa. usa! >> the immigration wars are back. >> go back home. >> migrant women and children turned away by angry protesters in southern california. >> this is normandy beach of our fathers. >> with more buses coming today, the counter protests. >> what are the people of escondido and muir yetta afraid of? 9-year-olds? >> we'll bring you the latest on the ongoing crisis on the border. then, east jerusalem, this time a palestine ab ductsed and killed. >> we were on the other side with the palestinians. >> ayman mohyeldin is in the middle of it and joins me tonight. >>> target takes a stand on guns and their stores. tropical storm arthur takes aim at the coast. and why american work-aholicks are donating a million years of labor to their bosses. good evening from new york, i'm chris hayes, the immigration crisis has turned ugly. some of the largest

can split this into two periods, the first two years when you had the most productive congress since lbjety. maybe the republicans hated it, maybe the democrats loved it. the point is things happen in those first two years, we've seen the reality of divided government in a hyper polarized america since then. the white house wants something, the republicans in congress say no and nothing happens. it makes me sit here and say how can either side break that? >> steve, you talk about the first two years of the president bpt see and say all these things were done and voters rejected it. >> and then they re-elected the president. >> that's different. an incumbent president has significant advantages. this one had many advantages over mitt romney in getting re-elected. for the midterms in 2010, much like 2014, it's much more about issues than individuals. it's much more about what do people see as the roll and reach of government. that's why i think that the republicans will probably do well this year. to you and ron brownstein's broader point, there's no question. i think the presidency is a t

. >> host: with lbj the war continues and i understand you talking about the consensus of the slavery in the 50s and 60s but that quality of what kind of jobs there is a big difference. they are versus being in the lower end of the spectrum the kind of jobs for agriculture at variance and housekeepers and things of that nature. >> guest: that's not what i'm talking about. blacks were joining the skilled professions at a faster rate prior to affirmative action policies which began in earnest in the 1970s than they were after those policies were put in place. teachers, craftsmen and so forth joining the provisions at a higher rate prior to the passage of these. again, almost without thinking we credit is like a form of action for helping to swell the ranks of the black middle class and increase the number of the college graduates. in fact affirmative action has had the opposite effect. we have 40 years of evidence to look at regarding the affirmative action policies. i will give you a quick example. at the university of california in the empir entire state syste, racial preferences were

. >> i hold every president, every one since lbj accountable for not securing the border. >> well, you have to go back even further than that. john kennedy was the one who put in place the family reunification law. driven by the catholic church, due to the immigration law. and that is what is happening today. if you have a cousin or a d distant uncle -- >> the leadership of honduras believes that their future is taken away from them. >> i don't believe that for a second. i don't think they give a hoot. krauthammerer said if you build a fence like east germany, did you ever see the east german fence? >> i've been through it. >> i was there for it, the wall coming down in berlin, i was actually there. nobody could get through that fence, all right? nobody. it was a formidable obstaclobst. and the israelis have done the same thing to keep out trerrorim there. and that is mistake number one. mistake number two, in this current flash point situation in the rio grande valley not far from austin, you could put them there, and stop the madness, just like with katrina and other things. there is

joining me now is congressional reporter ed o'keefe and professor at the lbj school of public policy,ictoria soto. thank you so much for joining us. ed, you had wonderful interviews with the president of honduras and guatemala, really focusing on their view of the conflict. it's always so often americanized here. i want to play a snippet about what the president of hon dur ras views is the real issue at hand. >> translator: your country here in the united states is the largest consumer of drugs and what happens with that is you manage to resolve the problem by separating the violence from the consumption of drugs and for many, public officials here the problem is a matter of health. what is it for us in central america? it's a problem of life and death. >> absolutely striking words right there. a lot of it deserved to america and ed, that's the mindset of the central american leaders that hold on, you might have to deal with few thousand kids who are refugees but it's because of what you do that the problem exists. >> exactly. it's an important reminder as congress fumbles through wha