liar liar and bruce almighty his most recent film he takes us on a journey in search of the nature of humanity and what it means to live a truly fulfilling life on this topic will definitely get into a little later in the interview curley is a professor of communications and teaches screenwriting at pepperdine university seaver college i'm pleased to welcome from our studios in los angeles times shadyac welcome. tom it's great to be here and just for a point of clarification the class i teach at pepperdine is actually called film and life because it's a conversation that i don't think we have with our youth which is we use films as an access point to start a conversation about the sit ins and choices that our youth are going to make. in their in their graduate from college and when they move on with their lives so that's a conversation that i also wanted to start with i am just reflected that in the class i teach well it's fascinating it's kind of. robert mckee comes home to my life i don't think it's the the notion of the story as person. how did i get it how did you get out of that how did that come about. well i've always been a teacher in my heart i taught acting for years at a studio called the vincent chase workshop and vincent chase is now one of the characters on entourage they named the lead actor after me so renowned and i just enjoyed teaching and they called one day after i had done the film bruce almighty and pepperdine is a spiritually based school so they thought i would make a fun professor to come teach the kids you know the art of showbusiness so i started with a screenwriting class but i have bowled into this larger conversation because i felt such a hunger from the students again about these choices that they were making the pressures that they were feeling and that's really what the class turned into it it's it's kind of a therapy session for all of us we talk about what's going on in the news in their hearts the pressures that they're feeling we try to you know this embody those pressures and really break them down and see what's underneath them that's remarkable you've had some head films that include bruce almighty liar liar and i'm sure a pet detective series movie series you've collaborated with eddie murphy to write the nutty professor movie series directed patch adams starring robert william or robyn williams dragon-fly with kevin costner you were executive producer of the a.b.c. t.v. series eight simple rules for dating my teenage daughter what have you learned from the breath of experience. well i've learned how important storytelling is in the human experience you know madeleine l'engle is a famous author she wrote a wrinkle in time and she said jesus was not a theologian he was god amongst those who told stories and i think storytelling is as old as the human species i think we used to sit around the fire and we said talk about the day and and it's how we learned to be human how we learned to walk. more empathetically more productively and so i've learned about the power of storytelling and you know i just toured america with the film i am and you would think that some of my later films would

films in the last few decades from ace ventura pet detective series to the nutty professor movies to liar liar and bruce almighty his most recent film i am he takes us on a journey in search of the nature of humanity what it means to live a truly fulfilling life on this topic will definitely get into a little later in the interview carly is a professor of communications and teaches screenwriting pepperdine university seaver college i'm pleased to welcome from our studios in los angeles tom shadyac tom welcome. tom it's great to be here and just for a point of clarification a class i teach at pepperdine is actually called film and life because it's a conversation that i don't think we have with our youth which is we use films as an access point to start a conversation about the seasons and choices that our youth are going to make. in their when they're graduate from college and when they move on with their lives so that's a conversation that i also wanted to start with i am just reflected that in the class i teach well it's fascinating it's kind of. robert mckee comes home to my life i don't th

. >> i kept thinking, you liar, liar, liar, because there's totally a connection. >> was the bullying reason, you think, erica, that your best friend killed herself? >> most definitely, there's no question about it. >> did the school district talk to you after samantha committed suicide? >> i never once got talked to. >> what bothered me most is that nobody asked us. >> we have dozens of people that are looking into each one of those suicides. they talked to as many people as they can surrounding that suicide. >> reporter: we asked superintendent carlson why no one talked to samantha's mother or her best friend. they feel like, dennis, an investigation or review wasn't done. >> we did not do a formal investigation. we would only do a formal investigation if there was some indication that there was need for that. >> why wouldn't there be a need for that when you have kids killing themselves? >> there needs to be some evidence that bullying, harassment, was part of their life in that school. i cannot emphasize enough, kids need to come forward to the adults in the building and say "we'r

. >> i kept thinking, you liar, liar, liar, because there's totally a connection. >> was the bullying part of the reason, you think, erica, that your best friend killed herself? >> most definitely, there's no question about it. >> did the school district talk to you after samantha committed suicide? >> i never went and got talked to. what bothered me most is nobody asked us. >> we have dozens of people that are looking into each one of though suedes. they that you canned to as many people as they can surrounding that suicide. >> reporter: we asked superintendent carlson why no one talked to samantha's mother or her best friend. >> they feel like, dennis, an investigation or review wasn't done. >> we did not do a formal investigation. we would only do a formal investigation if there was some indication that there was need for there. >> why wouldn't there be a need for that when you have kids killing themselves? >> there needs to be some evidence that bullying, harassment, was part of their life in that school. i cannot emphasize enough, kids need to come forward to the adults in the bu

, bum, a liar, a liar and i want you to concludeto be a murderer. i was smart for jose baez to take that on closing. >> greta: it doesn't moon she is innocent, does it diana? >> i totally agree. but i gotta say, the more and more i hear from the alternate juror that has come forward, the more it sounds like i was wrong, wrong all the way what long and the defense was doing a great job and the jury was buying what the defense was selling. it didn't sound like this was just a we don't quite believe. it sounds like they actually believed the defense's theory. i got to i go credit where due they did an amazing job i did not see coming. -- >> greta: listening to jury, i agree in part. ted, in these cases the jury really does take the jury instructions seriously. you can walk out of the courtroom and think she is the worst murderer there is. but i don't know how she died. >> that's right. let's be candid if the jury would have made a decision here pursuant and based on emotions, she would have been found guilty many the evidence was not t

romney, liar, liar, pants on fire?ney said i never said that this guy made the economy worse, referring to president obama. we have that clip and what he actually said. let's watch. >> i didn't say that things are worse. what i said was, that the economy hasn't turned around. >> the economy with a was in recession. he made it worse. >> he didn't create the recession, but he made it worse. >> he did not cause this recession, but he made it worse. >> victoria, that seems pretty damning, isn't it. >> we will see his primary cocoa hoerts, pile that on romney then we've got obama-care that was preceded by romneycare. stuff like this keeps damaging and saying these things is like he is leapfrogging and he says i have the lead ai don't need to worry about my fellow republicans. i'm talking to the general public here. i don't want to bash obama too much. but you can't compete in the general if you don't get out of the primary. >> good point. bob, last word on this. >> the idea that mitt romney is back tracking. it is the casab

. ♪ we will all go down together ♪ >> and plus liar, liar. >> president obama quit lying. >> the freshmanessman and the video attack on the president that has gone viral. representative joe walsh joins us live. >>> and order, der, in a flip. rupert murdoch and his son now say they will answer questions on the hacking scandal that is circling their media empire, and will congress force them to testify here?

once a liar, always a liar. >> we'll have to see what happens and if this does, in fact, gut the case. you know about this firsthand. and we don't have time to go into the entire story. but hopefully as the case progresses, both of you will come back to talk with us. thank you very much. >>> also tonight, we're following the story of a disturbing murder in macon, georgia because of who is involved. it is likely the victim a dynamic and determined 21-year- old law grad. we're still waiting on the id of a dismember the body of a woman in macon yesterday. >> we're monitoring a press conference that is due to start in the hour. lauren has been missing since saturday. her family is besides themselves with worry and nervous about the very manies. >> reporter: this was the scene yesterday in macon, georgia where investigators recovered a body. and this is a man that has been arrested and charged with burglary of her apartments after telling news crews he was in the residents with friends looking for lauren. his name is steven mcdaniel. >> he was afraid that someone had tried to break in thur

and they won't let me help her, i know who to call and i know where she is, and she's a liar and a liar and a liarbut you know what, we still don't know the cause of death. we don't know where it happened. where it happened. we don't know the instrument of death. on a first degree intentional murder case, jurors should know that before they perhaps sentence somebody to death. that's the strongest thing baez said yesterday. >> no fingerprints or anything like that. the defense, did they -- they had a lot -- they really had a lot of ground to makeup trying to explain that, you know, don't let emotions get in the way, and look at the evidence and the evidence right now doesn't say that casey actually was the one who killed her child. what do you think about that? >> right. baez went after the forensics and that was important to do that. the fau sorensics were the place defense had to score. they were saying they were unreliable and they had to convict here. don't let passion or your hatred make you vote guilty for her, and yet you saw baez try to throw george anthony, as they say in this case, under

liar and a slut? >> well, you know, i think the defense had to tackle that head on because we know from all the prosecution's evidence that casey anthony is indeed a prolific liar, pathological liaro really confront that and put it out there, and they spun it, joe, let's face it. they said, yes, maybe she's a slut, maybe she's a liar but does that make her a murderer? the defense theory all along is that this is an accident, not an intentional murder, and so i think it perhaps it played okay for this jury. i think the terms liar, the term slut makes people feel uncomfortable, but this jury has heard a lot worse during the course of 33 days of testimony. >> sunny this, has been a very hotly contested trial, as you know. you've watched so much of it. there was a moment during the closing arguments when both the defense attorney and the lead prosecuting attorney did something that brought the judge to the point where he had to admonish everyone and pretty much stop the trial for a moment or two. let's listen. >> and depending on who is asking the questions, whether it's this laughing guy right here or myself. >> objection. >> sustained. >> depending who is asking the questions, this

liar, an expert liar. many people are thinking had she taken the stand, perhaps in her own defense she would have done a pretty good job. and so who knows what would have happened? but certainly i thought because of the opening statements that this defense made, and it was very clear that the evidence that they proffered to this jury could only have come in if casey anthony took the stand. i was very surprised that she did not. >> jean, you spoke with defense attorney cheney mason. and i'm wondering, what did he have to say to you? >> he said many things to me. he said that he's concerned for casey's safety. plans are being made for her protection. he would not say what. he doesn't think that she can live in orlando and wonders where she can live in this country without somebody recognizing, knowing her and hating her. he thinks the only thing would be plastic surgery and possibly coloring her hair. but he wants americans to step back and realize that a jury has spoken. they have spoken that she is not guilty. they need to accept that and move on. >> and sonny, what do you think we can expect from casey as far as book deals maybe, movie deals and other "if i did it"? >> that's the question everyone is asking themselves. because where does she work? where does she live? what does she do? her attorney jose baez says that she has a future ahead of her. but i think that people want to know her story. they want to hear from her. and i think the only other person that is perhaps similar to casey anthony would have been o.j. simpson. and remember when he got out, he was ville fired. there were restaurants that would not serve him. there were helicopters following him around. everyone i think it's clear that he never really led a normal life after this. and i think the same is going to come to pass for casey anthony. >> and the question of what actually happened to caylee remains pretty much unanswered, doesn't it? >> and i asked cheney mason, people want answers. will they ever get answers. he 20e8d me they most likely will not get answers and will have to rectify within them service that reality. >> up next we'll show you more key moments the jury saw in the six-week trial full of key moments, including this one intended to show premeditation. >> is that a google search? >> yes, it is. >> for? >> the words "neck breaking" with a space in between. " head underscore injury" "ruptured spleen" "chest trauma" "hand-to-hand combat. search turned up internal bleeding. >> how many times was that site visited? >> according to the history, 84 times. >> that's coming up. also, a huge question that still hasn't been answered. who is caylee's father? and did that question help the defense win its case? ♪ ♪ i like your messy hair ♪ i like the clothes you wear ♪ i like the way you sing ♪ and when you dance with me ♪ you always make me smile [ male announcer ] we believe you're at your best when you can relax and be yourself. and at thousands of newly refreshed holiday inn express hotels, you always can. holiday inn express. stay you. and now stay rewarded with vacation pay. stay two weekend nights and get a $75 prepaid card. ♪ [ doug ] i got to figure this out. ♪ [ dr. ling ] i want to spend more time with my patients. [ jim ] i need to build a new app for the sales team in beijing. 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[ doug ] i need to think about something else when i run. ♪ [ male announcer ] every day, we set out to do more than the day before. at dell, everything we do, from solutions to services, gives you the power to do just that. ♪ so i.t. professionals can be more productive... business leaders, more innovative... doctors can be more connected to patients... and teachers have the power to make a difference. dell. the power to do more. >>> judge belvin perry has yet to make public the names of the jurors who acquitted casey anthony of murder. but two have already spoken out about their decision, one of them juror number 2 strongly suggested that he believes casey anthony was somehow responsible for her daughter's death. his words?" i wish we had more evidence to put her away". that's about as strong as you can get. but he simply didn't see it. did you? tom foreman has the trial's key moments. >> reporter: the jury took less than 11 hours to hand down a verdict, but sat through 35 long days of arguments, alibis and shocking allegations, starting with the defense's opening statements. >> and shortly thereafter, george began to yell at her. "look what you've done! your mother will never forgive you! " this child at eight years old learned to lie immediately. she could be 13 years old, have her father's [ expletive ] in her mouth and then go to school and play with the other kids as if nothing ever happened. >> reporter: and from the prosecution? >> casey anthony went to a club with her boyfriend, tony lazaro. and entered or participated in a hot body contest. caylee anthony wasn't there. caylee anthony wasn't at tony lazaro's. she wasn't with her grandmother cindy. so where is caylee? >> reporter: at the start it looked like the prosecution had a clear edge. the jury saw pictures of casey out partying, getting a tattoo, enjoying the wildlife even as her daughter went missing. the state said this was evidence enough that young mom did not want to be a mother anymore and planned her child's murder on a home computer. john bradley is a software expert. >> is that a koog el search? >> yes, it is. >> for? >> the words "neck breaking" with a space in between. "head underscore injury" "ruptured spleen" "chest trauma" "hand-to-hand combat. the search turned up "internal bleeding". >> how many times was that site visited? >> according to the histories 84 times. >> reporter: sentra tral to the case was that casey used chloroform and duct tape to kill caylee. then came a bombshell from casey's mother, cindy anthony. >> do you recall in march of 2008 you doing any types of searches for any items that might include chloroform? >> yes. >> reporter: suddenly the prosecution was scrambling, forced to prove that cindy was at work when those computer searches were done from the anthony home. >> when you first opened it, what was your reaction? >> i essentially jumped back a foot or two. >> did you immediately recognize the odor that was emanating from the piece of carpet in the can? >> i recognized it as human decomposition. >> reporter: but casey refused to take the stand herself. >> and it is your decision not to testify? >> yes,sir. >> reporter: letting her lawyers portray her as a victim, too. picking away at the prosecution's story. >> can you from the evidence, sir, rule out accidental death? >> no. >> reporter: they called casey's father, george anthony, the culprit behind an accidental drowning death in the family swimming pool who then forced his daughter into a coverup. they accused him of sexually abusing casey as a child. he denied it. >> sir, i never would do anything like that to my daughter. >> reporter: the defense also claimed casey's only brother lee tried to grope her. her mother slapped that accusation down. >> do you recall several years back when there were -- there was an incident involving your son lee going into casey's room at night? >> no. >> reporter: but most of all, casey's defense team pounded away on the fact that precisely when and how caylee died remains unclear to this day. >> you have to have an abiding conviction of guilt. that's what you have to have inside of you. you have to know that this case was proven. >> reporter: and in the end, it was enough. the once seemingly sure case for the prosecution crumbled, and so did the murder charges against casey anthony. tom foreman, cnn. >> right now with our panel sonny hosten and jean casarez. jean, what sticks out for you as the most emotional moment in this trial? >> the most emotional moment? that has to be cindy anthony on the stand. to hear her 911 calls, especially when she realized her little granddaughter was gone. and sitting in that courtroom and you couldn't even see her face anymore, just the top of her head because of her sobbing. that without doubt the most e emotional moment in the case. >> sonny, what do you think were the biggest turning points in this trial? >> i think this case was changed at opening statements, at the defense's opening statement. because before this trial began, everyone was saying, how do you defend a case like this? how do you defend a mother accused of murdering her child who behaved so oddly for 31 days? not reporting. and i think when the opening statement was made and we heard about alleged sexual abuse, we heard about an accidental drowning, we heard about this dysfunctional family, that was the game changer. the other i think crucial point was when george anthony took the stand. because in opening statement, george anthony was made to be the villain here. he took the stand not once, not twice, but several times. and when he denied having an affair with krystal holloway and then krystal holloway got on the stand and was quite credible when she said, no, we did have an affair, under the law, martin, the jury was instructed that if they did not believe a part of george anthony's testimony they could disregard all of his testimony. they could find him not to be credible. and when we are now hearing from some of these jurors, a lot of them are saying they felt odd about george anthony. they felt something was amiss. they felt that this was an accident that spiralled of of control. and those were the words that krystal holloway said when she was on the witness stand. so i think that was certainly a game changer. george anthony's testimony and the defense's opening statement. >> and jean, how do george and cindy anthony pick up the pieces now? the sexual abuse allegations, obviously very damaging to both george's reputation and to the family. so how do they mend things? >> you know, it's a good question. because the allegations that were made in this trial by the defense were criminal allegations, truly, that george anthony had committed a capital felony of abusing his daughter. no evidence to that at all in the trial. i think psychologically anybody would need help in resolving those issues. cheney mason said that he does not think there is a relationship to be saved between mother and father and casey, believes that there is one with lee that will be salvaged and will go on. i guess maybe we'll never know. but i think all of them will have a tough time. >> sonny, here's a question for you. there was plenty of criticism of attorney jose baez, the lead defense attorney. and in the end, the jury delivered really what some say was the best verdict his defense team could have hoped for. so here's the question. was he a star defense attorney or did he simply just get lucky? >> oh, i don't think it was luck at all. and you know, i have been saying all along, people really villified jose baez. they said he was ineffective. they said that he's unsophisticated. well, his sweet spot certainly was speaking to the jury. we saw it in that explosive game-changing opening statement. and we saw it in his closing argument. i think this case was won by the defense in opening and in closing. and so i think he probably has quite a career ahead of him. people are calling him the new johnny cochran. so he certainly wasn't ineffective. and when you listen to what the jury is saying, they are saying yes, that prosecution didn't prove its case but they are also spouting a lot of the things that jose baez said in opening statement and closing argument. >> sonny hosten, jean casarez, thanks very much. >>> still ahead, the jury has spoken but the court of public opinion isn't listening. what's fuelling the ugly backlash against casey anthony's acquittal? is her life in danger? >>> also ahead, how does casey anthony's family really feel about the verdict? her parents showed zero emotion in the courtroom. do they believe that justice has been done? can they forgive their daughter for dragging they're their reputations through the mud? you'll hear from their lawyer ahead. >> there's so much that happen this week that they're just soaking it all in and trying to figure out where they go from here. 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>> he adopted her. he legally adopt her, yes. >> no, he didn't. that's because zenaida gonzales, the woman who casey called zan any, was never a babysitter for caylee. she was a fictional character made up by casey anthony. >> what message do you want me to give to zanny and to caylee? >> that she needs to return caylee. i forgive her. >> what do you think her reasons are? >> mom, i don't know. >> okay. >> ca casey anthony didn't lie just about caylee's whereabouts. she also made up stories about herself. in july of 2008, casey told investigators that she was an events planner at universal studios. >> detective melich, do you recognize that? >> i do. >> casey anthony even took investigators to the universal studios building in orlando. >> we walk into the building, she turns left, starts walking down this hallway. and about halfway down the hallway she stops, turns, looks at us and says "i don't work here". >> detectives believed early on that casey was not telling the truth. this audio recording of an interview with casey was played in court. >> we're tired of the lies. no more lies. what happened to caylee? >> i don't know. >> you do know. what happened to caylee? >> i don't know where she is. that is the god honest truth. >> the lies casey anthony told throughout this case were undisputed by her attorneys. but in the end, the jury determined that telling lies isn't enough to prove murder. tom foreman, cnn. >> but what is waiting for her on the outside? will she be able to have any semblance of a normal life? john king talked to dr. drew pinsky, host of hln's "dr. drew". >> we expect her to be free very soon. then what? we don't know of a home, we don't know of any resources. we know of a severely dysfunctional family. how does this most infamous defendant reintegrate herself to civilian life? >> it's a great question. and not only is there a dysfunctional family, there's a family that has been thrown under the bus and shattered by the proceedings of this case. i don't see her going home maybe ever. i mean, i don't see how this family reconciles. they're just so much blood that's been drained out of the system. it's almost impossible to heal something like this. the other issue is that i think she's physically in harm's way. i've seen -- if you check youtube today and look at people's outrage and the kind of incredible fury and frenzy that people are worked up into now, i actually think she's going to have to probably go into hiding for awhile. then there's the issue of how she makes a living and how she pace back the state for whatever she owes for the trial. unfortunately i think that's kind of a disgusting part of this story which is that she is likely to capitalize on these proceedings. >> but let's walk through this then. because you say there will be a financial opportunity for her book, selling her story, because of how dramatic and how fascinating and how much of a capture of the imagination here she has had. but you just mentioned, she needs psychological help. i think you can believe that without a doubt. she's going to have to deal with perhaps fear of threats against her. if you were counselling her, what would you tell her? what would the steps be? >> it depends what's going on with her. one of the interesting parts about this case has been the mystery. there's so many empty sets, so many unanswered questions. one of which is, what is going on in her head that she is such an outrageous, cons mat liard that has died and behaved as a mother in the fashion in which she has? and it adds up to either social yop py or severe border line kinds of sin droems. aye talked to her ex fee sawn awn say who said she had a seizure disorder. there may be neurobiological processes. this is somebody impaired and may not be amenable to traditional type of interventions. everyone i talked to says how severely impaired she is and how you come to realize that when you meet her. >> and her focus for the past three years has been on all the lies, trying to escape the law system here. what happens when your out? is there a letdown in some ways? the proceedings are over, she's back on on the street, the case is behind her. then what? >> what you see is one of two things. if she is indeed primarily a criminal is you will see more criminal behavior. o.j. simpson i hope that is taught everybody that. these people go out and do the same thing over again in some fashion. they're their own worst enemy. if this is

liar, an expert liar. many people are thinking had she taken the stand, perhaps in her own defense she would have done a pretty good job. and so who knows what would have happened? but certainly i thought because of the opening statements that this defense made, and it was very clear that the evidence that they proffered to this jury could only have come in if casey anthony took the stand. i was very surprised that she did not. >> jean, you spoke with defense attorney cheney mason. and i'm wondering, what did he have to say to you? >> he said many things to me. he said that he's concerned for casey's safety. plans are being made for her protection. he would not say what. he doesn't think that she can live in orlando and wonders where she can live in this country without somebody recognizing, knowing her and hating her. he thinks the only thing would be plastic surgery and possibly coloring her hair. but he wants americans to step back and realize that a jury has spoken. they have spoken that she is not guilty. they need to accept that and move on. >> and sonny, what do you think we can expect from casey as far as book deals maybe, movie deals and other "if i did it"? >> that's the question everyone is asking themselves. because where does she work? where does she live? what does she do? her attorney jose baez says that she has a future ahead of her. but i think that people want to know her story. they want to hear from her. and i think the only other person that is perhaps similar to casey anthony would have been o.j. simpson. and remember when he got out, he was ville fired. there were restaurants that would not serve him. there were helicopters following him around. everyone i think it's clear that he never really led a normal life after this. and i think the same is going to come to pass for casey anthony. >> and the question of what actually happened to caylee remains pretty much unanswered, doesn't it? >> and i asked cheney mason, people want answers. will they ever get answers. he 20e8d me they most likely will not get answers and will have to rectify within them service that reality. >> up next we'll show you more key moments the jury saw in the six-week trial full of key moments, including this one intended to show premeditation. >> is that a google search? >> yes, it is. >> for? >> the words "neck breaking" with a space in between. " head underscore injury" "ruptured spleen" "chest trauma" "hand-to-hand combat. search turned up internal bleeding. >> how many times was that site visited? >> according to the history, 84 times. >> that's coming up. also, a huge question that still hasn't been answered. who is caylee's father? and did that question help the defense win its case? >>> judge belvin perry has yet to make public the names of the jurors who acquitted casey anthony of murder. but two have already spoken out about their decision, one of them juror number 2 strongly suggested that he believes casey anthony was somehow responsible for her daughter's death. his words?" i wish we had more evidence to put her away". that's about as strong as you can get. but he simply didn't see it. did you? tom foreman has the trial's key moments. >> reporter: the jury took less than 11 hours to hand down a verdict, but sat through 35 long days of arguments, alibis and shocking allegations, starting with the defense's opening statements. >> and shortly thereafter, george began to yell at her. "look what you've done! your mother will never forgive you! " this child at eight years old learned to lie immediately. she could be 13 years old, have her father's [ expletive ] in her mouth and then go to school and play with the other kids as if nothing ever happened. >> reporter: and from the prosecution? >> casey anthony went to a club with her boyfriend, tony lazaro. and entered or participated in a hot body contest. caylee anthony wasn't there. caylee anthony wasn't at tony lazaro's. she wasn't with her grandmother cindy. so where is caylee? >> reporter: at the start it looked like the prosecution had a clear edge. the jury saw pictures of casey out partying, getting a tattoo, enjoying the wildlife even as her daughter went missing. the state said this was evidence enough that young mom did not want to be a mother anymore and planned her child's murder on a home computer. john bradley is a software expert. >> is that a koog el search? >> yes, it is. >> for? >> the words "neck breaking" with a space in between. "head underscore injury" "ruptured spleen" "chest trauma" "hand-to-hand combat. the search turned up "internal bleeding". >> how many times was that site visited? >> according to the histories 84 times. >> reporter: sentra tral to the case was that casey used chloroform and duct tape to kill caylee. then came a bombshell from casey's mother, cindy anthony. >> do you recall in march of 2008 you doing any types of searches for any items that might include chloroform? >> yes. >> reporter: suddenly the prosecution was scrambling, forced to prove that cindy was at work when those computer searches were done from the anthony home. >> when you first opened it, what was your reaction? >> i essentially jumped back a foot or two. >> did you immediately recognize the odor that was emanating from the piece of carpet in the can? >> i recognized it as human decomposition. >> reporter: but casey refused to take the stand herself. >> and it is your decision not to testify? >> yes,sir. >> reporter: letting her lawyers portray her as a victim, too. picking away at the prosecution's story. >> can you from the evidence, sir, rule out accidental death? >> no. >> reporter: they called casey's father, george anthony, the culprit behind an accidental drowning death in the family swimming pool who then forced his daughter into a coverup. they accused him of sexually abusing casey as a child. he denied it. >> sir, i never would do anything like that to my daughter. >> reporter: the defense also claimed casey's only brother lee tried to grope her. her mother slapped that accusation down. >> do you recall several years back when there were -- there was an incident involving your son lee going into casey's room at night? >> no. >> reporter: but most of all, casey's defense team pounded away on the fact that precisely when and how caylee died remains unclear to this day. >> you have to have an abiding conviction of guilt. that's what you have to have inside of you. you have to know that this case was proven. >> reporter: and in the end, it was enough. the once seemingly sure case for the prosecution crumbled, and so did the murder charges against casey anthony. tom foreman, cnn. >> right now with our panel sonny hosten and jean casarez. jean, what sticks out for you as the most emotional moment in this trial? >> the most emotional moment? that has to be cindy anthony on the stand. to hear her 911 calls, especially when she realized her little granddaughter was gone. and sitting in that courtroom and you couldn't even see her face anymore, just the top of her head because of her sobbing. that without doubt the most e emotional moment in the case. >> sonny, what do you think were the biggest turning points in this trial? >> i think this case was changed at opening statements, at the defense's opening statement. because before this trial began, everyone was saying, how do you defend a case like this? how do you defend a mother accused of murdering her child who behaved so oddly for 31 days? not reporting. and i think when the opening statement was made and we heard about alleged sexual abuse, we heard about an accidental drowning, we heard about this dysfunctional family, that was the game changer. the other i think crucial point was when george anthony took the stand. because in opening statement, george anthony was made to be the villain here. he took the stand not once, not twice, but several times. and when he denied having an affair with krystal holloway and then krystal holloway got on the stand and was quite credible when she said, no, we did have an affair, under the law, martin, the jury was instructed that if they did not believe a part of george anthony's testimony they could disregard all of his testimony. they could find him not to be credible. and when we are now hearing from some of these jurors, a lot of them are saying they felt odd about george anthony. they felt something was amiss. they felt that this was an accident that spiralled of of control. and those were the words that krystal holloway said when she was on the witness stand. so i think that was certainly a game changer. george anthony's testimony and the defense's opening statement. >> and jean, how do george and cindy anthony pick up the pieces now? the sexual abuse allegations, obviously very damaging to both george's reputation and to the family. so how do they mend things? >> you know, it's a good question. because the allegations that were made in this trial by the defense were criminal allegations, truly, that george anthony had committed a capital felony of abusing his daughter. no evidence to that at all in the trial. i think psychologically anybody would need help in resolving those issues. cheney mason said that he does not think there is a relationship to be saved between mother and father and casey, believes that there is one with lee that will be salvaged and will go on. i guess maybe we'll never know. but i think all of them will have a tough time. >> sonny, here's a question for you. there was plenty of criticism of attorney jose baez, the lead defense attorney. and in the end, the jury delivered really what some say was the best verdict his defense team could have hoped for. so here's the question. was he a star defense attorney or did he simply just get lucky? >> oh, i don't think it was luck at all. and you know, i have been saying all along, people really villified jose baez. they said he was ineffective. they said that he's unsophisticated. well, his sweet spot certainly was speaking to the jury. we saw it in that explosive game-changing opening statement. and we saw it in his closing argument. i think this case was won by the defense in opening and in closing. and so i think he probably has quite a career ahead of him. people are calling him the new johnny cochran. so he certainly wasn't ineffective. and when you listen to what the jury is saying, they are saying yes, that prosecution didn't prove its case but they are also spouting a lot of the things that jose baez said in opening statement and closing argument. >> sonny hosten, jean casarez, thanks very much. >>> still ahead, the jury has spoken but the court of public opinion isn't listening. what's fuelling the ugly backlash against casey anthony's acquittal? is her life in danger? >>> also ahead, how does casey anthony's family really feel about the verdict? her parents showed zero emotion in the courtroom. do they believe that justice has been done? can they forgive their daughter for dragging they're their reputations through the mud? you'll hear from their lawyer ahead. >> there's so much that happen this week that they're just soaking it all in and trying to figure out where they go from here. an accident doesn't have to slow you down. with better car replacement, available only from liberty mutual insurance, if your car's totaled, we give you the money to buy a car that's one model-year newer... with 15,000 fewer miles on it. there's no other auto insurance product like it. better car replacement, available only from liberty mutual. it's a better policy that gets you a better car. call... or visit one of our local offices today, and we'll provide the coverage you need at the right price. liberty mutual auto insurance -- responsibility. what's your policy? welcome. i understand you need a little help with your mortgage, want to avoid foreclosure. smart move. candy? 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[honks horn] ...homes around the country. every single day, saving homes. we will talk it over... announcer: if you're facing foreclosure, make sure you're talking to the right people. speak with hud-approved housing counselors free of charge at... >>> one of the most amazing aspects of the entire case was the elaborate web of lies that casey anthony spun. the defense freely admitted that casey just made up dates, facts, places and people. here's a look at some of those lies. >> i as a mom, i know in my gut there's feelings a parent, know certain things about your child. >> this is casey anthony in october of 2008, three months after 2-year-old caylee anthony was reported missing. listen to what she tells investigators. >> you can feel that connection. and i still have that feeling, that presence. i know that she's alive. >> but she wasn't. little caylee was already dead, and casey knew it. she later told her defense attorney she was lying in this interview with police, just one of many she told throughout the whole saga. this jailhouse visit from casey's parents was taken in july of 2008, a month after caylee died. >> in my gut i know she's still okay. i can feel it, mom. >> in this video, also taken in july, casey even gives her brother lee some clues on where to search for caylee. >> check things locally, lee, in all honesty. places that are familiar to us, to our family. >> casey's biggest whopper came when she blamed her daughter's disappearance on a woman named zenaida gonzalez whom she says kidnapped caylee while babysitting for her. >> they never searched by her full name, z-e-n-a-i-d anz n a. and i know she went by both last names. she always has since she was younger since her mom remarried. victor and gloria are her parents. but i know she has a lot of money. that's where she got the car from. she has his last name and her mother's last name. >> oh, he adopted her? >> he adopted her. he legally adopt her, yes. >> no, he didn't. that's because zenaida gonzales, the woman who casey called zan any, was never a babysitter for caylee. she was a fictional character made up by casey anthony. >> what message do you want me to give to zanny and to caylee? >> that she needs to return caylee. i forgive her. >> what do you think her reasons are? >> mom, i don't know. >> okay. >> ca casey anthony didn't lie just about caylee's whereabouts. she also made up stories about herself. in july of 2008, casey told investigators that she was an events planner at universal studios. >> detective melich, do you recognize that? >> i do. >> casey anthony even took investigators to the universal studios building in orlando. >> we walk into the building, she turns left, starts walking down this hallway. and about halfway down the hallway she stops, turns, looks at us and says "i don't work here". >> detectives believed early on that casey was not telling the truth. this audio recording of an interview with casey was played in court. >> we're tired of the lies. no more lies. what happened to caylee? >> i don't know. >> you do know. what happened to caylee? >> i don't know where she is. that is the god honest truth. >> the lies casey anthony told throughout this case were undisputed by her attorneys. but in the end, the jury determined that telling lies isn't enough to prove murder. tom foreman, cnn. >> but what is waiting for her on the outside? will she be able to have any semblance of a normal life? john king talked to dr. drew pinsky, host of hln's "dr. drew". >> we expect her to be free very soon. then what? we don't know of a home, we don't know of any resources. we know of a severely dysfunctional family. how does this most infamous defendant reintegrate herself to civilian life? >> it's a great question. and not only is there a dysfunctional family, there's a family that has been thrown under the bus and shattered by the proceedings of this case. i don't see her going home maybe ever. i mean, i don't see how this family reconciles. they're just so much blood that's been drained out of the system. it's almost impossible to heal something like this. the other issue is that i think she's physically in harm's way. i've seen -- if you check youtube today and look at people's outrage and the kind of incredible fury and frenzy that people are worked up into now, i actually think she's going to have to probably go into hiding for awhile. then there's the issue of how she makes a living and how she pace back the state for whatever she owes for the trial. unfortunately i think that's kind of a disgusting part of this story which is that she is likely to capitalize on these proceedings. >> but let's walk through this then. because you say there will be a financial opportunity for her book, selling her story, because of how dramatic and how fascinating and how much of a capture of the imagination here she has had. but you just mentioned, she needs psychological help. i think you can believe that without a doubt. she's going to have to deal with perhaps fear of threats against her. if you were counselling her, what would you tell her? what would the steps be? >> it depends what's going on with her. one of the interesting parts about this case has been the mystery. there's so many empty sets, so many unanswered questions. one of which is, what is going on in her head that she is such an outrageous, cons mat liar? how could she have no empathy for a child that has died and behaved as a mother in the fashion in which she has? and it adds up to either social yop py or severe border line kinds of sin droems. aye talked to her ex fee sawn awn say who said she had a seizure disorder. there may be neurobiological processes. this is somebody impaired and may not be amenable to traditional type of interventions. everyone i talked to says how severely impaired she is and how you come to realize that when you meet her. >> and her focus for the past three years has been on all the lies, trying to escape the law system here. what happens when your out? is there a letdown in some ways? the proceedings are over, she's back on on the street, the case is behind her. then what? >> what you see is one of two things. if she is indeed primarily a criminal is you will see more criminal behavior. o.j. simpson i hope that is taught everybody that. these people go out and do the same thing over again in some fashion.

liar. but is a liar a killer? the state couldn't put it together.they couldn't link the facts to the charging document. and that's why she was found not guilty. >> she wasn't chargeding piers, she wasn't charged with being a bad mother. she was charged with murdering her child. and the fundamental building block of any murder case is manner of death and cause of death. and here the prosecution had no clue as to what the manner of death was. and they had no clue what the cause of death is. and it's almost impossible as this jury verdict showed to convict somebody when you have no idea of how the crime was committed. >> it is. i accept all that. i've got to leave it there. but what i would say is there are bad mothers and there are terrible mothers. and a mother that doesn't report a missing child for a month? i'm afraid to me falls into the catastrophically bad mother category. anyway, thank you all very much. we'll be right back after this short break. al days are back and better than ever! right now, go to priceline for a sneak peek at recent winni

where do think this helps the defense case that if the defense believes that cindy is a liar and george is a liar, doesn't it fit with the defense that this family is filled with toxic secrets, that why she lied and went out and partied for 30 days instead of calling police and reporting her daughter's sdental drowning. >> when i was talking to drew and saying who is telling the truth, you were like --ia thought they had an affair. i'm with jane, and i find her credible. here is why, we have so much outside information the jury isn't getting. the day george anthen ea took the stand and denied having an affair with her, i was listening to the levi page radio sthoe, and she called in. she was hot. she was cussing like a salty sayler, okay. she was going on and on. and let me tell you something, she was credible. she's like, how dare he deny he slept with me, and she's giving out details that didn't come out in court. i do, i think there was an affair, but the jury is not going to go that knauz jeff aston on cross-examination did right what he always does, he went right to the bone. he's not a dog w

liar. >> whole family is a liar. you explain to me in common sense how it is such a coincidence that you have searches that show some level of premeditation, an idea, intention to kill, chloroform searches? coupled with the chloroform, -- >> sean: there were questions about that. they said it came from myspace pages. >> if you want to reject the scientific evidence that is the jury's right. if they want to go with the defense theory and say fantasy forensics. what i'm telling you is there was sufficient circumstantial evidence to department trait that casey anthony -- to demonstrate that casey anthony >> sean: you are not convincing me. >> you are not the jury. >> sean: i want to go to mark geragos. you were the first ones in the stay of florida to hear on a multitude of levels, new techniques, because traditional things that historically worked in a court of law, were not applicable able -- here. seems like a stretch. >> this is the problem when you start talking things and do just a modicum of cross-examination on these people. find out it is not peer reviewed that the laboratory is not a crime lab. that the guy never qualified as an expert in that field. and there's no prior peer reviewed area where somebody has looked at it. jurors don't buy that. and they shouldn't. this isn't something where we are going to throw some guy who has a new technique into it and tell the jury, okay forget about everything you have ever heard and what we've been using for 20 years -- [ talking over each other ] >> sean: let me ask you this question. yale and though i was 95% in, i am extraordinarily concerned like most people in this country for justice for this little girl. i want to get to the bottom line. i want evidence. now that this trial is over, will this continue? will the people that lied on the stand, should they be pursued? should there be further investigations? this roy kronk, should he be looked into? should the father be questioned? should the mother's statements be brought up? should they pursue this further or will they let it drop? >> listen, i'm a firm believer when it is over it is over. the defense won this case. anything the prosecution does after this is really going to look like sour grapes. they can go after the mother for the confusing testimony as to whether she was at work or not. her mother was the prosecution's star witness that is not going anywhere. this woman should get credit time served tomorrow. everybody should go on with their lives. [ talking over each other ] >> the only one who knows what happened is her mother and we are never going to know that story. the prosecution is so invested in her being the person they are never going to8:[ñ pursue anybody else. >> sean: what i didn't like about roy kronk he finds the body and telling his son -- >> you don't find amazing people in murder trials. he didn't do it, the anthony family is saying this was an accident. >> sean: if you are sitting on a jury and somebody's life is in your hands ear the death penalty or life in prison -- either the death penalty or life in prison they have to prove it to a reasonable doubt. >> not beyond a shadow of a doubt. >> >> sean: i didn't say shadow. i needed five more percent. [ talking over each other ] >> sean: this jury was unanimous if they had five more per isn't i would have been there or lowered the standard to negligent homicide. -- >> you are asking me would i have come to a different conclusion, i'm telling you yes. and you would have come to the same conclusion that's why our system works. rest in peace to the little girl. >> sean: thank you all. mark geragos we set history. levin says hello. >> what is next for casey anthony? you won't believe how much money she may make off her experience. >> could a phenomenon we discussed one years ago, known as the csi effect, could that explain casey's acquittal? that and more straight ahead. the debate is over. ♪ lexus hybrid drive technogy is designed to optimize any fuel source on the planet. even those we don't use yet. because when you pursue perfection, you don't just engineer a future-proof hybrid system. you engineer amazing. ♪ what's vanishing deducti all about ? guys, it's demonstration time. let's blow carl's mind. okay, let's say i'm your insurance deductible. every year you don't have an accident, $100 vanishes. the next year, another $100. where am i going, carl ? thnext year... th was weird. but awesome ! ♪ nationwide is on your side ♪ >> sean: george and cindy anthony fled the courtroom yesterday after the jury announced their daughter's acquittal many now according to radar online the couple is in hiding after receiving death threats over the internet. their attorney announced they've not decided whether they will welcome their daughter who lived with them in 2008, back into their home when all of this is over. from the looks of it, casey's financial prospects are great. abc news reports she stands to gain over $750,000 to write a tell-all book. she can rake that in while in jail. also, she can net a similar sum for sitting down forn exclusive tv interview. tmz news reports that an alternate career path may open up to her. pornography. porn executive called baez to gauge her interest and told tmz we've all seen the pictures of her partying, having a good time where she looks hot. we are just learning that he has since resended that -- rescinded that offer. what is next for casey? legal analyst mercedes cohen and rebecca rose woodland. all of this is media speculation. the idea that casey will try and now -- why are you looking at me? >> there's already all this interest. where there is smoke there is fire. there's tons of interest on this woman's tell-all. >> sean: hang on. but we tone know what her interest is. >> if she is smart, keep your lips sealed. >> out of respect for her dead daughter which would hope she doesn't write a tell-all of how horrible jail was. what really happened. we saw that with o.j. and that disaster. >> sean: could she open herself up to legal problems? >> she could. there is the son of sam law that states adopted. >> sean: that's if you are found guilty. >> she does have a guilty conviction. >> sean: four miss -- fourfpmep misdemeanors. >> respectfully -- [ talking over each other ] >> sean: what if she told the involvement, the death, the swimming pool and the cover-up. would that create any legal vulnerabilities for her then? >> there's double jeopardy. she can't be retried for murder. she can't be retried for the facts underlying that mur. here's the thing, she is being sued for defamation. she got served last night -- >> sean: that is meaningless. >> they are going to take testimony and ask questions where did this nanny come up? >> sean: the woman's name. apparently she was in an apartment complex where she might have got that name that turned out to be a lie. i keep repeating, i needed more to get me to this point. i think she was overcharged. if it was negligent homicide not reporting it 31 days, i think you had me. if it was negligent homicide where she lied repeatedly, you had me. when they say murder one, aggravated child abuse, they did not look -- i think they were over zealous, am i right or wrong? i agree with all due respect to the prosecution, i understand they wanted a prosecution. the facts and the evidence didn't add up to murder in the first degree. and the jury is thinking, oh god that would mean possible death. i can't take that chance. that's what -- >> where is the motive?2+zç she such a will having mother. look at these pictures, playing with her child, wonderful. no one said child protective services has been around. she has been abusing this child. >> sean: i don't get this, 31 days, if your child is missing what are you going to do? >> that was before. that's why the jury struggled. wait a minute, all the history prior to her disappearance, everyone spoke even on the prosecution side the witnesses said she loved her daughter, adored her daughter. the bottom line even baez said my client might be a slut, liarurderer. >> sean: i had my doubts about him. i thought his opening comments were way off base. he closed along with cheney mason, just a phenomenal close. they literally rebutted every single issue that the prosecution brought up. they either impeached it or created doubt. it was a brilliant close. >> right, they attack thatted everything. they do not have to prove their case. they don't have to prove a defense. the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. >> sean: is the standard too high? >> i think there's an expectation of jurors the csi effect does exist. the jurors want everything in a neat package. you don't need a meteorologistologist to go outside and say there's -- a meteorologist to go outside and say there's snow on the ground. >> sean: there's no dna, there's nothing. >> it was overreaching by the prosecution. if they had done something differently, she would have been convicted. there wasn't enough proof. >> in the land of csi, that's not the real world. people

liar. is that enough to make her a murderer. >> everybody talked about the tapes and sd just because she is a liar doesn't make her a killer. jeff ashton did everything today it was method cal. they add dressed everything was talking about it's not just the lies it's the reason behind the lies it is how she perpetuated them and worked them to her benefit. >> judge side land was that enough? where is the beef? >> there is no beef. the prosecute toe showed she is a liar the defense attorney admits she is a liar. there's nothing tying her linking her to the death of her daughter. the biggest stick of dynamite the prosecutor has is the fact that she didn't call the police for 31 days. >> pretty big stick. >> it's a diss functional family whacked out family this truth is no friend to them. >> lawrence do you think the prosecution is nailing home again to this very lofty burden the case of capital murder against this accused? >> jeff ashton is an experienced prosecutor. he did a masterful job in his closing argument with what he had. he did have direct evidence of pre-meditation. he didn't convince me that casey anthony is guilty of pre-meditated murder. >> no aggravated child abuse perhaps. let's see what they have. coming up the role the tiny victim's grandpa played. wait until you see george anthony's role as it's delineated in these closing arguments all he played in the continuing tragedy after this. >> george is getting trying to find out what is r

liar. admitted she is a liar on important documents. we are talking about an application for asylum, statements to the irs and papers filed with them. to try and go forward when all you're relying on is he said/she said puts the prosecution in an extremely difficult position. even though it may have occurred, what we have to think about as lawyers is what can we prove to a jury? her lies put her and this state in a very awkward position. >> awkward but not impossible. even if the alleged victim has lied about a lot of things or misled about a lot of things, some of them having nothing to do with the case, it doesn't mean she wasn't raped. >> that's right. the problem here is that the prosecution would have to put her on the witness stand to prove its case. if you read the letter they did send to the defense team, it is clear that she has made so many errors in judgment in terms of the stories that she has told, that it would be very, very difficult to put her on the witness stand. she would not be able to withhold really cross-examinati

liar. she's a liar, not a good parent and that's about all we know. and she behaved in ways that were absolutely unthinkable, knowing that her child was dead. just egregious kinds of behavior. whether or not she knowingly took action on this child, there was just a lot of missing pieces. people still feel she got away with something nonetheless. >> you get the impression that every time someone is on trial, on television, everybody is talking about it, there really is a large proportion, if you will, of the public expecting a conviction. why is that that we don't separate the possibility of guilty from not guilty. >> you ask, and again, i'm not saying whether she did or didn't do it. you're asking a specific question about the crowd behavior. and we' got a long history of that to this country, all the way back to salem, massachusetts, don't we? i think so people generally really feel good about gathering together with one another and sharing a disdain for one. they put one up on a pedestal and it's almost a sacrificial impulse we have as a way of galvanizing ourselves together as a culture and a whole against that one. we decide we're the jury of public opinion and we want action. >> casey anthony cleared of murder. some of the people who actually looked at this case really believed she was innocent, in fact. we'll have that coming up. we have much more on the public reaction to this sensational case. and casey anthony's defense team withstood a lot of criticism throughout the trial. but there was a key moment when prosecutors won over the jury or not. we're taking a closer look. ♪ you are my sunshine ♪ my only sunshine ♪ you makes me happy ♪ when skies are grey ♪ you'll never know, dear ♪ how much i love you ♪ please don't take my sunshine away ♪ [ male announcer ] as long as there are babies, they'll be chevy's to bring them home. ♪ we know right from wrong. and we know the ads blaming president obama for the economy are politics at its worst. the republicans have opposed economic reforms at every turn. and now they have a plan that would essentially end medicare for future retirees... slash education... while giving huge tax breaks to big oil and the wealthy. we can't rebuild america if they tear down the middle class. priorities usa action is responsible for the content of this advertising. >> we're following the breaking news. reaction still coming in, this trial has gripped much of the nation. cleared on all the most serious counts, including first degree murder and manslaughter. david mattingly, a huge crowd it looks like, has actually been there throughout the trial almost. and give me some idea who these people are. >> well, owe, the crowd can generally be divided into two camps. so one, people just attracted by the drama and the spectacle of all of this. and for people coming to look for drama today. they were not disappointed by the ending. people are looking for justice for little caylee. they're the one stunned by what happened today. >> it's almost like you have to have someone commit a crime and have it on video for something to happen today. it's disturbing. i don't know what else to say. i have to get out of here. >> i'm very upset. justice wasn't found, evidence was there. the duct tape. i thought ashton did a great job of proving his case. and i'm really surprised the jury didn't take -- didn't prove her guilty because the evidence is there. i'm really upset. i just feel really bad because no one wins in this situation. there's a 2 1/2-year-old that's dead and it's just really sad. >> the crowd has been typically been gathering to see if they can get tickets for the next day, but now that there is no next day in the trial, there is no crowd out here. we did learn today that the orange county sheriff has deputies out in the neighborhood where casey ant nis' parents live. they are there to direct traffic. they're making sure that only people who get into that neighborhood are people who live there and people who belong there. they're afraid onlookers will try to go over woods where caylee anthony's body was discovered. they said people should respect the decision that the jury has made. he's called for peaceful acknowledgment of the verdict and call alled on everyone to maintain your peaceful resolve. joe? >> so there's a whole bunch of questions. the first one is, given the fact that there's security out there in the neighborhood, is there any sense as to how long they can keep that security up. is there a mob mentality there? or do you think these folks have just made up their minds and now they're upset or what? >> i would not call this a mob mentality at all. after the verdict was read outside the crowd that did gather, only a couple of times, you could hear someone shouting out. it was just an individual. they would say something like where's the justice? there wasn't a mob mentality here at all. right now, in fact, like i said, the crowd has dissipated outside the courthouse. i don't know if you can hear it on the microphones we have here and over the noise of the news helicopters over my head. someone is playing "amaysing grats" in a close and sad cadence, possibly related to the case today. >> so the security in the neighborhood then would just be purely precautionary? >> nay announced that they were going to have that jed and, in fact, they were talking about onlookers. people who sort of had a sort of tourest manualty going into that neighborhood. maybe wanted to see where caylee anthony's body was discovered. people are concerned there's going to be too much public attention. they want to make sure they can get back to their lives as early as they can. of course, the anthonys saying they're going to take a long, long time for them to rebuild their lives. so the orange county sheriff tonight, just making sure the residents out there get their wish, have a little bit of peace after this very highly and intensely watched trial. >> thanks for your reporting. >> 12 jurors deliberated less than 1 hours before proclaiming casey anthony not guilty of the most serious charges in the death of her little daughter caylee. so who are these men and women behind the decision that's being analyzed across the country right now. our brian todd is looking into that. brian? >> joe, we had seven women, five men, ten of them white, two of them african-american. in talking to jury expertings today, they all said what likely swayed these jurors is the inability to pinpoint a cost of death or specific time when caylee anthony died. when jeff ash ston.ton said we can only hope that chloroform was used beforehand to knock caylee out so she could have died in peace, he said that was key. the expert said when the prosecutors couldn't pinpoint whether she died of chloroform or suffocation, he believes that's when this jury was influenced by that one comment. none of the experts we spoke to believe that one specific juror tilted this case. joe? >> but some of the jurors' professional experience could have played into this, of course. >> some experts point to juror number two. this is an african-american man in his 40s who works in the i.t. industry. there was a lot of information on computer searches on chloroform, whether casey anthony's mother cindy did those search, whether she did not do them, whether she was at work. one expert said this juror's background was key. he says i.t. experts use high levels of logic, connecting dots very exactly. when those dots became inexact in this case with the computer searches, this juror very likely figured that out. >> now, there was one juror who the prosecution didn't want and actually tried to get rid of. >> that's right. >> this was a very, you know, this was a very key moment in the case during jury selection. this is juror number 4, an african-american woman in the. >> 50s. the prosecutor tried to use a preemptory challenge. she said she didn't like to judge people during jury selection. the defense used a challenge to try to keep her. that's a challenge saying you can't toss out a juror based on race. the prosecution only said we don't want there because she said she doesn't like to judge people, but in the end, the judge sided with defense. experts tell us, though, they don't think this particular jury swung the case. >> there were actually two people w40 didn't want to be on this jury at all. i'm surprised it was only two. >> most of the experts told us they were surprised it was only two as well. 2 and 6 both said they didn't want to be on the jury. one in his 30s, one in his 40s, both married with two young children. experts say it's not unusual at all for a potential juror not to be seated in a case like this. experts told us, like you, joe, they are surprised only two of them didn't want to be there. >> absolutely. i've been a jury foreman years and years and years ago. i really did not like the experience at all. >> tough job, it really is. >> vts the defense won but there was plenty of criticism of lawyers on both sides. stand by for the hits and misses in the casey anthony trial and how they influenced the final verdict. covergirls -- set your lashes free. new natureluxe mousse mascara! we took out a heavy synthetic and put in a light touch of beeswax. up with the volume, down with the weight. new natureluxe mousse mascara. easy breezy beautiful covergirl. the authentic, the rare, the hard to define. to those always searching for what's pure and what's real from we who believe we know just how you feel. haagen-dazs. twenty-five thousand mornings, give or take, is all we humans get. we spend them on treadmills. we spend them in traffic. and if we get lucky, really lucky, it dawns on us to go spend them in a world where a simple sunrise can still be magic. twenty-five thousand mornings. make sure some of them are pure michigan. your trip begins at michigan.org. >> mary snow is monitoring some of the other top stories in the situation room right now, including an update on the man accused of shooting congresswoman gabrielle giffords. mary? >> hi there. a federal appeals court is suspending the force medication of jared loughner until it hears arguments from loughner's attorneys. he's accused of killing six people. he's been diagnosed with schizophrenia. a judge found him incompetent to stand trial and ruled he could be forced to take an psychotic drugs. montana governor is touring oil-stricken areas of the yellowstone river today. since friday, 42,000 gallons of oil have poured through a crack in one of exxonmobil's pipelines. clean-up efforts are under way, and exxon mobile says it closed down the pipeline within minutes, but the spill has spread as far as 15 miles from the initial leak site. two bombser to through a government building north of baghdad today. iraqi police say the explosions killed at least 35 people and injured 28 hours. while sectarian violence in iraq has diminished, bombings and attacks are still a daily occurrence. that's heightening concern about what will happen when u.s. troops withdraw by january 1 on u.s.-iraqi security agreement. >> prosecutors are also speaking out next. anthony's patients are in the courtroom. did their testimony make the difference for their daughter? we're taking a closer look. blan >> we're putting a live picture outside the home of cindy and george anthony. a lot of traffic trying to get around a number of law enforcement officers we heard earlier, just a little while ago from david mattingly. they have been sent out into the neighborhood protect ily just now, after the verdict in the casey anthony case. of course, casey anthony was stepped back by the judge today and still locked up. she will be released after a court hearing on thursday. casey anthony's lawyer says he hopes his client will get her life back together now that she's been cleared in the death of her 2-year-old daughter caylee. members of the defense team offering emotional statements, soon after the verdict was read. the defense attorney jose baez talked about the anthony case and justice. >> i want to say while we're happy for casey, there's no winners in this case. caylee has passed on, far, far too soon. and what my driving force has been for the last three years has been always to make sure that there has been justice for caylee and casey. because casey did not murder caylee. it's that simple. >> the prosecutor refused to criticize the work of the jury. we're disappointed with the verdict today and surprised because we know the facts and we put in absolutely every piece of evidence that existed. our team did an exemplary job. i'm proud of them and i stand by their work. i never, ever criticize a jury. theirs is the task of deciding what to believe. >> now let's get back to our senior legal analyst, jeffrey toobin. it's funny, when you look at this case, so much now is about the prosecution and the kind of case they presented, but the defense has also been criticized for making certain assertions during opening statements that they were not able to have back up during the course of the evidence. perhaps l it looks like perhaps the defense also had some problems. >> trials are a little like elections. if you win, it seems like everything you did was right. and if you lose, everything you did was wrong. now, human beings being what they are, real life doesn't work that way. people make mistakes, they do well, and, you know, life is more complicated. but i certainly thought it was very odd that the defense put forth this story that the father had abused casey. i mean, that had no place in the trial, and there was no proof of it at the trial since casey herself never testified. i think the jury will simply come back to the question of reasonable doubt and say look, we didn't have a time of death, we didn't have a method of death, we didn't have a place of death. those questions, especially in a first degree murder case are so important and the circumstantial evidence was strong and there's plenty of people in prison because of circumstantial evidence. it just wasn't enough, especially in a case with the death penalty on the table. >> there was a moment on sunday when jose baez, the defense attorney was speaking to the jury in his closing arguments, and you could see the prosecutor actually snickering. apparently with his hand over his face. and i want you to look at that. my question is, did the prosecution blow it? check this out. >> we're not talking about fantasy forensics anymore. we're talking about cold, hard evidence, evidence that points to one person and one person only. and he can get up here and lie all he wants and dance around the truth, but the truth is the truth and depending on who's asking the questions, whether it's this laughing guy right here or whether it's myself -- >> objection. >> sustained. approach the bench. >> you get the gist. the judge stopped the trial and apparently admonished everybody. do you think the prosecution created a problem for itself right there? >> i don't think so something like that mattered very much. and i tend to be a believer that lawyers don't matter as much as many people think they do. jurors focus a great deal on the evidence and not so much on the theatrics. i doubt that smile or laughing had anything to do with the verdict. if you can fault the prosecutors for one thing, i think it's this -- turning this case into a death penalty case. even though the death of a 2-year-old is such an obvious tragedy, but by turning it into a death penalty case, they essentially raised the stakes in such a way they raised more questions than they answered. and that's the big question of mistakes by the prosecutors. it's bringing this case and charging first degree murder. little bits of trial theatrics i don't think matter much one war or the other. i think the real question is why this was a death penalty case. >> it's also hard to discern what the motive was. is that something that would tie up a jury? >> well again, motive is one of those subjects that is not technically the element for the crime, but juries always want to know, why did someone do something? they said that casey wanted to go out and party. but they didn't prove that. there seemed to be real overreaching in terms of the evidence on the prosecutor. and you heard it a little bit in that clip. the defense got to seize on what seemed like very questionable science that was put forth here like, you know, the smell in the car was the smell of death. that's not dna evidence. that kind of thing gave the defense the opening to say look, this case was overcharged. it was overdone. and they didn't have the proof to back it up. >> there's also the question, the cause of death, the business about chloroform and so on. that seemed to be something that wasn't pulled out of whole cloth, but still required a leap of faith, did it snot. >> absolutely. and the fact that casey apparently googled chloroform. that's a bad fact for the defense. most people don't google dlor form very often, especially before a child is found dead. but again, without a cause of death, what different does it make? you have to tie the pieces together, and without a cause of death, without a time of death, without a method of death, how did she die? that's an invitation to reasonable doubt from a jury. >> a lot of people put their lives on hold to watch the casey anthony trial. as it unfolded day by day. why did this trial captivate the nation? you're telling jack cafferty. there was raw emotion on casey anthony's case when the verdict was read. we're finding out if you think the jury got it right or wrong. . new natureluxe mousse mascara! luxurious volume with a light-as-air feel. we took out a heavy synthetic and put in a light touch of beeswax. up with the volume, down with the weight. lashes are 20% lighter than the most expensive mascara. new natureluxe mousse mascara. so free your volume! and...your easy breezy beautiful covergirl. and try natureluxe glossbalm. ♪ you are my sunshine ♪ my only sunshine ♪ you makes me happy ♪ when skies are grey ♪ you'll never know, dear ♪ how much i love you ♪ please don't take my sunshine away ♪ [ male announcer ] as long as there are babies, they'll be chevy's to bring them home. ♪ 14 clubs. that's what they tell us a legal golf bag can hold. and while that leaves a little room for balls and tees, it doesn't leave room for much else. there's no room left for deadlines or conference calls. not a single pocket to hold the stress of the day, or the to-do list of tomorrow. only 14 clubs pick up the right one and drive it right down the middle of pure michigan. your trip begins at michigan.org. joining us once again with the cafferty file. jack? >> indeed, joe. the question this hour is why did the casey anthony murder trial captivate the nation? john writes the story is reality tv. as tv viewers we like train wrecks, hot body contests, people who don't exist and over the top families. jerry springer couldn't have written a better script, virginia writes i think nancy grace is responsible for our interest. we all waited for caylee to be found o. we were all astonished by casey's response. i was impressed with the prosecutors and somewhat disappointed with the defense, kevin writes wrong. it captivated the media. mary writes the state did not prove their case. and the people still want her blood. now what happens if they prove it wasn't casey but someone else? will the media give her a public apology, since they publicly tried her? angela writes it was a totally media driven, and sadly the more gruesome, shocking, and heinous the crime appears to be, the more interest there is. bring on the gladiators, jack. society appearses to be ready for them again. tonya writes the fact that a child. was murdered is enough to captivate people. that doesn't mean casey anthony didn't kill caylee. most people think she did. the message in this case is juries don't reach very dearths solely on testified present bud which side has the best lawyers. baez appeared to be more clever than the prosecutors. her mother will now be able to go back to partying without her child getting in the day. it's very sad. will jaime writes anything tabloid sells. the fact that you have two questions about this trial today proves that. as the kids say, well, duh. if you want to read more on, this go to my blog, cnn.com/caffertyfile. ton of mail on this. it's something people are very interested in. >> i bet there is. we're going to have even more about whether this was all media driven. stay tuned for that, jack. >> yes, it was. >> you said it. we're continuing our breaking news coverage of the stunning verdict. we're live at the courthouse in orlando. could casey anthony be leaving jail within days, even hours. plus anthony faced the death penalty. could that have played a role in the very dearth? >>> another major story we're following. a new move by president obama to break the stalemate over the debt and prevent a new crisis for the u.s. economy. he's invited republican and democratic leaders in congress to come to the white house thursday for talk. let's bring in our white house correspondent dan lothian. dan, are we any closer to having a deal? >> reporter: look. i don't believe anyone believes they're getting closer to having a deal. they do believe they're making some progress. over the weekend the president met with or had discussions with leadership from both parties and they believe that significant progress is being made. you heard the president talk about that today when he popped into the briefing room to make some brief remarks. >> i believe that greater progress is within sight, but i don't want to fool anybody. we still have to work through some real differences. now, i've heard reports that there may be some in congress who want to do just enough to make sure that america avoids defaulting on our debt in the short term, but then wants to kick the can down the road when it comes to solving the larger problem of our deficit. i don't share that view. >> now, just enough, what the president is referring to there, joe, is what we were talking about yesterday, where there had been some in washington talking about possibly having a mini deal, whereby they have six or eight months to hammer out a deal. the president was making it clear that was not something he supported. le i pushed jay carney on that whether at the last minute that was something the president would embrace, and he said no. >> so have the congressional republicans gotten an opportunity to weigh in on this yet, dan? >> they have. and i think when you look at and listen to what they're saying, it shows there's still a big divide. speaker boehner releasing a statement shortly after the president came out saying, quote, in part the legislation the president has asked for, which would increase tacks on small businesses and destroy more american jobs, cannot pass the house, as i have stated repeatedly. the american people simply won't stand for it and their elected representatives in congress won't vote for it. i'm happy to discuss these issues at the white house, he says, but such discussions will be fruitless until the president recognizes economic and legislative reality. sounds like a lot of work cut out for the leaders as they come to the white house on thursday, joe. >> that's for sure. we're not at the end of the story, but time is ticking. >> that's so right. >> thanks so much, dan lothian. >> okay. >> you're in "the situation room." happening now. breaking news. the stunning finale to the spectacular trial that gripped the nation. a florida jury finds casey anthony not guilty of first-degree murder and not guilty of manslaughter of the death of her 2-year-old daughter. welcome viewers in the united states and around the world. wolf blitzer is off. i'm joe johnson and you're in "the situation room." -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com >>> as to the charge of first-degree murder verdict as to count i, we find d deft not guilty, so say you awe orange county, florida, on this fifth day of july, signed foreperson. >> it was an absolutely breath taking end to a sensational trial that lasted for more than six weeks. a young woman charged with killing her own 2-year-old daughter but a florida jury took less than 11 hours to reach a verdict, finding casey anthony not guilty of first-degree murder. the jury also cleared anthony of aggravated child abuse and aggravated manslaughter of a child. they convicted her, though, on four misdemeanor counts of giving false information to law enforcement officers. the defendant broke into tears as the verdict was red. she could have faced the death penalty. instead she'll face lesser charges on thursday morning, facing up to a year on each count. this case shocked america and it got worldwide attention. standing by live, cnn's martin salve individual in yond. jeff toobin and sunny hostin. we may have to wait to find out why the jurors did what they did. listen to this. >> at this time there are no jurors interested in speaking to any members of the media. they do, however, have your packets and they've asked for their privacy. >> cnn's martin savidge was in the courtroom today. he joins us live from orlando. martin, why are the jurors not talking? we're not going to even hear from the alternates, are we? >> reporter: no, we're not. this really came as a great surprise. there was the surprise of the verdict and then all eyes on the jury. the question, how did you come up with the verdict that you did. and, in fact, there were so many questions that had to be asked we weren't sure we'd get it in in in 45 minutes we would be allotted. i was given the opportunity to ask the first question. so much planning went into this news conference that everyone thought it was going to happen. seats had been set up. cameras were in place. everyone was ready apparently except the jury. they were not informed until they rendered their verdict. she came in and said no one, not any of the 12 are going to speak to us. that was a major blow because so many people want to ask a question. let's weigh the jury, what was it they heard or didn't hear and how do they think casey died? who do they think is responsibility for casey's death? on and on major questions. i mean it is their right. i mean i should point this out. it's the right of the jury, they should not have to speak or be identified. there were so many of us that were hoping they would. >> so, we have heard from the lawyers on both sides. what are they saying tonight? >> well, you're right. we heard from the prosecution. we heard from lamar. you're going to hear from jose baez. let's start with him and then immediately follow up with jose. >> we're disappointed with the verdict today and surprised because we know the facts and we put in absolutely every piece of evidence that existed. our team did an exemplary job. i'm proud of them and stand by their work. i never, ever criticize a jury. theirs is the task of deciding what to believe. >> while we're happy for casey, there are no winners in this case. caylee has passed on far, far too soon, and what my driving force has been for the last three years has always been to make sure that there has been justice for caylee and casey because casey did not murder caylee. it's that simple. >> reporter: extremely subdued. jose baez. and then, of course, you know, i saw jeff ashton as he was getting ready to go into the courtroom before the verdict. you could tell he was electrified. he thought with the jury coming back as quickly as they did that is correct was a good sign for the prosecution, and what a total 180 for them. they were just absolutely shocked because they felt that they had really made a strong case. but, again, the jury saw differently. >> martin, i thinking a lot of people really were shocked and surprised just because they were out about 11 hours and this was a case they'd been in hearing for almost six weeks. some people suggested you'd take a day for about every week the jury heard the case before you'd come to some kind of conclusion. a lot of speculation out there. it just goes to show you that anybody who tries to figure out what a jury is doing is probably not going to do a very good job. thank you so much, martin savidge, for that. and we'll be getting back to you. >>> just over an hour ago an attorney put out a statement for casey anthony's parents and brother reading in part, despite the baseless defense chosen by casey anthony, the family believes that the jury made a fair decision based on the evidence presented, the tm presents, the scientific testimony presented and the rules that were given to them by the honorable judge perry to guide them. let's bring in our legal experts again. league analysts and former federal prosecutor sunny hostin and senior legal analyst jeff toobin. sunny, i would like to say, you've been saying over and over it was a circumstantial case and it wasn't just open and shut for the prosecution. i guess that's how it turned out, huh? >> yeah. i love that you point that out because a lot of people kept on telling me, you're wrong, you're wrong, but having been there and having tried circumstantial cases, i know how difficult they are, and in this case certainly the way the defense theory sort of played out, i think, in the courtroom and they kept on saying over and over again, reasonable doubt lives here, i think that perhaps resonated with this jury, joe, because there was no direct evidence linching casey anthony to this crime. no one was going to get up on the witness stand and say i saw casey anthony murder her little girl and so i think that was a problem for this jury. in fact, although the jurors haven't spoken to the media, one of the alternate jurors did give a phone interview, and he said the motive wasn't shown, that no one said that casey anthony was a bad mother. and i thought from the very beginning that that was a problem because if you believe the prosecution's theory in this case, you had to believe that she intended to kill her little girl by rendering her unconscious with chloroform and then placing duct tape over her nose and mouth to suffocate her so that she could be a party girl. but witness after witness after witness, joe, said she had an amazing relationship with her daughter, and so the prosecution really went all in. and if you didn't believe that intentional theory, then they were going to be in trouble. and so this alternate juror said that he felt, although he didn't get to deliberate, that the jury reached the right decision because the evidence didn't support that and because motive wasn't shown. >> jeff toobin, the other side of that, jose baez, the defense attorney, has really been criticized over and over again for the way he did his open, the way he did his close. as it turns out, the jury came back pretty quickly with a not-guilty verdict, siding with him on the most important charges here. this was really a repudiation, wasn't it, of the prosecution's case. >> complete. and think one of the real hard questions to ask today is why the prosecution brought this case as a first-degree murder death penalty murder case. i don't think anyone can fault the prosecution for bringing this case. i mean this was a tragic death of a little girl. certainly there was some evidence that pointed to casey anthony, her bizarre 30 days of not reporting her death, her, you know, very strange behavior for someone who is supposed to be a grieving mother, but still the idea that they would bring this case as an intentional murder case when there is no witness to how casey died -- caylee died, there is no proof of when caylee died, there is no proof of how caylee died, all of these, which are usually the building blocks of a murder case, especially a death penalty case, it seems like the prosecution got kind of carried away and overcharged this case, and i think that really backfired when the jury started focusing on what evidence was really there. >> i have to point out it's my understanding that you both have worked in prosecutors' officers and you both know the stuff from the inside. but sunny, i have to ask you, this is the kind of case that would really cause some soul searching in the prosecutor's office, would it not? >> there's no question. there's no question. i mean we know that this investigation went on for quite some time. they indicted casey anthony on a first-degree murder theory, and so certainly this went all the way up to the state attorney in florida, but i think jeff makes a really good point. when you're bringing a first-degree murder case, and in this case a capital case, if you don't have the answers to the what, the when, the where, even the how, i think it's very difficult to try to prove the who of it that casey anthony did this. so overcharging is certainly something that a lot of people in hindsight are discussing. >> i mentioned the defense attorney jose baez. we have a sound bite from him. he sounded very much like the elder statesman after the whole thing was over. let's listen. >> no real hard evidence, no dna, no fingerprints, nothing. but she's a liar. and she lied. and she didn't act the way she needs to. she made some stupid decisions, but let's make her pay with her life. >> there you go o. he made the case that she was portrayed as a liar and something we're not going to say on tv today, but, jeff, at the end of the day, apparently the jury, without being in the room, got a lot closer to jose baez's version of the case than they did of the prosecution's. >> i thought that was really an excellent summation because it really forced the jury to consider the evidence of murder, not the atmospherics in this case, which were very negative toward casey anthony. she behaved in a bizarre, creepy, lousy, unconscionable way in areas that did not really relate to whether she killed her daughter or not. that's -- and to draw that distinction between being an unlikable person and a murderer is exactly what the defense focused on throughout this trial and it worked. and, you know, more power to them. that's what good lawyering does. >> jeff t

liar? >> i wouldn't call her a liar at all.ould say maybe a little bit more than a normal person would lie. >> how did you find out she was first pregnant? >> she called them on the phone and told me. >> what did she say? >> she aid hey sean i hope you are sitting down i have something to tell you. i said what's up? she said i am pregnant? >> i did >>>> did you ask her who the father was? >> i didn't. didn't seem the right time. >> once she had the baby did you say is the father around? caylee looks like someone i know. >> not really. >> no discussion whatsoever. you are one of her best friends. >> yes. i loved her as a friend and if she wanted to tell me she would tell me. none of my business. >> what did you like about her? >> she was fun to be around. she was so happy. she would lighten the room up. she was a fun person to be around. good friend. >> when was the last time you spoke with her? >> i probably hung out with her at least a week before she was incarcerated. >> what was it like when you hung out with her? >> normal

liar." ♪ hey, white liar the truth comes out ♪ ♪ a little at a time and it spreads ♪ ♪ just like a fire slips off of your tongue ♪ ♪ like turpentine and i don't know why ♪ ♪ white liar found you out ♪ ♪ you better be careful what you say ♪ ♪ it never really added up anyway ♪ ♪ i got friends in this town ♪ ♪ hey, white liar the truth comes out ♪ ♪ a little at a time and it spreads ♪ ♪ just like a fire slips off of your tongue ♪ ♪ like turpentine and i don't know why ♪ ♪ white liar ♪ you said you went out to a bar ♪ ♪ and walked some lady to her car ♪ ♪ but your face has more to tell ♪ ♪ 'cause my cousin saw you on the street ♪ ♪ with a redhead named bernice ♪ ♪ turns out you don't lie too well ♪ ♪ hey, white liar the truth comes out ♪ ♪ a little at a time and it spreads ♪ ♪ just like a fire slips off of your tongue ♪ ♪ like turpentine and i don't know why ♪ ♪ white liar ♪ here's a bombshell just for you ♪ ♪ turns out i've been lying, too ♪ ♪ yeah i'm a white liar ♪ ♪ the truth comes out a little at a time ♪ ♪ and it spreads just like a fire ♪ ♪ slips off of my tongue like turpentine ♪ ♪ and i don't know why white liar ♪ ♪ snow [ cheers ] >>> back with miranda lambert

liar that has ever walked the face of the planet, so you can't even believe that she was a good mother, because she was such a huge liar and even her friends, because those are the only people who could vouch for her being a good mother, and she wove that theme throughout the closing argument. >> and so, did linda drain byrdak bring it together? >> well, she impressed me big time. both of the prosecutors have done a good job throughout the trial, and ashton was amazing and not that good this morning, but linda drane-burdick brought it home and i'm not worried about a first-degree verdict here, because this is the last thing that the jury listens to in delivery and she hears casey saying the f-bomb to her mother repeatedly and that emotion shows what casey really is in the jury's mind perhaps. i don't know, but i hope they can balance it and listen to everything, but linda drane-burdick did a fabulous, fabulous job. i would have wished when she did the call said a few more things and ended it there, it would have had more of a high note, and you have to know when to fold them, and that is a tiny minor thing to say, but bravo to linda. >> when we left the coverage yesterday the lawyers were going to go in to have a final conference with the judge about what is going to be said, and susan, how important is the charge that the judge is going to say, and how seriously do the jurors listen to this and take it to heart? >> the charge is extremely, extremely important. it is like getting into the car and thinking that you know how the drive it and then having the instruction manual that tells you all of the things that you don't know, and it is important. the jurors will listen to them. and the judge is going to let them take the instructions into the jury room, and each juror, and they will have the rules of the road and apply it to the car as you drive it and that is how they will deliberate, because they have gotten everything they need from the lawyers at this point. a rehash of the evidence, and gotten their each theories on what the evidence means, but now they need the instructions as to the law about how to take what they have heard in this courtroom and deliberate and reach their verdict. i think that it is more likely now than i thought before for a first-degree murder conviction, because after listening to linda drane-burdick and you stand back and look at it, what else could it be? so even with the holes in the case, no cause of death, it seems that you can infer now from all of the circumstantial evidence what that cause of death was and who caused that death, and when you got those two pieces, it is first-degree murder and as jeff ashton says, no matter how you slice it. >> let's talk more when we come back about what the charges are and the possibilities and what we are likely to hear from the judge, but he is in what he says is a 10-minute recess, and then we will come back to hear the charge from him, and the subject of a number of conferences with lawyers trying to decide the exact wording of what he would tell the jury about what has to be proved in order the come to a guilty verdict on these counts. we will take a quick break and be back with more of the coverage of the casey anthony murder trial after this. and it always points true north. toward mountains of sand. toward new sights and sensations. toward the true bounty of nature so let's set our compass for traverse city and find ourselves. in the magic, and the moments of pure michigan. your trip begins at michigan.org. >>> the question is no longer what happened to caylee marie anthony. we know. we know what happened to caylee. the question is who killed caylee. >>> prosecutors in the rebuttal this morning arguing it is absurd to consider that 2-year-old caylee anthony was killed by an accident and trying to totally put to rest the defense claim that there had been an accidental drowning with a cover-up and you have heard linda drane-burdick for about an hour, but perhaps the most powerful words came not from her, but by replaying some of those jailhouse phone calls of casey anthony, herself, and jonna, obviously, she is trying to say, this is a mother who could have done this. >> yeah. listen to be how cold, how nasty, and how bratty she comes across in the jailhouse tapes. you can't, when you see the picture of casey playing with her daughter and then you look at a her and listen to her words on those tapes, it is two totally different people. one seems evil, and the other one seems like a loving mother, and the jurors are going to be very confused what to do with that. >> and jose baez yesterday talked for a long time yesterday, susan, that casey anthony is a liar, and she comes from a family of lier y liars, learned from her parents to lie, and her brother to lie. this is a family where deception and hiding are normal points of view, but that does not make her a murderer. do you think that this sort of discounted now what seemed at the time to be a pretty good strategy by jose baez? >> yes, i killed that strategy, because linda drane-burdick explained the lies. she said, yes, there are many shades of grief, but there is only one shade of guilty, and what do guilty people do? they lie. so, she no longer looked like the general casey family liar, but looked like a specific brand of lier yar, a guilty person trying to cover-up a heinous crime. and then when you hear in her own words on the jailhouse video how she is again trying to lie to her parents saying, look in the database, check new york, and then they cut to her in the courtroom shaking her head with this angry pout. she looked exactly like who she is right there in that courtroom in fron

liar. i told you she was a liar the first day. i told you how this family lies. that has been clear throughout this case. throughout this case. but there is one thing you can't deny and that is myspace goes before -- right before, the next google search how to make chloroform. this is not true. this is misleading. and when she questioned cindy anthony on the stand she said 84 five times. she kept questioning her. 84 times you searched for cloa chlorophyll 84 times when this report was in existences. why? how could she do that? how can that evidence come before you? how is that truth? that is why you have more questions than answers. that is why. fantasy searches. fantasy forensics. phantom stickers. phantom stains. all of this nonsense and no real hard evidence. no dna. no fingerprints. nothing. but she is a liar and shut. convict heon that. she made some stupid decisions bulet's make her pay with her life diswhrarks is what this case is about. an accident that snowballed out of control. it is out of control right now and has been out of control since the moment the trial began and the moment of the case began it is out of control. and it is true, casey made some bad decisions and started this. the nonsense stops right now. is t. should have stopped the moment you all raised your hands and chose to be jurors in this case and took that oath. every single thing all of that nonsense should have stopped but it didn't. and this is what they want you to render a verdict. this is sufficient reasonable doubt, ladies and gentlemen, for you to say, you know what, i don't trust this evidence. this is proof conclusive proof that i don't trust this evidence. and on something so serious when the law says i can reject part of it, or i can reject the whole thing. it is just like there is an old legal addage t

liar, a very skilled liar and that her entire fictitious story about the nanny and her job at universal, all of those made up and the problem was going to be coming up as soon as caylee was going to be able to talk. as soon as caylee was going to be able to tell her grandmom and her grandfather that there is no zanny. there is no nanny. once the lies were going to come to a screeching halt according to jeff ashton, that's when casey anthony decided to use the chloroform and the duct tape. you see the video of casey anthony earlier, she was weeping. she was sobbing. for the first 45 minutes, she was pretty stoic in there and unemotional visibly but once they got into showing some of the crime scene evidence, they showed the skull of her daughter. caylee anthony found in the woods. they also showed the shirt she was wearing that was found out in those woods. big trouble comes in small packages. her pair of shorts and what jeff ashton referred to as her coffin, a laundry bag which happened to match its partner, laundry bag, inside the casey anthony home. jeff ashton was succinct and here's, basically, one of his stronger points of the morning. >> so on that morning, casey knew she would not be staying at that house. neither would caylee. because she knew that that night she was in the arms of her boyfriend and that caylee would be dead. >> and grimly, ashton also told the jury that on that date of june 16th, 2008 when the videotape from inside the blockbuster video store shows casey and her then boyfriend tony holding hands, renting a movie for their big romantic evening at his apartment, at that moment, little caylee was decomposing in casey's trunk. >> that's absolutely a chilling scenario that the prosecution has laid out, especially -- not just saying she wanted to live a free life and not being a mother but being so specific that she allegedly killed little caylee because she was about to talk at that age when she would be able to expose the lies. >> yep. it's truly a very succinct 1 1/2, hour and a half by jeff ashton, of course, coming up here in five or eight minutes, jose baez will get his chance to present his closing argument and then the state will have a rebuttal by the end of the -- end of the day. >> all right. phil keating, thanks very much for staying on it. >> let's bring back our legal panel right now, criminal defense attorney rachel krugle is with us, fox news legal analyst peter johnson jr. and defense attorney david wall. thank you for being with us. david, back to you. i want to put up the charges that casey is actually facing here. and they start with capital murder. first degree murder. aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and then there are four counts of providing false information. that's when she had those initial conversations with police. the capital murder charge, do you believe became a potential reality, more of a reality for the prosecution when it was learned late in this case, day 32, 33, near the end that cindy anthony had made searches on her computer at work and -- at home, rather, and not at work as she previously had stated, it was believed she was trying to potentially cover up for casey by process of elimination, casey had to have done those searches according to the prosecution. >> that's right, jamie. that was the issue, the one essential elements to the premeditation and now we learn that cindy could not have possibly done this. it was casey or somebody else but you know it was casey at this point. so that did serious, serious damage. i think the jury knows that cindy was covering, knows she was lying. and what that does is that puts now casey in a position where she wasn't before. far more damage has been done and now she seriously is looking at a first degree murder conviction because of that premeditation three months in advantage and that shows sort of a cunning and a diabolical premeditation that adds to the case that will give the jury to hang their hat on when they're considering life and death in this case. that's why the defense should have verified cindy's employment records before they put her on the stand to begin with or left her on the sideline all together. that was a huge gaffe and huge mistake. it could end up costing casey anthony her life. >> the chloroform didn't become a critical issue in some ways in this closing as i expected that it would. the thing you have to consider is that the prosecution has a difficult job in many ways in this case. there is no time of death. there is no date of death. there is no empirically proven mechanism of death. there is no actual eyewitness evidence or admission that casey anthony took the body and dumped it in the swamp or in the woods. there are none of those factors. so what the prosecutor relies on is something called conscientiousness of guilt. she knew she was guilty and acted in ways to cover up her guilt. that's the substantial piece of the prosecution's case. the prosecution knows that the scientific evidence is kind of here. kind of there. kind of new. maybe junk science and i would agree that, perhaps, it is junk science. >> when you put it all together. >> when you put it all together, though, we're still going to hear about dysfunction because judge perry threw the defense a life line and says you can't talk about molestation. you can't talk about incest but you can talk about dysfunction so if i'm on this jury and mr. baez invokes his opening in the same way that the prosecution decided to invoke his opening and maybe violate the rules and i say dysfunction of mr. baez, that jury will know that's a code word for those same things. >> rachel, is dysfunction enough to try to potentially get her off? >> well, ultimately, as peter points out, there isn't a lot of science here. ultimately what this comes down to is those 31 days so the defense has to try to make some explanation for that 31 days and don't forget also that the defense doesn't have to follow the rules quite as closely as the prosecutor has to follow the rules. he's not worried about being appealed in that regard. so the defense can be a little more creative as we've seen throughout this case. the prosecutor has to be a little more tighter and more careful with his arguments than the defense. >> what happens if he tries to go into the sexual molestation issue? will he be shut down? >> he'll get an objection. usually that's pretty rare during closing arguments. we're going to go back down to the courthouse right now. the host of the judge alex show is joining us and also a former florida criminal court judge. thanks for joining us. >> my pleasure. thanks for having me. >> i have a couple of questions. my first one is what did you think of the jury instructions that happened before the closing arguments and the judge's decisions on those? >> well, actually, the judge is a little frustrated because the instructions weren't prepared by both sides when they had a discussion about what they thought should come in and the charging conference, if you don't want the judge to give the instructions that he prepared, then you should draft up your own version and argue why that one should be given. as a result of that, they'll be meeting at lunch time to finalize the instructions but most of the instructions in a homicide case are pretty standard, pretty prefunctory but the judge's obligation is to give the right instructions. the standard ones can be found to be wrong after the case has concluded. that's why all this effort is being made. >> we know that the florida rules don't allow you to present anything in your closing arguments that has not been presented as evidence, probably why the judge ruled that the jury instructions and the closing argument could not bring up the sexual abuse that jose baez alleged in his opening remarks. do you think that that's something that jose baez might have some action depending upon how this case turns out down the road especially since jeff ashton brought up that he hadn't proved his case. >> no, absolutely not. that's the one circumstance where commenting on the defense failure to prove something is not burden shifting. when the defendant in opening statement promises something that he intends to deliver as far as evidence is concerned, that opens the door and is considered fair reply or invited comment, that opens the door to the prosecution in closing arguments saying they did not prove any of this stuff that they promised you at the beginning. it's one of the rare times where you can say that the defendant didn't prove anything because otherwise it's burden shifting so the judge was completely right to overrule that objection by the defense. i think actually, the defense got a bone on this. they threw this dog a bone, so to speak, because there was no evidence of drowning either. but the judge allowed them to infer from the limited evidence that there's a swimming pool, and the child knew how to climb the ladder to argue that and that's probably because it's a death case and that's the only reason. >> we're going to go back inside. it looks like things are back in session. stand by, judge. >> do i need to come down and see something? >> i will say that these were read into the record in testimony and i can qualify them by saying such, your honor. >> also a page here that's not in evidence. so i still object. this is actually a page that's not -- >> i would ask the instruction exhibits are for demonstrative purposes only and i would be happy to say so. >> portions that are not discussed at all. see what i'm saying? >> i don't think they -- >> just a second. >> sorry. >> one at a time, mr. ashton. >> this is a part of the deposition. >> you don't have any problem with that, do you? >> well, yeah, i do. for the same reason i have problem with the other quotations. clearly this is not counsel's memory of what was said. this is an actual photograph itself. the other ones we can say well, he can say this is my memory of what they said, but clearly this is the actual one, itself. council necessarily didn't say it that way. it wouldn't be the same. so they have to allow that. >> i don't think the standard is someone's memory. if i wanted to write down word-for-word what a witness said on the witness stand i could do so and regurgitate that in argument, the arguement to the jury. this was actually admitted in trial. and testified about. that is what i would like to do. i, of course, agree that it should be noted that they should rely on their own recollection, as to what i'm telling them. like, the same for mr. ashton. he made numerous statements that i. >> okay. anything else, folks? what i will do is the portion of the page, mr. ash top is exactly right. put white tape on that. yeah. [ inaudible ] >> i don't think it's out of order. if the court can see here, this is the photograph in the middle is not one that has been introduced into evidence. it shouldn't used in any way, shape or form in the argument. counsel can make reference to it. he apparently is going to confirm imaginary friend. >> who is the photograph in the middle? >> well, we don't know, but we can assume that the looks of it that it's. >> it looks like my anthony at some stage. >> right. >> probably wasn't the best photograph to choose, but how is the state prejudice? >> well, because it makes her look young and this is some sort of child-like invention that she has come up with, individuals, as opposed to a picture of her at age 22. up with of the photographs of miss anthony that was objected to was a smiling photograph taken at the orange county sheriff's office, because it had no relevance to the case. if they want to substitute that photograph, of a smiling casey anthony on july 15 or 16 of 2008, that might be more appropriate than having a picture of a child with an argument that her lying is child-like. and that she creates these individuals. it's not even a comment on the evidence, because i'm going to guess she is in eighth grade in that picture. >> what is the date of the photograph, folks? >> i don't have the exact date of the photograph. but miss anthony is a young woman. >> that doesn't answer my question. how is she in the photograph? what is the date of the photograph? >> let's see if i can get the approximate date. >> the other representations aren't accurate either. though they are caricatures. there is no testimony about eric baker, as i recall. >> there was. >> judge, this is our case. >> i just need to know when the photograph was taken, folks. >> somebody knows what this is. >> miss anthony, can she take a look. >> like 11th grade? >> no. i'm sure she is wearing makeup p then. >> jamie: prosecutors are arguing that photographs that jose baez, the counsel wants to present are prejudicial to the state because they show casey anthony as a young girl, estimating about eighth grade. jose baez says he doesn't necessarily know the exact date so they are reviewing some of the additional exhibits. >> eric: what is the importance of this, peter and rachel? when you have the arguments, not before the jury, but when they are deciding what they can or cannot present in the closing argument. >> it show what is a life and death struck this is, every image, everything seen by the jury is subject to intensive debate. one issue is was it shown to the jury before? was it in evidence? now they're arguing incredibly about what date the picture was taken, was she in 11th grade? was she wearing makeup? what light will it depict the defendant in to the jury. prosecution is saying we're concerned about the argument made by the summation by the defense about the so-called imaginary friendses a if it was a child-like figment, not some evil, vicious part of a scheme to kill caylee anthony. >> eric: could they allude to -- eluding to showing casey as young woman, alluding to the sexual abuse that they have denied and the judge said they can't bring it up. to plant it in the jury's mind without bringing up and sustain objection from the other side? >> jose baez is trying to give us a taste of what he intends to do, depict casey as child-like, someone deals with the heavy issues in a child-like manner, fabricating imaginary friends i think was the tite to feel piece of demonstrative evidence. that is what he is trying to do on some level here. >> jamie: why wouldn't the prosecutor know what evidence was coming in before this moment? >> this is the point to raise. it has been shown now, but it's also psychologically disturbing. if you are mr. baez and you are about to give the greatest closing of your life in a capital murder case to get into what the picture is, where did it come from? cover this up and that up. he says this is part of my theory of defense. >> jamie: i think the judge is ruling now if we can listen in. >> we have a moment to replace it with another photograph. >> interesting. >> interesting. >> eric: well, he denied the photograph. >> anything else? >> hi had a book of photographs, other things that i think he would have through a power point. have you had a chance to look at those? >> the one i came up and looked at that he flipped through. >> that is it. we're showing any other. >> judge: the one thing we did agree is for some of the printed matter in there, that there are his statements. >> okay. >> right. >> not quotations. >> right. >> for purposes of the record, the state used 77 minutes and eight seconds. out of the four hours that was given. >> jamie: all right. we are waiting jose baez, the defense attorney for casey anthony to give his closing argument. he has his work cut out for him. tall jury has heard so far is from the prosecution, piecing together the duct tape, the shovel, the chloroform. casey's behavior. the lies. that he says commonplace. and now as they review what jose baez can actually present, the jury is out of the room. they will soon return to hear what we would expect to be as peter johnson puts it the closing argument of jose baez's career. >> and the closing argument necessarily must focus on george anthony, which was a big part of the prosecution's closing argument. he becomes a critical, critical figure in the theory of accident. and in this theory of credibility. the credibility of george anthony was not touched on by the prosecution this morning. talked about him as a sympathetic figure, but we heard nothing or an explanation about the conflicting testimony about a mistress that he had denied so vociferously. he denied a mistress that may have been disproven, he also denied sexual abuse and he denied he was involved with an accident, or saying there was an accidental drowning that snowballed out of control. so his credibility is going to become key. let's look and see if there is a full-throated attack on his credibility. >> jamie: he did it in an interesting way, didn't he, rachel? >> yeah. >> jamie: saying if you believe george anthony did this and that, you have to throw common sense out the window. >> this is was i was going to say about the prosecution having you look at the big picture. let's not forget also as judge perry pointed out that the prosecution has two and then some hours to address all of these points and to take peter's advice and put his case back together when he comes up for rebuttal. >> jamie: we are taking a look here, we can see the picture argued about whether or not it could come in. and casey looking on. >> eric: what is fascinating about this, as judge perry noted 77 minutes has been used. they get four hours. in a prosecutor rebuttal we could have three more hours of closing statements. one would expect that that could touch on a lot of emotion. and as well as rebutting what we expect jose baez to say in a few minutes. phil keating has been following this throughout the whole trial and the case. what does baez have to do to bring george anthony in as he wants to? >> he is going to be talking about the clear social disflux within the anthony household. you can see this defense posterboard here that jose baez had made up graphically. although, the judge did not like the fact he used a photograph of casey anthony in the middle, surrounded by all of her imaginary friends. but the photo he used of casey anthony is when she was 15 or 16 years old and the judge felt that distorted reality. so baez having to cover up the element with white paper. the fact this is a defense piece of evidence for the closing argument. that he is the one bringing up the imaginary friends as opposed to the prosecutor, he is going to get into this is a woman with issues. casey anthony had issues. she is a chronicle liar. >> eric: we have a problem with the audio so we'll get back to you in a minute. what is your opinion of the photo? did jose try to speak something in there or a legitimate effort to show she had imaginary friends her whole life? >> the issue is why isn't at it current picture? prosecution said it had not been in evidence. clearly, this is providing a stumbling block to the defense at this point in the pace of where they want to be and the trial and their ability to go forward in a fluid way. but the lynch pin of the prosecution's case this morning and has been, that there is an equivalency between lying, deception and murder. if you believe that casey anthony is a chronic, pathological premeditated liar, you must believe she is capable of murder and she premeditated the particular murder. >> eric: do you think it will be enough? >> that is the argument and the so-called common sense argument. if you believe casey anthony is capable of this, based on this series of lies, the pattern o

when her own attorney admits she's a liar, a habitual pathological liar that has imaginary friends, and her daughter in the pool and panicked because she's mentally ill, that would have been a better defense. >> with a defense attorney, okay, a defense attorney is supposed to listen to the story that their client tells them. if that's the story that casey anthony told, then isn't that the story that no matter how convoluted he had to move forward with? diane makes a very good point. he did this and he did that and all the allegations out there that nobody has to prove during the course of the trial, but doesn't he have to go with what she is allegedly telling him happened? >> well, yes and no. diane, she just put it out there exactly right. let's remind the viewers, in a criminal trial, the defense has absolutely no burden of proof. they did not have to stand up and do anything, and there's something that they could do if their client absolutely insists you must tell my story, this is my story, and this is strategically what they could have done. waited for the state to get done complet

liar? >> i don't know that she necessarily is a nonstop liar. there are certainly aspects to her behavior during the 31 days that caylee was missing which showed that she was not telling the truth but her character prior to that time was not one necessarily of nonstop lying. i know that was what the prosecution wanted everyone to believe but that simply was really not the case during that 31 days casey anthony was really acting out of character. >> judge jeanine: but ann, with all due respect. we had people here on the show, the guy she was living with, his roommate said she was going to work. she told her parents for two years she was going to universal studios to work. this isn't just after the death, the drowning, whatever. this was before. the woman said she worked at a place and took cops there when she never did. you can't deny is a nonstop pathological liar. >> she certainly didn't tell the truth about her work history. given an opportunity to explain that she would have been able to explain that one aspect. to take one aspect about saying you are work when you are not working and turn her into a pathological liar is taking a step that is a little bit too far. >> judge jeanine: that is where we disagree. >> okay. >> judge jeanine: last question. what about you are appealing the four convictions for lying which is on videotape and things the jurors did agree with unanimously. on what grounds who you appeal? >> well, candidly, two of the counts, the what she was convicted of lying about were not material at all to any issues surrounding the investigation in this case. and that was raised in the judgment of acquittal. the absence of materiality which as you know as a prosecutor is generally an element to a crime. so, the statute was a little broad in that regard and i think that that is a quite an appealable issue. i think we are trying to