. ♪ >>> here with us now, president of the national education association, lilly escleson garcia. thomascorrect this time. >> you did. >> she's a school secretary and she's in salt lake and she's really excited she's on "morning joe." she was hyperventilating. you had some harsh words for arne duncan, can i say it that way. >> harsh and also calling for his job. you said, quote, arne duncan is a very nice man. that does not excuse the fact he's wrong, wrong, wrong, on everything he believes on reform. i love when he talks about affordable college. it's not that he's in the pocket of the coke brothers and wants to destroy public school, but he has drunk the kool-aid and i believe i will go down to my last breath telling people the most corrupting influence today is the high-stakes consequence for not cutting the cut score on a standardized test. >> i'll stop you when i disagree. because it is -- you're not going to meet a nicer person. he really wants to do the right thing. i don't know if he's ever been in front of 39 fifth graders the way i have. 20 years. and what we're seeing now is t