lisa phillips. comments? >> that was not too far off of debs' position. believe it or not because what he was arguing is that the central planners of his day were these large business owners, the carnegies, rockefellers, vanderbilts who had a lot of political power influence and in essence through monopoly formation, were the central planners of the economy in that period. he would have been with you on that. but he just wanted there to be a more diverse group of people, working people, who had a role in the planning of the economy and how wealth was distributed. he was against the central planning done in the period by wealthy by that point, americans and business owners. >> in the interest of time here, we were talking about the draft. i want to go on to his position on the draft. his famous speech in canton, ohio. to share with our viewers, a speech that ended up having debs arrested. to get a flavor of it. hub is here is one of two quotes. who shed their blood to furnish their kormss never had a voice in declaring war or making peace. yours is not the

lisa phillips is a history professor at indiana state university and a specialist in labor history. thank you so much for being with us. your thoughts on debs' significance to the american story? >> like ernest said, i think his cig kansz has to do with his activity in the labor unions, the american railway union, and the socialist party as well. he has had a lasting effect on many of the law that is were passed during the progressive year were as a result of his activist, some of which we still enjoy and he certainly can tell us a lot about his time period through his running for president and through all of his labor union activities as well. >> lisa philips will be showing us some of the artifacts from time to time in the house here. she is also part of the debs' foundation. tell me about the work of the debs' foundation and why you are involved in it. >> the debs' foundation seeks to keep the debs' legacy alive and what it hopes to do is promote not only the museum but the policies that debs promoted, which is social justice and equality and the rights of workers generally. so i

lisa phillips. the i.w.w. >> debs was a founding member of the i.w.w. which started in 1905. the i.w.w. was a clearly an industrial union movement. it was juxtaposed against the federal labor which is a craft skilled labors union. it was like what he promoted with socialism, a moving among a work class of people. its boundaries are not as nationalistic, and it's thought to work with workers in other countries, spain, france, italy. this never came to be, but they saw themselves as part of a worker's movement among workers fighting capital world wide rather than just in the united states. it fit in with debs interpretation to promote the rights of workers not only in the united states, but other places as well. >> was he affiliated with them throughout his life? >> no, there was a split within it's kind of complicated. there was a split in the i.w.w. over -- the socialist party had -- there was a split within the socialist party that affected the i.w.w., so he remained very much supported the i.w.w. but took less of a leadership position once rival socialist party leaders, i t

. >> actually, while we're talking about media, lisa phillips, will you talk about a publication which debs wrote frequently called "appeal to reason?" >> thanks. my ear piece came out for a second. it is sitting next to me. this is the "appeal to reason" right here. it was started in 1895 as a populist party newspaper. it became the journal or newspaper of the socialist party in 1901. it is one of those publications, many of newspapers existed in that time period, where people would read and find out as much information as they could. so, it was upton sinclair, whose book we showed earlier, was the "appeal to reason." other people wrote in it. debs wrote in it. jack london wrote in it. many wrote in "appeal to reason." >> i would like to very briefly read to you from a statement that debs made after the 1912 election. he sent it by telegraph to be published in the "appeal to reason." here is briefly. "from hand it is now certain that the socialist party has doubled its national vote." now the battle is ours, we must lose no time in preparing for the next. debs wrote the socialist part