so in the lydia shatz case, i believe that they interpreted any kind of bodily movement of lydia's as a willful spirit that they needed to break, and so that's why the session lasted as long as we've heard of seven hours. >> i guess, though, i mean there's clearly abuse and in the lydia shats case i don't think anybody in this church would say that was acceptable. they all say that's horrific. is it fair to be casting aspersions against an entire church organization as opposed to just bad individuals who clearly abused a child? >> well, i think that that's where the history of the ifb has come into light now. abc "20/20" did a documentary on april 8th called "shattered faith" in which they took a whole year to do an investigative journalistic piece on this culture. the findings were yes, this is what's being taught from the pull pits of these ifb pastors. >> i should point out we called the church for a response to talk to the pastor and did not get a response. but we look forward to continuing that discussion. jocelyn, i appreciate your time tonight. thank you very much. >> sure. tha