if you go to a small village, i lived in a village in mad gas car for -- madagascar for a while, theythought the biggest social and economic problem was spite, that people would do things just because there's somebody they can't stand, and they'd do anything to hurt them. economists don't usually work that factor into their calculations. but you have to create very specific institutions to get both types of behavior. in fact, if you look at it historically, the idea of self-interest and the idea of charity and selflessness both show up at exactly the same time. starting around 600 b.c., you've got the rise of impersonal markets. and exactly at the same time and places they invent cash, people invent all the world religions. it's uncanny. you say, well, here we have a space where we teach people just to get as much stuff as possible and not think about anyone else, and as soon as you do that somebody be else says, okay, here we'll have a space where we'll learn to give is better than to receive. [laughter] you know, they kind of follow one another. and whenever you have one, you will h