york city have been showered with corporate money money from the same corporations such as marathon wells fargo and j.p. morgan that now claim suddenly they are woke furthermore these companies sponsor events in dollars that celebrate the police and remind the public that police power is backed up by corporate power it looks very good to shell out money in the name of equality but will money speak louder than words when companies claim to support black lives matter but then fund the police i think that they're placing wagers and bets on all sides. that is to say that i'm sure these petroleum companies they feel that police departments their products and they believe that black lives matter folks buy their products as well however i think that those of us in the movement see this as hypocritical we see this as inconsistent and i think ultimately it could backfire against these corporations i think it's certainly a p.r. moment and none of us are fooled by it and that is to say it takes more than she months of sympathetic statements and postings one facebook to reverse an ugly history. that's our

marathon, not a sprint. >> you guys are now the largest mortgage lender in the united states eclipsing wells fargo, jpmorganmes we know that's incredibly impressive i think some of the questions raised is, look, it's a cyclical business it's been so high right now. your revenue was $5.1 billion but is there a point where it starts to look like a less rosie business because interest rates are already so low, probably everybody on the planet is trying to refinance now? is there a point when that turns and what do you do then? >> great question. dan and i were talking about this there's 11 trillion mortgages in the money meaning ready to refinance. the capacity is 2 to 2.5 trillion we're making up a great portion of that. when we think about our business, we think about the long haul. as we come up with strategies to grow, purchase, refinance, cash out, we don't think about the rates. we don't think is it going to be a $3 trillion a year market, 1.5 trillion, we target a normalized market and set our drivers to grow profitably. 35 years in the business, dan's always said, you know, interest rate is not de fact