that's actually valuable. >> mark patterson.d earlier in the show, a series of threats that were issued today by right-wing lobbying groups saying we are going to score this vote, you must vote against this if you are going to be a real conservative. 114 republicans defied that. 27 republicans in the senate. 87 republicans in the house of representatives. in this current client with those threats coming from the lobbying groups. were you surprised at what the, the -- the yes vote turned out to be on the republican side. >> i was a little surprised. given what transpired in the last few days. obviously, people just wanted to put some distance between themselves and -- and the very negative reviews that this, really ridiculous strategy has brought on the republican party. so, i think it, it makes sense, that people would do that. a little surprising the numbers. i am frankly glad. however, i am concerned that the lesson may not be learned. as you said, no means no. that lesson may not be learned. bah t because the democrats sought

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for more, i am joined by mark patterson, who was previously chief of staff at the u.s. half -- u.s. treasury. let's say there is a short-term fix on the debt ceiling. what does that achieve? >> we are not there yet on the short-term fixed either. i think they're a little ways from that and it will take a little more work on the part of congress to get themselves around to doing that. at is not just a great idea either. they all to be passing something much more long-term, because a six-week limit extension, as is being discussed, will leave the economy with the threat of default hanging over it. >> let's get to the workplace, they don't reach an agreement but reaching an agreement on the debt ceiling. what do your former colleagues do on the day that the u.s. government cannot pay its bills? >> they have uncomfortable choices, and none of them are good. conceptually speaking, they have a couple of asic options. they can try to reduce payments across the board. they can try to pick and choose payments. or they can delay payments. all of those things are really no good as a contingenc

mark patterson, you worked in the majority leader's office.ou know everything about how this stuff works. what, what is the staff doing backstage the c-span cameras are never going to find while their bosses are posturing the staffs know on both side we have got to fix this? >> the staffs are freaking out, lawrence. >> yes, there is that. first. >> you and i have worked on debt loan increases in our time. on this one i have never been more concerned that we are going to go off the tracks. but what i think and hope the republican staff are doing -- i help they're coming up with clever ways to impose restrictions on the congress in the federal budget process through budget resolution process that they can use to point to and say we did something here. having done that we will pass the debt limit. that is not a concession by the president. >> what is an example? >> they can impose new rules that have more teeth about the way the budget process works. the requirements that the conferences actually happen. the budget, budget resolution, most people

mark patterson, ted cruz out there not ruling out another shut down.ut you have, i think much more importantly, mitch mcconnell definitively ruling out another shut down. >> yeah, lawrence. you know what? that's great. i am glad he said that because it send a good message. but you know what would send a much more powerful message if congress goes ahead and enacts a law to do away with debt limit brinksmanship forever. that is not hard to do. in fact, a version of it that is actually inserted into the law they passed last night. all it would need, all that would need how to be done is make it permanent. named after senator mcconnell. his provision. i think doing something like that would reassure the world in a way that no statements, no enterview vie interviews and national review could do. tremendous message to the world that we are going to pay our debts. and we are still the stable country that lead the world in economic policy. >> mark, you of course have read every word of the bill they passed last night. can you amplify what the provision is you

. >> reporter: mark patterson former treasury chief of staff under president obama says before the end of this month, the u.s. government will owe $12 billion in social security payments and $6 billion in interest payments on the debt. and on the first of next month, another $58 billion is due in social security, medicare, and military and veterans benefits. the president would have to decide who to pay and who to delay. >> when i was at the treasury, we looked at all the options for sort of contingency plans. they all have sort of god-awful consequences. >> reporter: if, for example, the government can't pay interest on its treasury bills, which are considered the world's safest investment, it could cause chaos in financial markets. as goldman sachs' ceo lloyd blankfein said at the white house last week -- >> we're the most important economy in the world, reserve currency in the world. payments have to go out to people. if money doesn't flow in, money doesn't flow out. so we really haven't seen this before, askg to become a country that has frequent debt cree cease like greece. >> the

. >> reporter: mark patterson, a former treasury chief staff under president obama says before the end of this month, the u.s. government will owe $12 billion in social security payments and $6 billion in interest payments on the debt. and on the first of next month, another $58 billion is due in social security, medicare, and military and veterans' benefits. the president would have to decide who to pay and who to delay. >> when i was at the treasury we looked at all the options for sort of contingency plans. they all have sort of god-awful consequences. >> reporter: if the government can't pay interest on the treasury bills, which are considered the world's safest investments, it could cause chaos in financial markets. as goldman sachs c.e.o. said. >> we're the reserve currency of the world. payments have to go out to people. if money doesn't no in, then money doesn't flow out so we really haven't seen this before and i'm not anxious to be a part process that witnesse witnesses it. >> reporter: a debt ceiling cris crisis could cause interest rates to double on mortgages, student loan

. >> joining me now, nbc news course respondent luke russert and mark patterson, former chief of staff of tim geithner. state of play as of this very moment, 10:06 p.m.? >> the state of play, lawrence, is that more likely than not we will see the official unveiling of this deal that you mention in your opening tomorrow and possibly if everyone agreed in the senate could it leaves john boehner less time to try to bring up a different bill, really trying to jam the u.s. house of representatives. however, from where we stand right now, from conversations i have had, house republicans are already limited this deal because they don't feel it does enough to address the president's health care law. so in theory, the conversations within the house republicans -- is thursday really the drop dead deadline? could we try to negotiate to get to something better that does more to the health care law that wouldn't necessarily leave us having to pass the senate's bill? perhaps that would spur them to act more quickly but you're starting to hear that maybe not thursday. maybe we could go into the weeke

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first we had a great insight from mark patterson, a senior fellow at the center for american progress and former chief of staff of the treasury department who appeared on "squawk box" this morning. he explained in english while the deadline isn't hard and fast, it is the day when the treasury can no more guarantee all the bills of the nation will be guaranteed. it's pabl that all payments will get a haircut, or that some will be delayed or that the treasury must pick and choose what to pay and who to ignore. that's a horror show. as the month goes on with no debt issue, the top gaps won't even work and the government will be flat-out broke and most likely have to stop paying everything at the end of the month. remember, we're running a deficit, for heaven's sake. the treasure is a lot like a bank account for any small business. you don't want it to run out entirely. now, there are plenty of republicans who apparently think that the whole thing just a big charade there is plenty of money kicking around, for whatever that matters. how can that be? if that's the case, why do we ever need

for more on last night's vote and where we go from here, mark patterson. senior fellow at the center for american progress and we have grover norquist, the founder of americans for tax reform. gentlemen, thank you both for joining us this morning. grover, i know you had some tough words for some of the house republicans who were not in favor of this. what was your message? >> well, there was an effort to think that, gee, the house of representatives run by republicans could force the democratic senate and democratic president to give up on obama care. and the answer to that is, no, you can't, you need more votes in the senate and a different president to get rid of obama care or reform it. so they forgot their arithmetic. now we move forward to where the president's going to want to undo his sequester. and he didn't have the votes for that. the republicans started -- some republicans with an unreasonable demand, meaning you couldn't do it mathematically. >> this was a pragmatic approach. you're looking at and thinking there was no upside from this. >> the

gloria borger and john king and former treasury department chief of staff mark patterson., thanks very much. gloria, the president once again just reiterated, we heard him say it one more time, goins into the congressional leadership, he's willing to negotiate down the road but as far as the current impasse, he's not willing to negotiate. >> they have this huge speed bump, right? they can't get over the speed bump. you heard the president say it on cnbc, they're willing to talk about reductions in entitlement spending, without talking about taxes, that can get democrats pretty upset. they are not going to negotiate on this question of obama care. i was speaking with somebody in the administration today. they say it's done it's started, we're not taking anything away from people. it's over. we can't offer anything on it. sorry. >> this is another clip from cnbc. listen to this. >> am i exasperated? absolutely. because this is entirely unnecessary. we have a situation right now where if john boehner, the speaker of the house, puts a bill on the floor to reopen the government

mark patterson, chief of staff under former treasury secretary timothy geithner, are you concerned theown the road? >> absolutely, and i think it's a mistake, anderson. it's good that this is happening, obviously. we would much rather have this than a default right now, but a brief extension like this is really not an accomplishment that anybody can be proud of. >> what -- how does it actually impact to go from crisis to crisis like this? >> well, for one thing, all of you guys wouldn't be out here on the lawn all night every night. but look, already in the last couple weeks, it's cost the treasury department more to do the normal borrowing than it needs to do to run the government. the question will be, and what people at treasury will be focused on in the coming days is does that risk premium that's been attached recently, is there a residue of that? does that stick around a while? does it cost us more money over time, add to the deficit, which is the reverse of what are the proponents of the strategy. >> why does it cost more? >> because when people develop doubts about whether the

shutdown and art of the compromise with the washington insider and well known business leader, mark pattersone treasury department's options. and former ceo of disney michael eisner. he knows about negotiating. he's going to talk about the debt battle in washington. stick around for that and more. >>> welcome back to "squawk box" everyone. all things d reports, apple will hold the fall event october 22. we have the fifth generation ipad expected to feature thinner, lighter design and run apple's new chip. no word on whether the device will incorporate the touch sensor that recently debuted on the new 5s. >>> if congress fails to raise the debt ceiling by september 17th, there's a spoiler alert for you. none of the options are good. >>> u.s. is approaching the debt limit. prospects for a deal to avoid default are slim. joining us now to talk about the situation if the house fails to reach a deal. now senior fellow at the center for american progress. good morning. again, we had senator corker on. can you just tell us for sure the date. it's not the 17th. is it the 1st. >> the 17 th is the date