so don, this is from mary jo binker. did pearson have any relationship with walter winchel. or was winchel too much of a gossip columnist? >> no, they were good friends, for a while. in fact, winchel had the even bigger column, it was a broadway gossip column that was mostly -- pearson -- i mean, winchell's was mostly about sex, and romance, and divorce, and hold, hollywood, and broadway. very little of that -- pearson didn't write about sex scandals in the -- for the most part in the washington merry go round. but if pearson came across a really good story he would send it up to walter winchel and winchel would publish it in his column. for instance during world war ii, pearson learned a columnist for the washington times journal was having an affair with country of joseph kennedy's sons. it was john kennedy. that's one reason why john kennedy went to the south pacific, so he was aware from that woman in washington. this was a story that pearson picked up and sent to walter winchel. eventually, they fell out over mccarthy. pearson became a ferocious opponent of mccarthy's.