matt mason is here to talk to us a little bit more. and we have regulars back on the show, divion is here and rod curst is here. great to see all of you guys. i would like to start with you. the last line in the piece, you have to do something to survive. you have to beat them at their own game to survive. is that true? what happened to just suing pirates? >> well, yeah, i mean, the thing about pirates is that sometimes it is possible to sue pirates out of existence completely. if they are adding no value to your business model, if they are not doing anything useful, if you make it's too paste and they are starting to make counterfeit toothpaste with less poison in it, it is not good for consumers. everybody is happy that will be off the market, but the thing about this is always, always, always there's some kind of hidden value pirates are doing. take toothpaste. you don't want toothpaste on the market, but who is buying it? are they new customers? do they want your it's too paste? can you use the business channel? what piracy does is