max baucus of montana chairs the finance committee. this is an hour and 10 minutes. >> george burns said that retirement at 65 is ridiculous. today we will talk about people who want to work beyond retirement age and how those decisions affect social security. when it comes to social security, people say there are only two ways to avoid insolvency. there are other ways, and these ways did not involve cutting benefits. for example, there is that tax gap. it is the difference between what taxpayers owe and what they actually pay. the last year for which we have data, 2001, the total tax gap, which includes a payroll tax, was about $345 billion every year. this is tax that is not paid. in my view, as we try to whittle down the deficit, a good place is here. this, nine years later, is probably a lot higher. the point use within that three and a $45 billion there is also the payroll tax gap. $58 billion each year under the payroll tax, the social security that is note, collected. if that were collected, these are dollars that are legally ow

senator max baucus is the chair of the senate finance committee, although he welcomes a the doctor and said he looked forward working with him, said he was troubled by the appointment because it sidestepped the standard progress. on the republican side there has been a lot of complaints about the process and have concerns about berwick. host: would you give us a highlights of the major concerns. caller: doctor for wir. berwickd he believes there is a lot of wasteful spending. he believes the decision does not whether or not we will ration care, it is whether we will ration with our eyes open. right now we're doing it blindly. basically saying that rationing is already occurring by insurers that make the choices, and he would maintain, i think, that he is talking about cutting back on wasteful spending and over use of medical procedures that are actually not necessary, but the concerns republicans express is he going to cut back by a care? host: for those that are critics of the appointment, didn't have any recourse -- do they ahve ahe any recourse? hcaller: not really. hone of the thin