mcveigh was right.w the idea along of mcveigh moved forward to the right wing of today, including especially the people of january 6th. you know, what really inspired me to go back to this story was when in october of 2020, the fbi arrested the people who were planning to kidnap governor whitmer. >> right, michigan. >> i knew terry nichols, the codefendant, was affiliated with the michigan militia. i thought, i know these people. but they used facebook private chats to plan that. if you look at the right-wing terrorists of today, when the people -- the guy who shot up the walmart in el paso or the grocery store in buffalo or the synagogue in pittsburgh, they all used the internet. mcveigh didn't have the internet. he was right that there was an army out there -- >> he just couldn't reach them. >> he would go to gun shows but he didn't have the personality or the technology to meet these folks. >> so you draw a line from him, terry nichols, the michigan militia then, to the oath keepers on january 6th? >

. >> it's interesting because i think in the 1990s when timothy mcveigh orchestrated this mass murdernd i want to be clear that what he did is unfathomably worse than what rhodes did in terms of the sheer human toll, bought this idea of the founders and might makes right and today's revolution, it feels much closer in some ways to the cortissoz of the republican party in 2023 than it did to the republican party and that -- >> yes, absolutely, but the motivation is even more similar today than in 1995. talk about guns. the obsession with the second amendment and the idea, incorrect, but the idea that democrats are always going to take your guns away. >> and this is -- erodes >> central to the oath keepers. mcveigh, oh a lot of people remember he was motivated by anger about the waco raid, the bombing the second anniversary of the waco raid. he was just as outraged by bill clinton assigning assault weapons ban in 1994. that was the event where he and terry nichols said, that does it, we are bombing a building. >> this is where you get to this existential point. we talked today about des

timothy mcveigh. it's connected to guns, to white supremacy. and now we have a u.s.. >> revolting, utterly revolting. does senator tuberville honestly believe our military is stronger with white nationalists in its ranks? i cannot believe this needs to be said. but white narmism has no place in our armed forces and no place in any corner of american society, period, full stop, end of story. i urge senator tuberville to think about the destructive spectacle he is creating in the senate. his actions are dangerous. his words are gravely damaging. his refusal to think about the consequences of his actions on our military personnel and families is a stain upon this chamber. >> strong statement, paul, but it comes up short of tieing white supremacy back to mcveigh, back to waco, back to trump. >> he's right. but it's also coming from chuck schumer, so often it will be seen as a part san fight. this is so much bigger than that. this is the spawn of trump. tuberville is assuming this mantle of being a radical, kind of political suicide bomber, just going in on behalf of the

mcveigh up the federal building. in the book, we have pictures of timothy mcveigh perched on the hood of his truck outside mount carmel during the siege peddling anti-government t-shirts and bumper stickers. if you look at the stories about january 6th and we're seeing now people coming up for trial if you go on the sites for some of these organizations, promise keepers, so forth. they're organizers, all say that they decide after waco that the government was out to oppress citizens and they had to take arms and be ready again. we have to share this young guy and he is using waco as validation because was where the government showed it happened and that if you, you know in any way oppose, they will destroy you. we've got podcasters the first time alex jones any national publicity he showed up at a mount carmel memorial service grabbed the microphone from the moderator and started yelling about next time there's a waco, if i can get there, we're not just going to be trying to rebuild the church. waco haunts us to this

. >> you reported on -- this is about the 1995 oklahoma city bombing, timothy mcveigh.his reported out this fascinating book. they dominated headlines in the anti-government lone wolf. you think it's no the complete story. talk about the influences. i think it is relative today. >> if you look at mcveigh, you see that he was not a loner. not by himself. he was part of a movement. he was part of the conservative movement. a lot of people remember he was outraged by what the fbi did at waco. he was just outraged about what happened a year earlier when bill clinton signed the assault weapons ban. the obsession with guns. the belief in violence. the obsession with the founding fatherses. the idea that because the founding fathers rebelled against the british, we have the right to rebel against the federal government. listen to the people january 6th. that agenda was exactly the same. >> saying he wasn't a lone are is interesting. what i was obsessed with now is now merit garland's role in all this and how he stripped parts of that away and focused on hip as this was going o

thousands of lives and in tennis has shown up to say that differential i've had $12.00 number 2 nearly mcveigh and if he's out of being outside buying a brazilian qualifying because the jared raid, welcome to the program. most guy was targeted by a drawing attack on choose di following days of heavy fire on the ukrainian capital keys in the will run ukraine. the drawing is becoming the weapon of choice for both sides. most good began launching wives, so so cold kamikaze drawings last year to arising civilians and damaging infrastructure. but recently the devices have been used in a tax on russian soil bringing the war to fly them. a persians dole state the russian air strikes hit the ukrainian capital for the 17th time in the month of may across the country for people were killed and dozens injured. ukraine's president seem to criticize public safety officials after the deadly wave you quote, your show my want the local officials responsible for certain communities and territories to hear me now that the shelters in cities have to be accessible. people should know when and how the number and t

. >> mcveigh increase spending especially discretionary by more than 20%. we are spending more than any other time. if you want to look at the point in gdp we are now more than 24% of gdp spending on a 50 year average we are 21%. so, how do you do it? were going to do like everything the house will desperate when you make a decision on what's the most important they are not going to be able to spend so much more. we are going to make a decision just as republicans or democrats together. we are going to find a baseline thou be less than what we spent this year appropriated to going to stick together and prioritize what is right. you think it is right we would spend billions of dollars out there for covid appropriate for two years they never spent in the pandemic is over? what about buying that money back? what about helping people to back into the workforce they pay into social security and medicare. i do not think it's right to take me a hard working taxpayer and go borrow from china to pay the able-bodied person with no dependents to sit on a couch. [inaud

have you mentioned this morning, 5 minutes mister mcveigh to uh the suite of 3 scenarios of dividing a crane which is said a year before and i think uh these uh uh lots of to was, was talking about it. uh and uh, i think it's a big loss for agree it's, it's going to be also a big loss for you because you're, i'm function have been showing how much it has been pulled over by washington. and we have a 30 capture. i already published several hours before shopping. how much abuse g 7 in talk to i'm to start to be more wise to are based on at the state. so just to go to uh, just to mitigate the tension and just to push the funding misplaced them just to settle and to, to come to the table of settlements with the russian administration. despite them that they are just pushing just to try to send more. uh, width and the and the more money to agree, the administration in the plane, the business and the thing which in this egypt clown, uh, the landscape and no uh shipment, particularly i know it's pretty much take place. i think i think it distinguish now . now that to uh, to mosque formerly

extremists gravitate less towards the complex plots involving the large bombs we saw from timothy mcveight much more to this large body count and a couple of weapons and a manifesto, this aboutive shooter thing, texas being the latest example. as my colleague just said, looking at mauricio garcia, if you look at the chats going on inside the white supremacist world, here was a guy who was very active in those chats, posting nazi stuff, communicating with white supremacists overseas, who is being rejected by virulent white supremacist groups as not being white enough. so, you know, you see confusion in a group that recruits outsiders who are bent on violence and just need a label. >> amy, you testified on capitol hill last week. you had some heated exchanges with republicans. you said violent extremism disproportionately comes from the right, including especially white supremacists. do you think congress has a true understanding of what the threat looks like of white supremacists extremism? obviously, people can believe what they want to believe but it's the acting that's the real problem,

in the 1990's, timothy mcveigh. these things keep being brought up, these issues of violence and racism. these are core problems in american life that go to the real struggles to be american and to keep people safe. think about the fact we have 700 -- over 700 confederate symbols on military bases. we have black people serving from the military. these are core problems and denial in this country is really deep and has to change. amy: and you for bending changing its name -- for bending changing its name. i want to end with doug jones on a note of history. you have repeatedly said that perhaps the most important thing you have ever done is prosecute the klansman who killed the four little girls in birmingham, alabama, when they blew up the church. we are approaching the 60th anniversary of that tragedy in september. talk about the case and fighting white supremacist violence then, your role in convicting thomas blanton and bobby cherry, and where you think we stand today 60 years later. >> i appreciate you asking tha

you went to the university of texas where the lead attorney for mcveigh donated all the documents, 635 boxes, a million documents. you found pethings that people hadn't seen. >> you're a student of the law. you know that lawyers are not supposed to disclose their conversation with their clients. even after they're dead. that's what stephen jones the attorney did. i think it was a questionable decision on his part. it was a tremendous boom to me as a journalist to get behind the scenes in many the investigation. plus, i got all the material that federal government turned over to the defense as part of their investigation. so i have the federal government as well. >> how nice to see you both. >> how nice to see you, jeffrey toobin. congratulations. >> thank you. >> book after book. not sure how you do it. >> well -- >> it's a phenomenal write. thank you. >> be sure to pick up his book. we'll speak to one of the authors of the clarence thomas report. that will be later this hour. >>> right now, our coverage continues as "cnn this morning" continues right now. >> russia is accusing the uni

for example, in the case of timothy mcveigh, in oklahoma city, the judge there agreed that everyone hadboston marathon bomber, where there was still a community wide there was a community wide devastation, the judge concluded boston was big enough city that they could find 12 people who had not been personally affected by it. so the judge will have to do some fact finding to find a injury for this case. >> let me ask you about the "dateline" reporting. one of kohberger's sisters noticed he had been wearing latex gloves and driving by the murder scene and driving the same car. they searched it and said they didn't find anything. how might that information be used in the case if at all? >> i don't know that it will. i think the more solid evidence will be things like video surveillance of the car. the use of his cell phone that turned off kind of just around the time of the murders then right back on and placed him at the right route where he would need to be to head back home. but i think that it is possible to the extent they need some corroboration. this idea he's wearing gloves, talki

it has its roots in recent american history to timothy mcveigh, who has roots in being radicalized.. these sentiments have been in our country for decades and decades. but what is new is we have leaders like the former president, who is now the presumptivive nominee for the republican party, who are willing to engage with this insurrectionist ideology. this antigovernment ideology, which is so interesting because donald trump was a president. he was part of government. but his tenure was the hallmark of it was essentially antigovernment. he called government the deep state. so what's so different here, we have seen it play out time and time again over the last several years is that the extreme right, they listened to that. they listened to donald trump. they listened to other elected officials in congress and in the states. and feel like they have permission to go ahead and engage in assaults not just on the u.s. capitol, but assaults on state capitols. we saw that in 2020 during the pandemic. we have seen that in recent years. and seen assaults to just be sure that the record would