all right let's bring in our guests in messina christina milian yellow is the reader and laura hill university in the u.k. and member of the legal team representing garza victims before the international criminal courts in cape town in south africa tim murphy is head of peace building interventions at the institute for justice and reconciliation and here in doha in qatar south america is director of the center for conflict and humanitarian studies at the doha institute welcome all to the program sultan better if i could start with you now the israelis do not consider themselves to be an occupying force but as we've just been hearing in international law they are regarded as such right. they are i mean it is definitely an occupied territory as far as the low is concerned now the different interpretations by the israelis that really got some momentum following the 1988 were drawn of jordanian sovereignty over the occupied territories in the west in the west bank and those basically what they some israelis claim is that their land practically was occupied from jordan now there is no country deman