nbc presidential historian michael beschloss.. >> i hope we don't come to seeing a pardon. >> well, i think -- i mean, that's one of the questions is a lot of these things involve llowing rms and i think one of the questions is what stamina do norms have right now? we don't know. >> that's why we all have to hold those in power accountable. >> thank you as always. >> thank you. >> up next, new questions about jared kushner and the russian banker. stay with us. are (burke) at farmers, we've seen almost everything, so we know how to cover almost anything. even a coupe soup. [woman] so beautiful. [man] beautiful just like you. [woman] oh, why thank you. [burke] and we covered it, november sixth, two-thousand-nine. talk to farmers. we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ itbut one i think with quesa simple answer. we have this need to peek over our neighbor's fence. and once we do, we see wonder waiting. every step you take, narrows the influence of narrow minds. bridg

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nbc presidential historian, michael beschloss.o see you. >> great to see you, ari. >> thank you. without prejudging anything beyond what we know tonight, which we discussed the reporting and where this goes, we don't know. i wonder with a history can lens, why you're here, what does history say about what has happened when there are wider inquiries into the running of an administration? >> well, what has happened is that if there was an offense that's going to be likely found out. that's one reason why richard nixon went after archibald cox because he expanded his investigatn into various abuses of power which in the end included the obstruction of justice for ich nin was driven out of office. and so for donald trump to find out -- if he's finding out tonight that this investigation is going to go beyond, you know, the original focus of it, that's not great news for him. >> it's so interesting you say that because you're referring to in it is watergate timeline, which many observe took so much longer, it appears that both publicly

nbc presidential historian, michael beschloss. great to see you. >> great to see you, ari. judging anything we know tonight, where this goes, we don't know. i wonder with historical lens, that's why you're here, what does history say about what has happened when there are wider inquiries into the running of an administration in. >> well, what has happened is if there was an offense, it will likely be found out. that's one reason why richard nixon went after archibald cox. because he expanded his investigation into various abuses of power which in the end included the obstruction of justice for which nixon was driven out of office. so for donald trump to find out if he's finding out tonight, that this investigation is going to go beyond the original focus of it, that's not great news for him. >> so interesting you say that. you're referring to, in the watergate time line, which many observed took so much longer, it appears that both publicly, as you said, within government, the understanding of how tied with scope was, came later. so do you infer anything as a matter of best

for our closing thought tonight, it is very apt that we have here nbc presidential historian michael beschlossbeing here. it's nice to have you here. >> thank you, my dear. and it's so nice to see you back. >> thank you. that's nice of you to say. watching today's hearing, i was thinking about you, thinking about watergate, thinking about other presidential scandals, wondering where you put today's hearing on sort of the number line of presidential scandal. from a historical perspective, how serious is the president's situation right now? >> well, people have been saying today that donald trump may be in danger of getting impeached. i think that's not an overstatement. the amazing thing, rachel, here we are. can you believe that donald trump was elected only seven months ago tonight? >> wow. >> it seems like years. and in that quick time, he has gotten into this trouble that does have echoes of nixon. discussion of obstruction of justice and attorney general under a cloud and maybe white house tapes, and something we 't see with nixon which is anbiirector in public saying e president is a liar

joining us is michael beschloss. great to talk to you. always a treaty to talk to you. >> same here, joy. >> we started with this story of richard nixon at this moment when he's deteriorating and you have his defense secretary and his cabinet step in and go to the joint chiefs and say if he gives an order that seems odd or using the military, come to us first. we know that's unprecedented. do you see in the administration you're looking at now, do you see anyone in the administration that seems like they could play the role of intervening to put the president back on course if he were to go off course? >> this is what's so shocking of that story of susan glasser's that donald trump didn't give the speech that his advisers thought he was going to give. during watergate, henry kissen engineer and al hague felt they were keeping things steady although as you rightly say, nixon was drinking to some extent. he was not in a great mental state. and he later said, al hague saved the country and i saved the world. with donald trump, you and i have

michael beschloss, presidential historian. thanks as always. always great talking to you. >> i wish i could have been a little bit more calm tonight, joy. >> it's okay. we like you to keep it real. thank you very much. >> thank you. doing my best. >> indeed. up next, a report on that top secret nsa document that was leaked te press and the news tonight that the allegg leaker has been arrested. plus, the president got a rather interesting job offer today, and i'll explain. stay with us. it's the phillips' lady! anyone ever have occasional constipation,diarrhea, gas or bloating? she does. she does. help defend against those digestive issues. take phillips' colon health probiotic caps daily with three types of good bacteria. 400 likes? wow! try phillips' colon health. you're going to be hanging out in here. so if you need anything, text me. do you play? ♪ ♪ use the chase mobile app to send money in just a tap, to friends at more banks then ever before. you got next? chase. helping you master what's now and what's next. what's the best way to get v

. >> well, michael beschloss has read a little bit more history than president trump has because he hasdn't really -- hasn't really had time to read presidential biographies or much of anything else as he's been building his business. i -- sari knows much more about the state of the investigation than i do but i would take issue with one small thing the president said he felt vindicated after comey's testimony. it did not strike me watching it from the outside that a wise lawyer would look at that testimony and think he was vindicated. a wise lawyer would look at that testimony and think, there is a lot of trouble brewing for this man. >> sam stein, it's very clear from sari's story and our own confirmation of it today at nbc news this obstruction of justice inquiry began after the comey firing, and preceded robert mueller's appointment. so the comey firing is really the precipitating action that led to this -- what could be more trouble for the. >> the and brings in all sorts of different actors and sari can talk about this. rod rosenstein now a witness to the firing, becomes not just

we are joined tonight by nbc news presidential historian michael beschloss.story geeks it is just fantastic. >> what is old is new again. >> i talked to a great fan of yours tonight who said find a way to talk about how we have never seen anything like these times. are you amazed by the speed of a democrats working on an obstruction case as we speak tonight? >> so early in president trump's term. this is really a speed record. in nixon's case watergate did not kick in until at least four years into that term. the thing is absolutely amazing. he has not really had a presidency not under the cloud of a scandal of some time. very different for richard nixon. >> about our last segment, the fact that our politics washes across the pond and the fact that it is all kind of interrelated, do you buy that while you and i have had conversations about what sounded like a wave with very dark echoes especially in europe, we have 100,000 holocaust survivors left alive today and sure sounded like we were going backwards. do you think the tide may be turning a bit back the ot

for more tonight we are joined by nbc news's michael beschloss.you don't get wallowing in watergate and poppycock in the same evening often. i talked to a fan of yours tonight who said find a way to talk about how we indeed have never seen anything like these times. are you amazed by the speed, we have a special counsel, the fact that there a mocrats wking on an obstruction case already as we speak tonight? >> and so early in president trump's term. this is really a speed record. in nixon's case, you know, watergate did not really kick in in a big way until at least four years into that term. so you know, the thing is absolutely amazing. and he has not really had a presidency that was not under the cloud of a scandal of some kind. very different for richard nixon. >> michael, about our last segment, the fact that our politics washes across the pond and the fact that it's all kind of interrelated. do you buy that -- while you and i have had conversations about what sounded like a wave with very dark echoes in europe, we have 100,000 holocaust survi

michael beschloss, thank you for being with us tonight, sir. it's great to have you. >> thank you. be well, rachel. >> that does it for us tonight. it's been seven months since the election. we'll see you again tomorrow. now it's time for t"the last wod with lawrence o'donnell." >> rachel, when i was watching your last hour, oh, we were taking notes together when we were watching the hearing. the jeff sessions stuff jumped out at me right away when james comey said, well, we weren't going to tell him because we knew he was going to have to recuse himself really stunning. every line in the written testimony that we got yesterday which was explosive enough had tentacles, had expansions in that hearing today. >> you know, t sessions stuff is super interesting to me because there was this mystery left over from the written testimony, which was how did the fbi know two weeks in advance that sessions was going to recuse? he sort of cleared that up. but then we got this other super red hot stuff about jeff sessions today, that comey was willing to talk to sessions about these matters of a