joining us now, one of the plaintiffs, michael ferguson and christine's son, deputy legal director of the southern poverty law center. michael, let me start with you. earlier, i mentioned some of the specific allegations in the lawsuit. they are incredibly troubling. tell us what you saw, what you went through. >> sure. there were a lot of very strange interventions that were purported to help change your orientation from homosexuality to heterosexuality. among them were of the bizarre exercises that i participated in was i formed -- i was part of a group that formed a human barricade and on the other side of that barricade were a pair of oranges meant to represent another man's testicles, and there was a participant in the exercise who was supposed to breakthrough that barricade and grab the oranges and was instructed to squeeze them and drink the juice from them and to shove them down his pants and all this was to symbolize that, you know, his homosexuality was related to his lack of masculinity or his lack of, you know, these metaphorical testicles and that reclaiming them would pr

>> michael ferguson, who you saw, was 19 when he underwent this reparative therapy or conversion therapyjona, a new jersey-based organization, that offers this. and there were three others. two were 17 when they started. their parents joined or at least their moms joined this lawsuit, wanting their money back and wanting damages for the damage that they say psychologically, mental damage they say that happened here. they say that this therapy caused them depression, an excite, self-destructive behavior that has taken years, it's been four years since any -- since these plaintiffs have been involved in this. and now they say generally they're doing fine, but it's cost them a lot of money. one guy lost a year of work and wants that money back. >> so as i understand it, this lawsuit is suggesting that this is fraud, this entire therapy is fraudulent and intentional, i assume, if they're calling it fraud. what -- what's the defense here? are there witnesses they can bring forward to say we went through this therapy and it worked for us? >> well, the center that is being sued and counselors o

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