and michael landsberg, i don't know if that kind of makes the point. you were just trying to make. >> it does. i mean, i think, i think the bond market, for the most part, are going to be rangebound. i don't see rates moving up much higher from here, but i don't see them going much lower. i think we're going to have to be in this environment where we're investing with an environment of higher inflation, higher rates. that does not bode well for small caps. it's a sector that we haven't liked broadly for over three years. you basically made no money. in fact, you're negative for the last three and a quarter years in the russell 2000 index. you got to stay away from that. spaces that are not going to do well with higher rates. and again positioning yourself higher inflation has been a call that we've made since september. the crb index is up 20%. most investors watching this probably don't have a commodity exposure. you should because commodities have done well. we think they continue to do well. really even energy, god forbid energy got in the mix here

cheryl: let's bring in private wealth management cio michael landsberg. michael, i want to to follow up, talk about earnings as we're winding down q4 reporting. you say you believe in earning growth, but do you think that trend continues for the rest of 2025, or do you think there might start to be some kind of cracks in the armor for q1 is? >> cheryl, earnings are what we seem to go by. a lot of of noise around tariffs and this and that. at the end of the day, stocks trade on what earnings are going to do, and is we've seen double-digit growth in the s&p is, over 20% in nasdaq and actually, finally, the russell 2000 showed up to the party and they even got earnings growth. i think the earnings growth story is intact, and i think it should continue. there's a possibility for a hiccup here and there, but realistically, this is a fundamental story of corporate america doing the right thing and making money. cheryl: yeah. but also having to kind of weed through an uncertain and political environment which is what march that and i were talking about, to be cle