and this is for michael verna.g the 777 is important, and until it's found, it's a matter of national security. some believe that. and to others, it's on the bottom of the ocean. >> well, the fact of the matter is, we have no evidence. i live in the world of what is admissible evidence. we have no evidence of what happened. we don't even have direct evidence of the crash. we have indirect evidence based on the satellite readings. but we don't have wreckage or bodies that were recovered. that being said, what the prime minister making the conclusion on behalf of the investigating country, that does create legal liabilities on behalf of malaysian airlines. >> jeffrey thomas, there's good weather today, and seem to be the same intensity if not more to locate the plane. are you hopeful that they will find something soon? >> look, we are very hopeful that they will find something soon. in fact, more airplanes are arriving every day. some from korea and india are coming shortly. so, we're very hopeful that in the next co

michael verna, he is an aviation trial attorney, won a $23 million settlement for the victims of air light 447, that air france plane that went into the atlantic. michael, when you hear this story here and you think about those folks in beijing and in kuala lumpur and around the world, what is it that they're going through emotionally, do you think? you've seen the families ride this emotional roller coaster. what is that like when australian government comes out and gives a lead like this? >> well, the grief is incalculable for these families. the grief is something none of us can imagine. but in terms of the australian government coming out with this information, we have this problem where there's basically a conflict between this insatiable need to have more information and the lack of any reliable information. and those two sometimes conflict. the real impact of this that i've seen as a lawyer representing victims in these crashes is on the families themselves. their hopes get up and then their hopes are dashed. their hopes get up and then their hopes are dashed. in this particula

. >> reporter: aviation attorney michael verna said this case sun precedented. 13 days after vanishing no side of the plane. >> i've been involved in virtually every commercial aviation accident in the world in the last 20 years and i've never seen anything like this. as things stand right now, we don't even know if there's been an accident. >> reporter: he says until we know what happened to the plane, we are in unchartered legal territory. >> this will break new grounds in not only search and investigation techniques, but break new grounds in the law, because especially if they do not find the wreckage and we don't have any bodies to recover. >> reporter: typically, under the montreal convention, families of plane crash victims can sue the airline for damages without having to prove who caused the crash. in the united states, airlines must provide assistance to families after an air disaster. >> obviously, the u.s. law does not apply to a malaysian aircraft that was destined for beijing. and i can't tell you whether or not malaysian law has a similar law to the family assistant act o

joining me now, aviation trial attorney michael verna won a $23 million settlement for the victims of flight 447. also joining us our cnn friend mary schiavo, former inspector general of the d.o.t., now represents victims of negligence by transportation companies, including airlines. michael, let me ask you, do these families have any recourse legally if they get frustrated enough by the malaysian investigation, there's no international court, there's no way to change jurisdiction to force changes in who leads this investigation? >> well, no. under international treaties that apply to this accident, both the ko annex 13 investigations as well as the montreal convention, jurisdiction is reposed in either malaysia or china or the place of domicile of the passengers. so they do have legal recourse through that process. but to compel the malaysian government to do more than what it's been doing, it requires actions in malaysia. i will say that in the united states we have something called the family assistance act that was passed about 20 years ago. that has been applied most recently to