michio kaku, who is a physicist. good morning to you. also abc news chief health and medical editor, dr. richard besser, thank you for coming in, as well. dr. kaku, we want to start with you. on the issue of the meltdown, is it possible to have a fuel meltdown, to have all the uranium turn into liquid and still have it contained in the vessel, in other words, to not pose a health risk to the people around it? >> the answer is yes. a meltdown is not just one incident. there are degrees of melting. let's say that this, for example, represents the reactor at fukushima. the red here represents the super hot core that has to be continually bathed in water. what happens is, if you have a partial meltdown, water levels drop, and then temperatures rise, and the core begins to melt. but seawater is coming to the rescue. this is unorthodox. we've never done this before. this is a science experiment in the making. they're literally making it up as they go along. this is seawater being dumped to prevent the full-scale melting. but even if there is f

michio kaku. dr. kaku, when you hear and watch these developments, how much faith do you have and the people who are supposed to be fixing this problem? >> well, the first time we make a mistake, it's a tragedy. we sympathize with the utility. they were overwhelmed. but the second time they made a mistake, it becomes a farce. it shows their incompetence and you begin to think that maybe, just maybe homer simpson is running a raging nuclear power plant. you realize that this caused an international scare. people thought we were on the verge of the point of no return, breach of containment, release of radioactive fission products into the air. and oops, we made a mistake. >> but there's still reason to be scared here. we do know that there's radioactive water leaking in every singing one of the reactors to my understanding. you can correct me. isn't that a big problem? >> yes, it's like the little boy who cried wolf because one day we'll hit the point of no return. we may have to call out the japanese a

more on what this means and how serious it is for the people in japan, let's bring in physicist michio kaku, who is in berkeley, california, this morning. michio, thanks for joining us so early. we appreciate it. >> no problem. >> when we hear about the apology, this rather extraordinary apology from power officials, what is your take on that? >> i think that if i had the ear of the prime minister, instead of accepting the apology, i would simply remove the utility entirely from leadership of this crisis. and instead, bring in a top team of the world's best nuclear physicists and engineers, with the authority to call up the japanese military. only the military, led by an international team of top scientists, using tepco as a consultant, can contain this monster. >> you've been critical about the way japanese officials have handled this all along. let me ask you about the news of this morning. a rush to bring in fresh water to douse those reactors to cool them down, instead of the sea water they've been using for two weeks, now. why is this switch over to fresh water so significant? >> the u

joining me, abc news consultant, physics professor michio kaku.een the helicopters dropping water on the site. if that doesn't work, what's next? >> that helicopter dropping water is like a squirt gun trying to put out a forest fire. too little, too late. i think we're extremely close now to the point of no return. just a few more slight glitches and we're going to be in an uncontrolled breach of containment. that is a class seven accident that is a full-scare chernobyl. >> you think meltdown is inevitable at this point? >> almost inevitable. at a certain point, the workers going into that site will be on a suicide mission. they will have to abandon ship. and without anyone taking care of the reactor core, as we will have three simultaneous breach or containments. already, units two and three have cracks in their containment vessels. already, unit four has a raging fire, we think, involving spent fuel that is not contained by any containment vessel. so, we are very close now to something that is even bigger than chernobyl. >> so, professor what do

michio kaku. who is back with us again.e around the aleutian islands. >> that's right. the second-largest earthquake, in recorded history, off the coast of alaska. and it could send a tidal wave, 15 feet tall, that could hit los angeles. >> and there's a concern right off the pacific coast. >> that's right, in 1812, we had another earthquake. and the potential here is within a few minutes to five hours, a wall of water 15 feet tall could hit los angeles and go 2 to 3 miles inland. >> let's dig into what that would mean for los angeles. what kind of destruction we would see if there was an earthquake first. >> let's say we have an 8.0 earthquake, smaller than the one that hit japan. >> right on the san andreas fault. >> right on the san andreas fault. and according to the geological survey the devastation would be catastrophic. downtown los angeles flattened. 40% could withstand a 8.0 earthquake. 15% of tall buildings are at risk. and could, in fact, collapse. >> does that mean we're not as well-prepared as the japanese in t

and all day long, physicist michio kaku has been following the situation with us. so, dr. kaku, at this hour, what do you think of how long it is taking to get the generators back up? >> this is unusual. the first time in history. and remember, the japanese reactors are the safest in the world. but they were never designed to handle an 8.9 earthquake. 7.0, 7.5, but not 8.9. >> and you were showing me, the reactor water, the cooling water, is supposed to be this high above the core, giving some perspective here. what happens when it backs up? how quickly does it burn off? >> well, when the water levels begin to drop and expose the red hot core of uranium, it is 5,000 degrees fahrenheit. within 30 minutes, you can start to get a core meltdown. now, what's preventing that is the emergency core cooling system, the backup system. but the backup systems are failing. power went out in the backup system. this is what normally happens. in a nuclear accident, immediately, the generators kick in, poor cooling water over the damaged core. right now, we're desperately trying to put gen

michio kaku. thanks for being here. i wanted to show our viewers this am nation tonight, the plant itself and the troubling suspected breach in reactor three, prompting the prime minister to call this grave. but we're curious what concerns you most about this. >> breach of containment are the three scariest words in the dictionary of any nuclear physicist. for the very first time, we may have a direct pathway between the super hot uranium core through a crack in the vessel into the environment. at best, it means more radiation, more contamination, more panic. but at worst, it could lead to an evacuation of the emergency operators and then we may have three simultaneous meltdowns. >> and dr. kaku, you heard david wright report that staggering figure. that water at the plant, 10,000 times more radioactive than normal. do you believe there's a connection between that and what we learned today at the reactor? >> very much so. the only way you're going to get that intense amount of radiation is direct contact with uranium, p

. >>> we want to bring in our in-house expert, michio kaku. let's look at what happened overnight. you saw the helicopters trying to dump the seawater on the reactor. is that going to make any difference? >> i don't think so. it's like a squirt gun. using a squirt gun against a raging forest fire. they're overwhelmed, they're floundering. they don't know what to do. they're clueless. >> ironically, the u.s. is most concerned about the spent fuel reactor, number four. that's fuel taken out of the reactor. it's back. originally, officials thought this had been done for some time. but this is relatively fresh fuel which is why they're so concerned >> hollywood likes to focus in on the meltdown. the melted core exposed uranium. but old fuel, it actually is more dangerous than the meltdown. because there's more radiation in an unguarded spent fuel pond. >> it could ignite. that's the concern? >> it would be like fireworks. roman candles. zirconium will oxidize with air like hydrogen gas. when someone lights a cigarette or lights a light switch, you have a roman candle festival. >> it ma

michio kaku. you said they're difficult to predict but they move fast, first of all, the speed of a jet line er? >> that's right. up to 700 miles. we've been tracking these for decades since the 1960s. we have sonar waves sensing what is happening. that's where you get accurate predictions. we've been preparing for this moment. >> it isn't just one wave. in fact it could be a series of waves hitting the west coast throughout the day? >> that's right. when the earthquake happened, it happened over a very long area. perhaps hundreds of miles long in the crack in the surface of the earth. so you have not just one wave, several waves. the waves get reflected and wrap around the hawaiian islands. >> we talked about the giant whirlpool. when you talk about the cracks in the earth, you say that giant whirlpool off the coast of japan was caused by cracks in the ocean floor? >> two possibilities. these are called eddy currents. these can collide, causing eddy currents. or a crack also creating eddy current

michio kaku. the latest news we're hearing from japanese officials that the metal container sheltering the reactor is in fact. if that's the case, how much of a relief is that? >> the structure, that houses it. blew apart. it's only a metal skeleton because of a steam, hydrogen, gas explosion. but, here's the but, the metal vessel inside the building is in tact. that's the good news if that metal structure containing hot uranium is damaged, you're talking about a full scale chernobyl accident. you're talking about evacuating the entire province, talking about worrying about radioactive steam coming into the sky. but it's on a knife's edge. anything can tip it over. remember the building is destroyed but the vessel is in tact. >> when you drop a word like chernobyl it is very scary to a lot of people. let me ask you this. martha raddatz is reporting this morning that there are some fears in the american government that perhaps the japanese government is playing down the level of danger here. do you

michio kaku, who has been with us throughout this crisis. physicist from city university of new york and also the author of a new book called "physics of the future." let's look at the satellite images we got in from the reactors in japan. as jim explained, they're trying to wire these back up. is that going to work? >> well, the good news is that reactor two has now a cable established from the main power grid. the bad news is, that it's a race against time. unless they can establish power and get the pumps going, there could be an evacuation of the whole site because radiation levels are rising. abandon ship. that may be the mantra, unless they can get power to these reactors. but establish unit two, power has -- at least a cable has been established. >> we heard this morning, you were talking about radiation levels. that radiation has gotten into the milk and some of the food in japan. what does that say to you? >> it means that fission products are getting into the environment. and it's snowing. and rain in the future will melt the snow

we want to get more from our expert, michio kaku. we've been talking to him all through this crisis. i want to put up a map and talk about what's happening at the reactors. get you to sum it up. we have reactor number four, spent fuel went on fire overnight. they are going to try to use a water canon to put that out. reactor three, still a meltdown going on there. they had to turn a helicopter back from that reactor. reactor two, there was the compromise of the containment facility. and reactor one, there's a concern maybe happening there now, as well. you said the situation was dire yesterday. and it seems to have gotten even worse. >> it's gotten worse. we're talking about workers coming in to the reactor, perhaps as a suicide mission. and we may have to abandon ship. once you abandon ship, it is inevitable that you will have meltdowns in all three of the reactors. units one, two and three. and then, the final stage of a meltdown is called breach of containment. we have cracks now. cracks in the containment vessel of units one, two

. >>> let's get more on this with michio kaku, and joe cirincione. thank you for joining us again, this morning. michio, let me begin can you, you heard martha raddatz saying, u.s. officials believe the containment vessel in reactor two has been breached. how serious is that? does that mean that we're into a situation more like that chernobyl disaster? or still far away? >> i think we're very close to the point of no return. and if i had the ear of the japanese prime minister, i would suggest that he exercise the chernobyl option. that is, put the japanese air force on standby. assemble a fleet of helicopters. get sand, concrete and sandbag these reactors. like what they did at chernobyl. 5,000 tons of concrete and sand. sandbag the chernobyl reactor, entombing it in a sarcophagus of concrete. that's the last resort that the soviets used in 1986. and the japanese may have to use that final option. >> that sounds like a drastic option. what would be preventing the japanese from doing that right now? >> well, japanese are being caught flat-footed right

. >>> we want to turn right to physicist michio kaku this morning. dr. kaku, great to have you. you heard just moments ago, the prime minister calling this breach grave and serious. as you know, doctor, i was in japan for days. and rarely did the prime minister come out in this way, apologizing and using those words. what does this tell you? >> this is huge. for the first time, they're using that dreaded word "breach," meaning uncontrolled release of radiation into the environment. and remember, that unit three, which is suspected to have the breach, contains plutonium. plutonium is the most toxic chemical known to science. a speck of plutonium, a millionth of a gram, could cause cancer if it's ingested. so this has to be looked at very carefully. if there is a full abandonment of the reactor site, if they abandon ship, we could be in free fall. >> even before we heard the words used by the prime minister, doctor, we saw this in a tokyo newspaper this morning. the headline, japan's own nuclear safety committee is thinking about upping the level here. let's look at the numbers. t

joining us is physicist michio kaku, of course. dr. kaku, you've been leading us through this the whole time. we're glad you're back with us this morning. that troubles you to hear that? >> it does. the last few days, we had reassuring words. we've turned the corner. things stable. but it's on a knife's edge. any boiling spent fuel could cause workers to evacuate. guess what happened? just a few hours ago, this huge sufficient of radio active smoke came out and they had to evacuate the workers. >> you talk about that puff of smoke, let's turn to the map this morning. they put this together. as we push in on japan. you see sendai to the north, the earthquake zone. there's three areas where there have been concern. when we move in on this, we'll see them. sort of the towns to the north. the biggest concern in miyagi, they don't have indicators, do they? >> that's right, miyagi, the indicators damaged. ibaraki, further south, is measuring normal levels. but again, only temporarily. we expect the cloud to go over ibaraki, as well. and norm

. >>> we want to turn for a reality check on all of this to physicist michio kaku. dr. kaku, thank you for being here. let's dive right into that water situation. yesterday morning, we were talking about how unsafe the water was. now, we see the governor drinking a full glass of water. can conditions really change in 24 hours? the water suddenly safe for everyone? >> well, it does fluctuate. technically speaking it is safe for adults to drink. but let's get real. that reactor is unstable. you could have another spike in radiation almost without notice. and so, hey. things will fluctuate. that's why people are staying away. so, the credibility of the utility has suffered a meltdown. >> dr. kaku, the big concern was children and babies in particular. if you were in tokyo, had a baby, would you now feed them the water? >> i don't think so. given the fact that things are unstable, given the fact that we have lots of amounts of uncertainty, and given the fact that the utility has low-balled all the numbers consistently, i would think twice about giving that water to a baby.

and joining us to take a closer look at it, michio kaku, who is helping to understand the crisis.e's author of a new book, "physics of the future." being here at the smart screen. we take a look at zoom in on the four react theories are there. this is what it was before. and then on monday. >> look at this catastrophe in the making. hydrogen gas explosions in the three reactors. three reactors in various states of melting. 70% core destruction. 73% score destruction, now this. the spent fuel pump that creates more radiation than the reactors. >> that was monday. and then, today. >> it got worse. and they're desperately trying to put water in this thing. but it's like a squirt gun trying to put out a forest fire. >> you can really take a look at it there and see. >> they can't get close to it. so radioactive. the pilot cannot get close. they cannot put hose water into the system. the whole area is near-deadly radiation field. >> let's look at the reactor in the video we have. what do you see? >> this is an amazing video. you see the steam coming out. this steam contains cesium, iod

. >> we're going to bring in physicist michio kaku.hen you hear about what is being reported the multiple meltdown. what does it mean for radiation levels in japan and the people there? >> i think we're going to see more uncontrolled releases of radiation. at unit two, radiation are 100 times above normal level. workers had to be evacuated. you will get a lethal dose in just a few hours. what it means, water is in contact with melted fuel. melted fuel releases iodine in large quantities and that's what we find in units two and three. i think the facility has been low-balling the numbers, downplaying the risk you begin to wonder is homer simpson operating this nuclear power plant? >> you saw in neal's report when he was asking questions on what they're saying to him, michio the water that is leaking uncontrollably at this point. tell us more about that? >> there could be a breach in contain innocent containment in units one and two, a crack in the outer wall means there's a contact between the fuel and the outside environment. that coul