and microsoft zipped in.d let's say they reenacted the developments of their nemesis, and have not been focused on bringing out new product. in fact, their philosophy as expressed by their ceo about ten years ago was, we wouldn't be first to cool, but we' be first to profit. meaning, they won't come in with a new cool technology. they will wait for somebody else to do that. and then they will buy their way into that market place. well, the problem is, is that if somebody else is coming in with the product first, like an ipod or an iphone, they lock up the market. they start making all the money, and when you come in with the zoon, that is not the cool product. so people don't buy it. >> right, and the other thing they missed the whole iphone trend, they are passing them in revenue and technology, continuing to change our l live with the mobility. so how did microsoft miss the boat on the product? are they in too many places? you know they have the connect, they have the video games, maybe they have their hand

. >>> microsoft. how the one-time tech leader turned tech lagger and whether it's too late to fix it. >>> and the recipe for success, building a brand, an empire and a huge restaurant. my conversation with lydia bastianic. "the wall street journal report" begins right now. >> this is america's number one financial news program, "the wall street journal report." now, maria bartiromo. >>> here is a look at what is making news as we head into a new week on wall street. some encouraging news for the u.s. economy this week. u.s. trade deficit in june was the smallest it has been in a year and a half, as lower oil prices curbed imports, america imported $22.9 billion more worth of goods than it expected. bitter than what economists were looking for. and better than expected trade numbers could mean a stronger gross domestic product. we'll see about that. a slow market melt-up meanwhile continues. by wednesday, the dow had the first four-day winning streak in more than two months. >>> and then on thursday, t

i think it's important to think about where microsoft gets it's money. obviously it cannot trust those partners because they're not doing it right. they're going to say we're going to make our own tablet, show you how it's done, do it correctly, and if acor sees the market develop, nothing is stopping acer from building a tablet. it's a mistake, they don't know what they're doing, if acer, this is what they do, and they cannot beat microsoft, they might as well go home anyway. >> looks like they're taking a lot of hits, the august issue of van ti fair highlight when they call the lost decade, they're saying they missed mobile and tablets which they're now trying to make a move in, but are the attacks fair? stock is deferent than corporate and financial as well. >> i think it makes a difference. we have never seen it, xbox 360 is probably the only place we have seen success there. when it comes down to tablets, it's competing with people that have been doing this for years and years. i think it's terribly dangerous, even if it has to enter that market tha

so microsoft has to communicate that to the customers and partners.y have fired shots over the bows. >> how would you sum up the feeling on the west coast to microsoft at the moment? >> i think what microsoft has right now that it hasn't had in recent memory is positive buzz, not just from people around washington but in general. what they haven't done is delivered the next generation product that's going to drive when's expected to be a good season for them. the stock price moved on expectations. we need to see with whether with windows 8 to expand in to tablets and folks like qualcomm and the chips do and really important. if they can expand the windows franchise or if they're gong to get eaten away by the folks outmaneuvered them in mobile and whether they can change windows phone 8 in to something that's a contender with ip s o and android and business enterprise side is a big, big thing for microsoft continuing to grow. >> we have kind of handicapped the fact that the stock has done very well over the last year and there were three scenarios set

facebook ceo mark zuckerberg and paul allen, microsoft's cofounder. we begin with mark zuckerberg and facebook. if you have a facebook account, you've probably reconnected with an old pal, shared photos with your family, and gotten advice from your friends on what to buy and what to read. but facebook has bigger plans. it wants to turn the entire web into one big social network. lesley stahl first talked with mark zuckerberg in 2008, and three years later, we sat down with mark again. he gave us a preview of his site's new profile page, a change that would affect the 500 million people who were then using facebook, an idea that zuckerberg had cooked up in his dorm room at harvard. >> when you first thought about this--19 years old--is this what you had in mind? did you see this far into the future, or is it way beyond what you dreamed? >> well, it's funny. i mean, when i was getting started, you know, with my roommates in college, you never think that you could build this company or anything like that, right? because, i mean--it just--and we were coll

since microsoft hit that record, it's been a -- how do they avoid that fate?e bring in two experts. first to you, apple got a down grade today i had been told was illegal. what is your take on the down grade? >> somebody's trying to make some noise today and get their name out there. nothing to do with the future of apple. somebody is using this as promotional event versus stock cal call. >> okay. let's go through it. talk about apple tv. some people say this is not going to happen. an article recently maybe they weren't going to do anything from an actual tv privilege. so if they don't, is that a reason apple stock would fall? >> no. we've done a lot of research on it and been to asia and talked to people on the tv. let's say we're wrong. the investors i've talked to are keenly aware of this and want an apple tv in their home and not making investment decisions based on this. it's a small impact and add 5% to the calendar 14 numbers. that's gravy on top of this. the real key commenes down what this down grade misses how explosive the device in smartphones and

now acoring to microsoft the out-- according to microsoft it has a cleaner interface and social aspectslt in. >>> this is a cool story. twitter users you know about the hash tag reference. now there's a cash tag. users can follow stocks by putting the dollar sib in -- sign in front of ticker symbol and click on the symbol to see what they are saying about your favorite stocks. now a look at today's business news. >> reporter: good morning. topping america's money, one less worry for the financial markets congressional leaders have a tentative agreement to keep the government running past the election but there's little reaction on wall street. facebook shares are at a new low. some 43% below the initial price and the major investment bank ubs says it lost more than $3 50 million on facebook because of the nasdaq exchange's mistakes. and maybe a little crowded outside chick-fil-a restaurants today. thousands of folks plan to demonstrate their support for comments by the chain's ceo opposing same sex marriage. protest by the other side of the issue are set for friday. tickets for a cancel

>> they upgrade exhaust -- microsoft exchange. the first online a-list and -- system was cold -- called bpaus. this is a significant upgrade. supervisor kim: will there be a transition without any additional work? >> vehrs about 100 pc's that we have to upgrade which we're in the press' of a journalist jeffrey it does require yuima -- we are converting. supervisor kim: i was promised that the board of supervisors would be on outlook last year and the whole fiscal -- i have a hard time accessing e-mail. when i am here i am in chambers or meetings and i am curious as to when that will happen. >> we continue to work with the clerk of the board. supervisor kim: do you have a deadline? an entire fiscal year has passed and i was promised this would happen. >> i will check with the clerk and see if we have established a firm debris we want to make sure we do it in partnership with the clerk and all the board members are comfortable with that date for the conversion. based on our conversation, they are very excited about the new office 36

cnn-money went to microsoft's research lab for an inside look.re actually gonna call bruce who's sitting not far. he literally has two cameras here where he has a camera which shows him the full 180 degree field of view and he has another camera that's for example looking right now at me. it's controlled remotely, as long as the user has access to the internet and a webcam. so your boss could be on the beach, with a laptop, checking in on you. and it's not just for conference calling. the robot would have wheels, several cameras, and an h-d display. so it can roam around the office, attend a meeting, someone. this technology could even be used outside of the work-place. you could maybe travel the world- right from your living room. of course, the robo-boss is still just an experiment. it may never make it beyond the development phase. but robots working in the office shouldn't sound like a scene in a sci-fi movie. microsoft thinks it's only a matter of time, because wi-fi and 4-g networks are almost everywhere. i'm alison kosik ii new york. -----

you have 7 gb of free clouds storage as well as build in thin microsoft word, microsoft excel and marcuspower point. >>erica: a beautiful day around the bay area. asked plenty of sunshine and blue skies. into the overnight hours of looks like the fall will be creeping up for places like downtown san francisco. into tamara it looks like it will be sunny, warmer compared to what we enjoy today. in terms of tomorrow's high temperatures low 70's for downtown san francisco. >> authorities say he was injecting himself with syringes filled with a powerful painkiller and reusing the syringes on patients passing hepatitis c. according to documents, he caught the attention of its credit to the agency two years ago. a fellow employee found him passed out in a hospital bathroom. he was fired and he turned in his license. then he went on to work in philadelphia. the cannot be punished because there were no criminal charges. >> oftentimes they are not caught in the right thing is not done. south >> hopefully, this will be a wake-up call. >> i am hoping that this will be a real eye opener. institutions

microsoft does not do that. >> got to be aware. thank you, liz. >> um-hmm. >>> william says, he doesn't file he taxes last year and wants to know if it's still worth it. can you still get a refund? >> we reached out to the internal revenue service. it does encourage anyone who hasn't filed already to file as soon as possible. that's because if you are due a refund, it has been to be claimed within three years, folks, or you risk losing it completely. and even if you owe money, you still should still file so you don't get additional penalties. if you can't pay, by the way, what you owed to the i.r.s., it will work to find a absolute for you. it has installment plans if you can't pay all at once. >> our last question comes from scott. scott says "the washington post" gives him the option to donate his -- he wants to know what schools gets his papers. >> well, scott, we did check with "the washington post" to get your answer. it says that your donated newspapers are distributed to any school in virginia, matterland or d.c. who questio

microsoft goes back to the future. analyst initiating a buy on old softy. >> johnson & johnson makes a list of america's favorite stocks but the company has been plagued by recall after recall. is it enough to make the street squeamish? [ male announcer ] at scottrade, we believe the more you know, the better you trade. so we have ongoing webinars and interacti learning, plus, in-branch seminars at over 500 locations, where our dedicated support teams help you know more so your money can do more. [ rodger ] at scottrade, seven dollar trades are just the start. our teams have the information you want when you need it. it's another reason more investors are saying... [ all ] i'm with scottrade. >>> welcome back. time for "street talk." look at what's happening with microsoft. you know what? had a pretty good year and is it ready for another breakout is the question people are asking, brian. >> a smaller sell side firm thinks so. a buy and a $36 price target. not only would that be a 14% increase of here on top of the pop

microsoft says it is a late a short amount of time. >>vicki: to subjects dominating campaign rhetoric. taxes and jobs take center stage plus, stanley roberts takes aim at carpool users. ron at >>stanley: pay attention to the red mustang, the driver is trying to merge into traffic. the problem is she was in the carpool lane along. since the hayward office of the chp was at the on ramp at they will have a chat with her. not only was she there illegally but she handed them a passport from guatemala, no license. her car will be towed and impounded for of 30 days. the driver of this minivan just dropped off her kids at school and then jumped in the carpool lane on loan but there was one other problem, in her ashtray there was a partially smoked line. she was issued a marijuana and the images of war around 6 $7. here is something he may not know, the carpool on rams in california are active 24 hours a day, but the chp and forces them when the metering lights are on. the driver of this red tories had a few problems outside of the chronicle vi

microsoft is really doubling down coming to mobile.have had a slow start but they're not going to give up. you got to hand it to them. they haven't had the adoption they have seen despite being in the market for a year and incenting developers for apps. they have leaked images. they're very pretty. leaked on the gadget blogs and look very nice phones. very small and sleek and competing with maps, as well. they're putting ov maps in here and nokia's phones give you the apps when you don't have a connection and nice an driving out in the sticks and get lost, you can get directions. >> which is always very helpful to say the least. moving on to september 6th which is the amazon event. and, you know, the new kindle fire and the new kindle touch, amazon has just been executing superlatively. what are you expecting? >> holding this event in l.a. we think hollywood focused and put a lot of content deals on here to stream movies and tv shows and music and such. but they're also very -- they know that they're an ereader first and foremost and e

microsoft said it's a matter of time. reporting from new york. >>> coming up, a woman kidnapped and taken to miami's airport. instead of disappearing forever, it was the tsa agent who stepped in and saved her life. >> an rv in a pool. how did this camper make thises way into somebody's backyard swimming pool. >> should have gone right, not left. we're talking about annapolis. we have some storms brewing well north and west of town. does it make the trip into baltimore city? whole rae have the details cup -- we'll have the details coming up next. right now? yeah go hide. go on buddy. one, two... [ son ] come and find me! three! [ son ] are you even looking for me? i am looking! [ male announcer ] bite-sized chicken's grown up. new kfc bites. freshly hand-breaded big bites of premium breast meat, seasoned in the colonel's original recipe. try 10 bites with an 8 piece meal for $19.99. [ son ] dad? [ male announcer ] today tastes so good. not everyone can understand it. the worry. the endless collection calls. we know what it

and microsoft. what lessons can apple learn from microsoft?ent the last decade treading water. and facebook cannot catch a break as it tries to figure out how to make money from mobile ads. plus, twitter just figured it out. and more for less. the proposition of flying and the bill of rights and the former chairman of american airlines. we also want to hear all about your airline travel nightmares. we've all got them. tweet us and we will read your responses on air. now, sue, back over to you and "power lunch." >> thank you. simon, down to you. >> the department of transportation is working on a creative way to cut car accidents by actually having vehicles talk to each other. phil is live in michigan with the latest on that. hi. >> this is a huge study to see if this is the key to cutting back on a number of accidents. there will be 2800 cars in ann arbor, michigan constantly sending and receiving signals as they drive around. 364 will alert drivers to possible collisions and accidents. researchers believe these talking cars technology could b

ibm and microsoft apple.me high out of the gate. >> we are indeed on higher ground and i prefer the red hot chili peppers to stevie wonder. we are on higher ground. nothing can stop this market. my daughter bought an r aratf t-shirt off facebook. >> she's the one. she regrets it ever since. led by companies cyclical. you have nordstrom, a company -- erin burnett used to put on "street signs." you say industrial, they must be doing terribly. not. that's a very welcome sign. some companies we're see doing well are supposed to be companies we wrote off. it turned out to be a mistake to write them off. >> speaking about write-off, shares of groupon, hitting a new low, $4.34. barkley is cutting it down to an underweight, finally throwing in the to well on this one. and the rating was cut on groupon on friday. >> i don't know if you got the laser hammer removal this morning on daily deal. i just got my daily deal. look at this, up to 93% off laser hair removal and a waxing. when they wax you, brian, what does that

they join us from the microsoft studios in redmond, washington. mr. gorenberg, if you would, start by telling us what is pcast or the presidential council of science and technology? >> guest: it started back in the fdr days. this pcast has 21 members, it's chaired by john hultgren and vice chaired by bill press and maxine savitz. pcast works on number of reports, reports that were done for s.t.e.m. education, manufacturing, nanotechnology, health i.t., a number of other issues, and we took on this study in the fall as you talked about to look at the full potential of federal spectrum. >> host: craig mundie, if you would, summarize this report that you all gave to the president. >> guest: well, in the report we make a series of recommendations that span quite a range of issues that begin with the question of what should the strategy be long term for the country in order to avail itself of the benefits that come from all the new technologies, the new electronic and software technologies that are available today. but for a whole variety of reasons, haven

dylan, what does it do for microsoft? to use, more modern look. that's a big step forward it also importantly ties outlook into this kind of overall strategy that microsoft has. to kind of incorporate similar designs across all its products. the kind of metro design they have. it will fit better into the suite of office software they're building in the new version of window coming out later this year. it's part of kind of the overall kind of slow but grand strategy that microsoft has to kind of bring itself into the internet world and dominate you know, across software services, cloud stuff and hardware. >> scott, that all sounds very attractive from a microsoft standpoint. but it seems like they're a bit behind the game at this point, they have 325 million monthly active users who now use hotmail, now outlook.com. as a tech giant they're very slow to make this transition, this have very lost anything at the margins by moving so slowly. we use gmail, we used to use outlook. i think a lot of people use google mail. i think

>> caller: my question is about microsoft. after the struggling reports from dell and hp, you know microsoft has these new tablet coming out and the new logo coming out today. i was wondering, do you think this is going to help microsoft recover? >> well, i was dazed and confused by how bad dell was and i was sent off the deep end by how horrible hewlett-packard was. it's had a big run. it's inexpensive but i no longer think it's one i want oh buy at 30 given the fact two of the biggest companies they are affiliated with are [ screaming ] >> a sound is worth a thousand words. jude in new jersey. >> caller: your staff is terrific. i have an easy question for you. -- investing in manchester united. is that good? >> i pulled up one of the members of the u.s. olympic team that got the gold. she was telling carl quintanilla my partner she thought manchester united was terrific. it's terrific to watch. it's not terrific to -- i'm not going to say invest -- buy shares in that company. i'm a seller not a buyer if i had the opportunity

microsoft and not apple which helps microsoft.hen the question is there are other ways which historically and no reason why they are compensated. it's not true it used to be patrons not royalties they are relatively recent development. as long as there is a demand for new works and art and so on there are lots of different ways of conversation and also in piracy but i think it is right there is an impact that it's the least established authors and a tradeoff between the great access that computers get off to the consumer of intellectual product swap and the disincentives for the product if they are not fully compensated. >> well, first i have to defend the authors guild pursuing google not as an act of altruism but did it as a commercial venture, and they are selling advertising every time you go and look at the page google and the authors and the publishers had all agreed on a way to decide that income in the settlement, and unfortunately the court for its own reasons didn't approve along with the justice department said the sett

venn -- venture capital legend and eric of microsoft and peter of google. two of the leading experts in of the world this is a lineup. we feel very privileged to have had every single one of these people on the stage in the last twelve months. we are looking forward to kicking off season two. keep an eye on mailbox, museum news letter and the e-mail we'll be talking more about the lecture series to come. now on to the program. it was january 15, 2008, steve jobs was on stage? san francisco making one of the presentations. the kindle e-reader comes up. an jobs said this will go nowhere. being uncharacteristically blunt. [laughter] he said it would go nowhere because meshes have stopped reading. that doesn't matter how good or bad the product is. people don't read anymore. 40% of the peopled in the united states read one book or less last year. the whole concept is totally flawed. if it's true are people reading one book this year we know which book it is. [laughter] [applause] despite the late arrival on october 28th shortly after the tragic death it went im

microsoft is ramping up to make a serious push with a windows phone later this year and through 2013. at this moment in the case, a bit of a crack for microsoft to have new rounds of meetings of all the companies that are an droid hand set firms and say you know what? let's take another look. we know we will bring you lock stock and barrel that we have it locked up. >> and you have your shiny iphone 4s on the desktop this is a a great deal for apple. it could be great for the samsung gal laxcy 3s. that is a great phone. as a consumer i have had all of the iphones. i would love to have the gal laxcy. i have all of my media in i tunes. maybe that is a justice department case like we saw. >> play your i tunes play list on spotify. >> but you have to have a facebook account to have sp spotify. i pay for it. i will throw this in my man purse and run off. mike? >> the other thing that is notable is how much the stock needs to move. either to maximize those gains or to start seeing losses to the downside. i think the final thing is if piper put out a note they were talking about possible ben

amazon's on the fifth and nokia and microsoft on the 6th of september.ht have flipped them. back to back, folks. next week is a giant week of rollouts. i had the nokia phone with the microsoft software on it. >> you were charging it up to show everybody. >> i left it at the desk. i forgot it. we'll see if the android ruling brings market share to the complex. >> okay. >> all right. let's bring in herb. herb wants to talk costco. costco -- >> i do? >> he thought he was going to talk about navistar. no. it's costco. >> a joke i hope. i'm easily startled like a sheep. costco shares hitting all-time highs. the stock up over 18%. but as you might say, sir, on a stock basis, walmart and really target are beating costco over the past year. walmart is trouncing. do we have the comparison chart i requested, guys? much maligned? bribery allegations and walmart crushing costco. >> what was it doing? >> crushing them. get an analyst take and herb, as well. >> thank you. >> managing director of david schick joining us now. david, why is -- as much praise does krsto i

microsoft... mogul ...bill gates... looking... for ways... to... "flush out"... contaminated... drinking water... world-- wide...//...and, ../ .he.... says... the answer... lies in the ba.

microsoft unveils a fresh new look. erica ferrari has more. good morning. >> good morning, terrell.reece's prime minister is not expected to get a sympathetic ear when he meets with angela merkel today to ask for more time to fix greece's economic problems. merkel and french president francois hollande discussed greece during a meeting in berlin on thursday. both suggested it must stick with tough economic reform targets. the greek prime minister meets with the french president tomorrow in paris. >>> markets in asia pulled back as hopes dimmed for stimulus action. by the u.s. fed. tokyo's nikkei fell more than 1%. hong kong's hang seng also lost 1%. worries over the fed the dow lost 115 points on thursday. the biggest loss in more than a month. the nasdaq fell 20 points. >>> mitt romney says he'll be looking for someone new to head the federal reserve if he's elected president. romney said thursday he will not reappoint chairman ben bernanke to a third term. some republicans have attacked bernanke's recession-fighting policies. romney did not say who should run the central bank. >>>

compete with microsoft.as was pointed out earlier, am has two-and-a-half times of market cap of microsoft. i believe there are people like steve jobs and bill gates working right now, as we talk, trying to come up with some better product that three or five or ten years from now will threaten and perhaps even topple apple from its perch. >> brown: and just to stay with you on that, is usually that the companies faisomeho or that there is that other competitor waiting in the wings, ready to zip ahead? >> i don't think it's inevitable that they fail. i can think of the case of ibm which was tops in mainframe computer, then didn't do such a good job with pcs and they were in real trouble 20 years ago. lou gersner came in and turned them around and turned them from a hardware to a software and consulting company and now ibm is a great company again. it's possible for a company re-invt itself, but many more companies are probably going to have the trouble like general motors did where they were on top of the worl

no. 4, microsoft is thinking about the big holiday rush. the company will open a dozen pop-up stores in major cities across the country. mike soft expects this holiday season to be busy with the launch of windows 8 operating system and a new device called the microsoft surface. no. 3, iphones on sale, yup. apple is reportedly authorizing retailers to off $39 discounts on the iphone 4f and iphone 4 if the customer finds it for a lower price at another outlet. media reports say apple is expected to unveil the new iphone next month. no. 2, need help getting around the district on a bike? a new website app called bike planner can help. it was launched today. cyclists can use it to find the least congested and more direct route to get to their destination. no. 1, the price of gas is spiking according to aaa. the average price of a gallon of gasoline is $3.67 a gallon up more than one cent overnight and up 10 cents from last week. a rise in crude oil prices, pipeline leaks in the midwest and refinery fire in california are said to be the blame th

i'm jerry ross. >> tom: finally toni a makeover for microsoft.as the software giant gets ready to roll out its next generation operating system, windows 8, it offered up a new company logo. it's the company's first n logo in 26 years. it features four colorful squares next to a simple text with the word "microsoft." as for the simple logo, one critic said "this took 25 years?" that's "nightly business report" for thursday, august 23. good night, susie, and everyone. >> susie: good night, tom. have a great ebvenin everyone. hope to see you online at nbr.com and back here tomorrow night. captioning sponsored by wpbt captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

s $1.1 billion sale of some patents to microsoft. the news helped push a.o.l. shares up 2.9%, closing less than one dollar away from a new 52 week high. the stock has continued climbing since announcing that patent sale to microsoft in april. two of the five most actively traded e.t.f.'s were down, led by the 1% loss in the emerging markets fund. and that's tonight's "market focus." >> tom: the summer of discontent for gold investors may be coming to an end. prices have risen over speculation the federal reserve will do more to help the economy. gold settled today at $2.70 dollars an ounce. also on the rise: money going into precious metal funds. tonight's word on the street: gold. gregg greenberg is a reporter with thestreet.com. lots of different ways to play gold as you know from the fund side, etfs and mutual fund, of course gold or gold mining, let's begin with gld the i shares gold trust it slipped today slightly while the underlying gold prices were up slightly but what should investors expect from gld? >> well, the glg has rallied in the last two weeks

. >>> a challenge from microsoft founder bill gates coming up and it could revolutionize the bathroom and save lives. >> all right, we're talking about a major change to something you use every day. the toilet. we'll explain what we're talking about coming up next. stay with us. >>> a health alert this morning about how your blood type may influence your health. restroomers say -- researchers say people with type a. b. negative blood had a 20% increased risk for heart disease. type a. blood was associated with high cholesterol and type o. blood may also help prevent clotting. >>> positive reinforcement is working better than negative with punishing kids. kids were more lickly to behave than kids who were punished with spanking. according to the findings men were more likely to engage there positive touch with their children. >> i don't know if i'm part of the study or not. >>> retailers reeling in customers on the smart phones, more than a dozen stores announced a mobile payment network on yesterday. now it's called a merchant customer exchange and customers can simply buy the items d

everywhere microsoft says this technology could even be used outside of the work-place.'m carrie peirce and thats your word on the web. 3 you you the thing one paaent said... to a 7-11 worker... that got that reaction...in 10 minutes on fox45 news at ten powerful toy magnets.../that could kill.. .children..../the dangerous internal damage... they could cause... after the break orioles....they were in the bronx today, looking to do something they hadn't done since way back in 1986...sweep the yankees in their own ball;park...to say that didn't happen would be a large underst. understatement.... zach britton ghot the start fvor the birds, and they got to him early and often....bottom of the first, that slider is right over the plate and robinson cano disposes of it properly,,,his 29th home run...and the yankees have the early lead... ..bottom 3rd now, it's already 5-1...derrick jeter drops the little single into center...two runs come around to score,,jeter 3 rbui on the day...it was 7-1.......but there were more fireworks to follow...still in the 3rd...robinson ca