and microsoft boss steve ballmer.itical hand this election he did support barack obama last election. say for the sake of argument both of the guys are indeed obama guys, colin powell made it clear this morning saying voting for the president this time, just like he did last time. steve ballmer did it in a less obvious way. ballmer signing off on a letter to urge congress to get its act together on the fiscal cliff mess. inferring that the mess is not the president's fault, it's congress' fault. announcing a huge upgrade to the software and shiny tablet device to get the registering winning before the election. coincidental, i guess. no guessing the impact of the president which is likely good. it's good to be liked by colin powell and good to get a helping hand by steve ballmer i'm not saying either move represent the october surprise. more like for the president an october stick. it might mean nothing. it might do nothing. but for barack obama looking anywhere he can for mow men tem, it has to mean something. that i

we're waiting on microsoft. the estimates call for a profit of 56 cents a share on revenue of $16.42 billion in revenue. what are you looking at in terms of this slowdown in technology? what do you think that tells us about where we are? >> well, there's definitely an economic slowdown. it is different in technology for different companies. for instance, in google, the worrisome thing is like facebook, as you move from pc desk tops to mobile and more people are doing searches on their phones, you get less revenue per click. that was the metric that really hurt google this quarter. 15% year over year decline in the revenue per click. if it's really a secular trend to mobile, that's bad. in ibm's case, it was the services that ibm provided and corporate spending has really been pulled in. it's different for each of these companies. in microsoft's case, we clearly know there's a pc slowdown. the only difference is microsoft is at a 30% discount to the s&p valuation. it's pretty much assuming bad news right now. >>

problems a lot of the bears in microsoft will say and that is maybe that microsoft was late to the tablet game, maybe windows 8 isn't as revolutionary as it should be, that the apps are a problem and how do you generate that virtuous cycle that you need to get apps going on this thing. >> all that is true. and even some -- the surface to me was -- i thought it looked great. however, sometimes that doesn't matter. and to your point, maybe they are too late. i own the stock. it's been disappointing. he was talking about if they can do this, if they can't. what if -- what if they can't? what if the surface bombs in what's next for microsoft? >> i think people buy these things, as i said, about -- for the apps. and the problem is you're not going to see people start to make these apps that go with windows until they see the sales of this machine. now, obviously this machine right out of the box has been -- had been good but it's sort of the chicken or the egg. and that's the only hesitation i would have with it. >> let's turn the corner here and talk about shares of best buy, also related to

microsoft wants so badly to be cool. hope this makes them cooler. >> you got a lot of company in that call on microsoft. >>> today a yahoo! finance poll, where do you stand on stocks? 18% of you say it is a good time to buy. 42% of you say we're due for a slowdown. and 40% of you i have no idea which way we're heading. sue? >> yikes. >>> seema mody has a market flash. >> another health care mover for you. charles river labs mentioned positively at stern ag. the firm says they remain aggressive buyer of shares with a price target of $45 a pop and the stock up better than 3%. >> the countdown to the fiscal cliff is on and the most powerful person working to fix that situation is someone you have never heard of. we'll tell you who she is coming up next. >>> plus we'll hear imf chief christine lagarde's take on the state of the u.s. economy and that fiscal cliff. >>> as we head out with the dow jones industrial average up 90 points, here are the bargains in this market. perhaps five stocks that have price to earnings ratios

microsoft, same chart, same one year, same low in november, and microsoft has broken trend.agine being unchanged the last four months. stocks are literally surging. microsoft is unchanged. where are the buyers? just for fun, a little long-term chart, which is really -- this is quite remarkable. if you were to have bought apple or microsoft the day microsoft ipo'd, of course, apple was out in business -- >> 1986 we're going back to. >> microsoft has doubled the performance of apple, which who would have thought. >> some catching up to do for apple? >> you wonder. >> max, who do you like right now? >> up through the apple earnings about two weeks away, we like apple better. we think it will throw off more money. in the longer term, i think microsoft has a second act. it remains to be seen. if they get it half right they'll outperform apple in six months and longer. >> thanks for the history lesson, carter, max for joining us as well. >> we're picking up some steam here, bill. just about 35 minutes before the closing -- yeah, jim rogers is in the house. we'll talk to him in a m

i will start with microsoft. profits down, sales down, microsoft at 29. you touch it with the ten football? >> yes i would. it has a great dividends. dividend is secure. i like microsoft and it is down 24. anywhere between here and 24. i don't think it will go there but it did i have a position. it is that this price level but it [talking over each other] [talking over each other] >> moving swiftly along to a stock i do not known called google, $700 a share, weighed down. withhyou by it? >> if you look at google at stock graph based on yesterday's action and didn't know what business they do, wouldn't touch that with the ten foot pole. liz: the stock looks as good as stuart varney did. [talking over each other] >> there are ways to go and i would like to see the stock bottom out. it could go 550. there is a ways to go. i wouldn't be a buyer at this level. stuart: apple from 700 to 640. that is a bit. in previously you get a dip on apple you buy that thing because it goes up again. what would you do? >> i have missed buying the dips. i don't think i would

the focus now is on microsoft. the risk for microsoft is, with building the system they're saying mobile devices is really where the emphasis of the company is on now. they're cannibalizing pcs. pc growth is declining. risk is by emphasizing mobile, they could injure the core franchise of the pc because this is a whole new interface for the microsoft window system. it is going to turn off some people. it is going to be a hard change for people to get used to. if it turns them off, that could be a dent in windows. at the same time, if they don't get traction in mobile, then they get the worst of both worlds. >> quick question on the ipad mini. how important is it and is it as simple as saying this is what apple needs to do to protect its flank against the cheaper tablets? >> i think it is a very important launch for apple. the only area in weakness apple's seen in the tablet market which it dominates right now is in the lower end of the market where amazon has seen success with kindles, for the most part. google has

microsoft launches into the world of tablets. is it too late? it's midday in london, 7:00 in the evening in mei xiabeijing. in cuba, hurricane sandy has abandoned to the southeast of the country with a glimpse of 183 kilometers per hour. the category 2 hurricane has cut power, created 9 meter waves and a storm surge. thousands of residents and tourists have been moved from global areas as part of well rehearsed hurricane evacuation procedures. >> strong winds and heavy rain hitting havana. cuba experiencing the effects of hurricane sandy. while residents of the capital saw cover, it was in the southeastern part of the island that the parcel storm had made its landfall. maximum sustained winds of 180 kilometers per hour. >> the most dangerous for the moment is not the wind but the rain. this cwill be crossing over mountainous territory. >> with people riding out the storm the best they can, the storm is moving the northeast coast with heavy rain in its wake. >> " we are ok with the situation now. >> before its hit, it's a battered and jamaica wit

jon fortt sat down with microsoft ceo steve balmer to talk about microsoft 8, the surface tablet and >> i actually sat down with steve quite a while last week up at microsoft headquarters. the main occasion, of course, was the launch of windows 8. here's a snapshot showing the importance of windows to microsoft. last year contributed just over 25% of microsoft's total revenue. a third of operating income, $12 billion. steve balmer is excited about it. here's what he had to say about the launch. >> one is a tablet. one pcs. you can have both, no compromises. windows 8 is for work and play. windows 8 is all about you. all about you. and windows is all about phones and your whole life experience. not just what you're doing on the big screen. >> it's about everything. the guy's excited. hey, this market has actually gotten awfully complicated. in q3 hp and lenovo were the biggest pc makers. dell shipped 9.5 million. apple, 17 million ipads alone. that's not even counting macs. that's before the cheaper ipad mini which people will be able to preorder starting torl. that puts microsoft in

microsoft is losing share become. every day to have another situation where you have more applications available. i think the key thing is, i know it sounds hyped up, they seem like they are investigation. neil: i will give you the benefit of the doubt. you don't want to mess with the basic system on it. they decided to do that. i like my ipad very much.@ but i'm not going to use it as, you know, a desktop or even a laptop alternative. people are pointing me to this thing and saying this might be a. when you make of that? >> microsoft can't afford to sit on the sidelines. right now, consumer electronics is big business. consumers are out there buying electronics. retail sales jumped 1.1% last month. in part because of rising gasoline prices pushing gasoline sales. we are talking about 5% electronics. this is an $8.5 million monthly spending them so they have to get a visa. right now they're going to fight. as consumers make the decision, am i going to get that many ipod or that tablet, and there is a lot of spending g

that falls into microsoft. if someone's looking for large cap growth, salesforce.com, vmware, there's a handful of other names that are way better positioned in our opinion. >> got it. thanks for the time, appreciate it. we have that massive run, sounds like that massive run may have petered out at this point. >> i'm still in the microsoft camp. i understand it can trade lower from here, but i think this is a stock and we've said this for a while now, you can own -- i don't think you're going to get low enough to be low in microsoft. i think the balance sheet is impeccable, i don't think it's going to $40 tomorrow, but i don't think it's going to $25. >> that seems to be the trouble spot. >> yeah, trades more like an old-school stock, so to speak. and i think, joe, you hit on something very important. if you want income for a stock that's probably going to stay in aing tight range, which we've seen it do recently, you know, above 32 would be a dream, but it seems to hang in there at the 26 level. you can get so

microsoft is going to report earnings.eren't deferring a lot of coupon-related revenues so otherwise it's going to be reported down about 6%, 7%. together with the bat news about the pcs then if windows 8 ships and people are like i don't need this on my mouse and keyboard systems the sentiment will get more negative and that will be a good opportunity for people aren't involved in the stock if you see that setup to step into the stock in front of 2013 where the story will increasingly be, yeah, but in their sticky market where functionality and utility is more important you don't get on the ipad, i think the story will resonate better. >> one thing steve jobs taught us emotion can be very important and taught us through that with what apple came out with. if you're saying microsoft will bring a windows system to the general public that it will not fooind easy to use on existing laptops or new laptops even because it's so different, i mean, you know, there was some of us that were irritated by the new outlook, that we were

not just for microsoft but for other makers? >> absolutely.ve seen a real shift here in the competitive dynamic. it used to be about the pc. and now people are spending more and more time on these mobile devices whether they are tablets or smart phones. and that's really a place where microsoft is extremely weak compared to amazon, google and apple, especially. and so this represents a real shift for microsoft trying to be as relevant in this new computing world as they have been in the past. >> suarez: well, it's the largest single supplier of operating systems in the world. once a player like microsoft decides the future's in touch, does it move some of, have some of of its own momentum that the future's in touch, that's it? >> well, i think apple has already established that that is the case and others have followed. you know, i think microsoft is with the launch of windows 8 not just trying to reimagine the pc as we heard him say, but also to be relevant in that touch world and deliver the kinds of productivity and other computing experien

microsoft used to be viewed as growth. microsoft if you can accept its income, it's fine. you own it. it's slow money. >> you harvest. >> dennis gartman has pointed out, in fact, it is a bank. what microsoft is trying to transition here is back into the growth space. and they've failed to do so so far. loo in looking at the surface, in looking at all the products they've brought it i believe they'll continue to fail and not be able to break back into the growth category. >> but it has a red keyboard. >> really cute. >> it's so pretty. and a kick stand at the back. it's awesome. >> that is not going to be enough to drive people out of the apple ecosystem. i will offer to you that most of the enterprise users right now of microsoft products still use it because of the ability and the functionality of excel and microsoft word. if you're able to learn the apple ios system and incorporate those two business functions on apple, you're more likely to move completely away from microsoft windows 100% and go solely with apple. i'm inclined to do so. >> all right. you heard it from j

microsoft's boss steve ballmer shut up for the big announcement. microsoft is hoping to gain a foothold in the lucrative mobile internet maret. >> how will users react to the new design? we look now in our latest report. >> the launch of windows 8, microsoft's new operating system, is big news in the tech industry, featuring a completely new interface, which has surprised users. messages from social networks feature in the home page, and so the news updates. windows has been overhauled. can users at that? >> the new interface is certainly very cutting edge. it features a lot of innovations that users have to get used to. once you know how to use them, they are really easy to operate. >> microsoft will spend up to $1 billion advertising windows 8. in recent years, apple had made gains in laptops and tablet computers. plus, sales of smartphones have exploded. windows 8 could change how much microsoft features in sales. >> you can now run the same programs on your smartphone, tablet, or pc using the same operating system. >> by it still faces one big

>> we believe in microsoft.rosoft does not have to struggle just because hp and dell are struggling. as people move away from pcs and towards tablets microsoft used to think it has an important role to play. microsoft is generating free cash flow. it has a 10% free cash flow yield. a 3% dividend yield and microsoft is much more than windows. people forget the server business is just about as big as the server business. it has the x box and internet explorer. if none of the innovations come true it is a cheap cash flow story. if they get some of the innovations right we see upsides from here. why they have the struggles we think microsoft is a very good long-term holding. >> would you take a large position like you guys obviously have because i don't think pim co has positions that are small, would you generate that additional cash flow because moving this one and moving the needle on it is not going to move quickly. in other words, you can afford to be short a bunch of calls against this one because there are th

microsoft's windows 8 makes its official debut. from the desktop to the tablet, microsoft says it works seamlessly across all computers. >> susie: and going up-- why there's a construction boom of rental apartments in the nation's capitol. >> tom: that and more tonight on nbr! >> susie: investors soured on apple tonight-- the stock tumbled as much as 2%, dipping below $600 in after-hours trading. a rare earnings miss was the reason. the lower than expected numbers came just days after all the hoopla over apple's launch of the new ipad mini. apple earned $8.67 a share, eight cents below estimates. revenues came in higher than expected, almost $36 billion. on top of that earnings disappointment, the company gave a less rosy forecast for the future. suzanne pratt takes a closer look. >> reporter: wall street called this a throwaway quarter for apple. after all, the iphone 5 was only available for one week during the period, and the newly launched ipad mini has yet to hit stores. still, apple sold nearly 27 million iphones during june-

8 is a huge bet on microsoft's side. that is their way to get into the mobile space. windows 8 is the next version of an operating system may have to get the next four billion people and if it doesn't succeed, if it doesn't do well in the mobile space on tablets or smart phone they will hurt longer-term. i would be cautious around windows 8. we have to take a long-term view of this. in the short term unless you are buying a new pc and it has a touch interface there's not much reason to buy windows 8. enterprise's businesses -- liz: they are building it in. hewlett-packard is having people buy stuff now and saying we will reimburse you for any upgrades. who wouldn't if they have the money and are waiting wait to have that touchscreen so it makes it feel like the ipad and a lot of these are convertible and the screen snaps off and becomes the pad and become more of a pc or laptop? what is your best bet right now? where are you putting your client's money and what is a real opportunity no matter what a weak earnings season

you don't want to spend anytime with the microsoft guys and i know steve. sat next to him at a reunion. but when you read walter isaacson's biography of jobs. he was a man, and everyone wanted to hang with him because he was the coolest man in the room. meanwhile, google is the logical heir to apple. google has all the monetizing momentum you could have on your cell phone and that is why the stock is going higher. the default go to tech name is google. it is the financial equivalent of a judgment over who is cool. google is and microsoft isn't. the gulf is growing, which is why google up here is the one to own. stay with cramer. >> reports after the bell. i tell you i do not comment or recommend stocks on a takeover basis. it is going to send sprint further down. jim, are you abandoning sprint?

the hip factor, people are talking about microsoft again. you have seen the earnings because people are --. >>neil: people say it is confusing because there are two different shifts. >>clayton: what they are complaining about, with one touch on the screen which is bizarre, you can go back to the deck stop experience you are used to, your grandfather's windows, the start menu, or, you can is a tiled look with what is on the screen. they are saying we are not ready to commit to the new design. apple does something, they are read of the optical drive because you don't need it, and you have the cd's and they are saying, you do not need i. most companies and corporations are now just switching to windows 7. >>neil: or windows 5. >>clayton: i just got upgraded to windows. >>neil: this could work? >>clayton: am not convinced. you can play with the devices in apple or at best buy and they have a few of the stores but with the excitement factor and everyone knows, people do fought call them tablets they call them ipads. it is like calling tissue, kle

microsoft has $53 billion in cash after debt. there's a lot of cash there, maybe that's a drop in the bucket to them. but do they really need this now? do they need the con ten? i don't know. i just keep hearing the rumors. look, this is not the first time something like this has cropped up. i want to add one other thing. heck, in my 2012 predictions for this year on cents nbc.com, i said maybe facebook would buy the company. it's anybody's guess what could happen here. >> this is nonsense in terms of the rumors are saying. my question for kuo yyou, thougy would microsoft want to buy them and at what price do you think anything would take place? >> i don't know the answer to that question. i don't know what the price would be. would they want to pay a higher price, do they want a skype-type situation? what do they want? i don't know. >> okay. >> i don't think anyone else does either by the way. >> i think an interesting thing about this situation, we've seen this type of speculation before in a lot of different stocks. it's inter

any disclosures to make on amazon or apple or microsoft? >> i own ame, i own microsoft, oy do not own amazon. >> susie: all right, thanks for that. david gate, gva research. >> reporter: i'm sylvia hall in washington, where developers are busy building thousands of new apartments. i'll show you what's driving the demand in one of the country's hottest rental markets. >> tom: ahead of those big apple results, investors were busy plowing through a host of earnings and some so-so economic reports. new claims for jobless benefits fell by 23,000 last week to 369,000, showing continued slow improvement in the labor market. on wall street, the dow rose 26 points, the nasdaq and the s&p both tacked on four. americans were back buying big ticket items last month. durable goods orders jumped almost 10% in september. durable goods are things designed to last more than three years, like washing machines, televisions and airplanes. the jump last month couldn't offset the 13% drop in the same kind of items in august. but what about smaller everyday items

apple, did microsoft, are they late?truggled for so long to go from the consumer to the corporate side. and the iphone was good enough they said i really want this, and then the ipad came along, and now suddenly, a lot of corporations -- before they would tell their employees, sorry no apple products, now they do. that's a crucial shift that moved in apple's favor. >>> the answer is, and simon, you're not rude, everyone beats me up on this. >> no, on this issue, i think the conventional wisdom in microsoft loses, apple wins. so if this were to work, everybody hates it, apple can do no wrong, microsoft can do nothing right, so if they they they can do it, and it people would brefr that you have a win dope's cop patble product that they can manage, we need to look at what it will look like when it's a more compatible playing field, and you have compatible products, and it's not as cemented as it is right now. >> you were a manager at goldman in 1987. >> that's correct. >> any crazy stories. >> probably not enough time. >>

microsoft not helping, though microsoft disappointing as well. weak pcs is what they say is the problem. also weakness in europe. what's interesting, look at riverbed, up 12.5%. much smaller company but they saw spreads across the board. sandisk, a bright spot in the chip space. up on its news but marvell is the other side of that, they cut, their cfo is resigning. the chip space in particular because of the weakness in pcs having a lot of difficulty. zplin deed, bertha, thank you. >>> the dow is now down 175 points on the trading session. earnings pushing the markets lower today. mcdonald's missing on the bottom line. that just makes it on the top line as well. general electric out with its results. it met profit estimates but its revenues fell short. >>> and rival honeywell beats eps estimates but its sales fell short for that company. we have the first full week of earnings season under our belt. how are we shaping up? it is a rough ride today, mary thompson. >> it's been a rough ride so far, sue. as expected, profits are down from last year's

you don't want to spend anytime with the microsoft guys and i know steve. at a reunion. but when you read walter isaac son's by of fee of jobs. he was a man, and everyone wanted to hang with him because he was the coolest man in the room. meanwhile, google is the logical heir to apple. go google has the momentum you could have on your cell phone and that is why the stock is going higher. the gee fault go to tech name is google. it is the financial equivalent over who is cool. google is and microsoft isn't. which is why google up here is the one to own. stay with cramer. in 15 categories, including best overall car rental. so elevate your next car rental experience with the best. it's just another way you'll be traveling at the speed of hertz. we don't let frequent heartburn come between us and what we love. so if you're one of them people who gets heartburn and then treats day after day... block the acid with prilosec otc and don't get heartburn in the first place! [ male announcer ] one pill each morning. 24 hours. zero heartburn. and don't get heartburn i

and frankfurt, microsoft -- i'm sorry, there's microsoft shares down about 1% in frankfurt shares.google shares also continue to slide. >> do we have the google board? >> here is what google is doing, down another 5.7%. shedding 7% over the past week there. joining us now is james dicks media analyst. good morning. so we saw an 8% move yesterday. worse at times as investors tried to digest what was happening. having now slept on it, do you think that there is anything investors will find in here that's slightly more positive? >> you can always find i guess a silver lining to the clouds. i think one thing that really drove the results was europe slowed down more than expected for them and that really hurt the rest of the world results. given the macro conditions, that's not necessarily the biggest surprise, but when it actually shows up in the top line, then investors will react. a lot of it was currency. so if you strip out the currency, the miss wasn't quite as bad. but that said, google operates on a global basis, so currency is part of their business. >> just to talk about googl

you don't want to spend anytime with the microsoft guys and i know steve.next to him at a reunion. but when you read walter isaac son's by of fee of jobs. he was a man, and everyone wanted to hang with him because he was the coolest man in the room. meanwhile, google is the logical heir to apple. google has the momentum you could have on your cell phone and that is why the stock is going higher. the gee fault go to tech name is google. it is the financial equivalent over who is cool. google is and microsoft isn't. which is why google up here is the one to own. stay with cramer. i have a cold... i took dayquil, but i still have a runny nose. [ male announcer ] dayquil doesn't treat that. huh? [ male announcer ] alka-seltzer plus rushes relief to all your worst cold symptoms, plus it relieves your runny nose. [ sighs ] thank you! [ male announcer ] you're welcome. that's the cold truth! ♪ anything, yes, i'd do anything ♪ ♪ anything for you ♪ >> reports after the bell that deutsche telekom is going to buy or merge with metro pcs. i tell you i do not comment or

microsoft is down. i happen to be long both of these names. have more conviction in apple when it dipped back to 600 or close to that on friday. if you are sitting in the respective headquarters in cupertino versus seattle, which future looks brighter given the nature of the ecosystem you are creating and microsoft issues are well understood, are not radically different than the last ten years which is what's this company going to be as the world moves away from pcs with installed software and apple has answered more of those questions fundamentally as to what it's going to be in the future. >> speaking of those ten years for microsoft, they were sort of a loss decade for shares of that company, carter. how about shares right now? >> issue with two stocks down 10% to 12% over the last month is it weakness to take advantage of or weakness to stay away from. with apple, we think it's weakness to take advantage of. you can see it's weakness to take advantage of. 700 to 600. the weakness in microsoft we would put in the second category. weakness t

the iphone is bigger than microsoft. the entire company, just that one product, it was invented five years ago. so to miss a market like that -- >> unbelievable. >> you have to hold somebody accountable eventually. >> all right. >> well, from microsoft's windows 8 to apple's new ipad mini, it has been a very big week for tech and tech announcements. who had the best week? investor ryan jacob, who is the big winner? >> well, you know, we were still positive on the apple launch. i know people are disappointed with the price point of the mini. but for a product that's clearly superior to the low-end tablets, it's a very attractive price point for people that had wanted to buy ipads but weren't willing to shell out $400, or $500. >> are shares at an attractive price point? >> we think so. still trading at ten or 11 times earning even though their growth has slowed. apple conservatively should grow revenue and earning 20% to 25%. strategically nothing has changed with apple. >> why has apple lost $100 a share in the past mont

up next a former microsoft employee gives his verdict n microsoft's new products. you have to dig a little. fidelity's etf market tracker shows you the big picture on how different asset classes are performing, and it lets you go in for a closer look at areas within a class or sector that may be bucking a larger trend. i'm stephen hett of fidelity investments. the etf market tracker isne more innovative reason serious investors are choosing fidelity. get 200 free trades today and explore your next investing idea. new pink lemonade 5-hour energy? 5-hour energy supports the avon foundation for women breast cancer crusade. so i can get the energized feeling i need and support a great cause? i'm sold. pink lemonade 5-hour energy? yeah and a portion of every sale goes to the avon foundation for women breast cancer crusade. i'm sold. nepink lemonade 5-hour energy. get the alert, energized feeling you need and support breast cancer research and access to care. stuart: here is a big number. apple profits, $8 billion in the latest quarter but the stock is barely changed. th

so will windows 8 be a real game changer for microsoft's stock? that's what we want to look at in "talking numbers." we have richard ross and brent phil. gentlemen, good to see you. thank you so much for join pg us. rich, take us through the charts on microsoft. is it a buy or sell in your view? >> well, mooi kro soicrosoft is a relative and absolute basis. let's look at a relative substantiate point first. we've charted it against the xlk. you can see clearly this dramatic underperformance that began back in 2010. here we have the benchmark etf pushing out to fresh highs. microsoft virtually unchanged over the last three years. that's your first red flag. when we look at it on a stand alone basis, the picture doesn't get any better for microsoft. this is a year to date chart. your first warning sign. microsoft takes out the 200-day in decisive fashion. that's your second warning sign. finally, we break below key support back here at the lows we set earlier this year. it's also a 50% retracement of the entire advance from the december low into the

microsoft's bread and butter, windows and microsoft office, may be in trouble here.bring in herb greenberg, back to talk more about this. you and i were on our conference call this morning sort of screaming about the fact we realize we haven't really used microsoft products much in our personal lives for a long time. it got us thinking, is microsoft in trouble? >> when you're looking at it from the perspective of say word, which i have stopped using at home when i have a mac book pro and pc, you use my mac book pro. i basically have not installed word because i now use docs. i use google docs everywhere. i know people use evernotes because it is with them everywhere. the question is, unless i need it for travel, do i really need to spend up to get the word product or the spread sheets people will tell you they need, outlook -- if it's corporate entity, you need it. but beyond that -- >> people hate relearning stuff. right? particularly as you get older, you would, i'm sure, understand about this, it is horrible to have to face your computer -- windows 8, there's one

desperation for microsoft. today introduces windows 8.ke or break for the one time software king and for its chief, steve ballmer, yes, it's getting very close on the edge. "varney & company" is about to begin. ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] it was designed to escape the ordinary. it feels like it can escape gravity. ♪ the 2013 c-class coupe. ♪ starting at $37,800. ♪ >> okay. i admit it, maybe i was wrong about the on-line game maker zynga, do you remember this? i say there's a limit to how much longer real people will invest real money in these fake farms, therefore, i expect zynga underlying finances. >> i don't believe that, i believe that zynga is going to crank. stuart: well, zynga contraire toy what i said before is not dead. check the stock, it's up right now. even, even though we put it on death watch yesterday. the stock is indeed cranking, it's not because of phantom farmville pigs though, it's because of real money, on-line gambling and a partnership in the u.k., no on-line gambling deal in the u.s., and the fact that pigs may be a mon

>> microsoft, without a doubt. will be able to take advantage of the windows 8 release not only from an increase in pc sales but also from any additional sales in the tablets and smart phones base. so it's really positioned well for transitions. it did extremely well in its transition from windows 7. we expect the same thing. >> so you would buy microsoft here? >> yes. >> you would not by hp? >> no, and for many reasons. >> well, there are other issues facing that company. that was an emphatic no from her. what about you, mark, on the charts? >> i agree with erin here. i like microsoft a lot better than hp over the next couple months. you see a chart of hp. really since april of 2010, the stock hast 20% in value. it's been a steep down trend. >> and through three ceos in that time. >> despite being oversold, you need to see some sign of stabilization before you can step in and buy. you can't just say the stock is oversold and you need to buy it. it's now nearing 2002 lows near $11. that's an area that's a better ar