also in new york, mihcael hanna, a senior fellow of the century foundation. i am pleased to have all of them here. michael, what is read in terms of what happened on saturday? >> it's still not clear. we know the death toll was quite high, over 70 people. i don't think it was a preplanned attack. i think it was a confrontation when the demonstration tried to go beyond its regular bounds. but what was notable was this wasn't an attempt to disburse the protesters but an immediate reversion, just about, to live fire. we see much more heavy-handed tactics by the police. they have used live fire before. but this was no attempt to disburse the crowds, and a really quick reversion to live fire and, obviously, we see pretty disastrous results. >> rose: meaning what fthe increasingly hostility between the military and the muzz lil brotherhood? >> clearly, there's very little room for these parties to back down to, deescalate. that is the key to moving this forward. there's talk of an inclusive political process. we're a long way off from that. first you have to stop t