one think mike pence did is to certify the - mike pence did is to certify the results — mike pence did results of— mike pence did is to certify the results of the selection and jd vance — results of the selection and jd vance said he would not have done that _ vance said he would not have done that that — vance said he would not have done that that is— vance said he would not have done that. that is a worry as well for democracy _ that. that is a worry as well for democracy-— that. that is a worry as well for democracy. that. that is a worry as well for democra . . . ., ., democracy. we are running out of time. let's take a quick look at a few of the stories on the front pages. the daily telegraph, that photograph that we've seen with donald trump and borisjohnson, asking donald trump to stand by ukraine. the daily mail, the only debate is how if not if we build. and more on the king's speech. pushing for a brexit reset. the financial times european fears for security over the nomination of jd vance. the metro, the big story we've not talked about, tear gas. goodbye to gareth southgate

i guess it took me nine years to work up a well of sympathy for mike pence but poor mike pence isn't's been a lifelong republican. mike pence went along with all of it up until and then not including the coup. your thoughts. >> reporter: it's hard to get a much more loyal vice president to think than what mike pence was up until january 6, 2021, loyal in terms of the way that donald trump views loyalty. i recall i was in indianapolis when mike pence was formally selected there and i remember the very first interview that he did after being named and it was with hannity and hannity asked him the question what are you going to do in the white house when you disagree with donald trump? and he said at the time that behind closed doors he would have that discussion and tell donald trump why he disagrees with him, but then when the doors open up he would come out and stand shoulder to shoulder with the president. and for four years he did exactly that until he did not go for it with donald trump's plan to reject the certification of the electoral college votes on january 6. i covered mike

donald trump, mike pence is kind of a villain. is that because mike pence was disloyal throughout the campaign in 2016 and throughout his vice presidency? no. he was extremely loyal. he had one point where he was confronted with something donald trump asked him on january 6, trump asked him to do something that vice president pence did not have authority to do. mike pence chose to follow his constitutional authority rather than trump's orders and trump saw that as unforgivable. heading into this choice, i think what donald trump was saying is who is someone who no matter what i asked them to do will say yes, who will say yes to january 6 than area where mike pence said no? if you look at the resumes, that is what stands out about j.d. vance. it is not his experience in office, it is not his accomplishments. what stood out about him is clearly in the way he talks about things in public, the way he was willing to go on any range of talk shows, from the far-right podcasted steve bannon to the sunday morning talk shows. he would stick

vance's position on abortion rights, and saying vance would not have done what mike pence did, saying vance has suggested he would not have certified the 2020 election. rachel scott tonight right down on the convention floor. >> reporter: tonight, donald trump taking the podium of the republican national convention, surveying the vast hall where he will accept his party's nomination for the third time. but first tonight, the nation gets an introduction to the young senator trump tapped as his running mate, j.d. vance of ohio. >> i joke with the president that, you know, i'm very excited about this evening, and i don't plan to screw it up. but if i do, it's too late. he made the pick, right? it's official now. >> reporter: at 39, vance has a compelling story to tell. his working class background the subject of a best-selling memoir, "hillbilly elegy." he's a former marine, serving in iraq, a yale law school graduate, and venture capitalist. he was also once a fierce critic of donald trump. >> i'm a never-trump guy. i never liked him. >> reporter: but vance says trump changed his mind,

i was standing outside the governor's mansion in indiana governor mike pence was in there and it was a suddenly became clear that he was going to be the pick so many different calculations this time around than then back then but nevertheless, they are calculations and so i guess the first question, kaitlan, i'm going to start with you because you are very deeply-sourced in trump-world is never mind the pick what are the most important things to donald trump at this point when he's considering what kristen says, it's a big question mark. i mean, it is for the candidates themselves for this job. they also have been buying behind the scenes, even when there playing it cool and interviews senator marco rubio with you saying, i'm not really that concerned about who to pick is they're all talking about it behind the scene. no one has a good distinction or a clear view of it was, it's the same way as it was with mike pence and chris christie back in 2016, were watching it all play out again, trump could have a big event to announce that he could just posted on truth social. i mean, there's

mike pence objectively expanded trump's electoral base, and jay divans did not expand anything. but trump is the kind of person who does what he likes according to some politico-technological considerations, and by the way, no one said it was wrong. because quite often it's when you make some unexpected move that you beat the calculators, on the other hand, i don't think you and i can know who kamela harris will choose as her co-stars ticket, because by and large she also needs a person who will expand the electoral base, and they will now be democrats sitting and counting. which person, say, might be important in those states where kamela harris is not as, say, obviously popular as, say, joseph biden was, conventionally speaking, biden and harris added something to each other, now biden is not on the ticket , relatively speaking, kamela harris needs someone like biden, and they will watch it, while kamela harris, she's not that authoritarian. who would she like to see as vice president of the united states, who would be a more successful candidate, who would demonstrate that th

i think looking back at donald trump experience with vice president mike pence. we know, he now sees -- he does not think life that pickhe or mike pence, i would say donald trump in way he talks about him mike pence was a villain, why, because he was disloyal throughout campaign, in throughout his vicegn presidency, no he was loyal but he had a point he was confronted with something that donald trump asked him on january 6, trump asked him to do something that vice president pence in his power in constitution, did not have authority to do, pence chose to follow his can constitutional authority rather than trump's orders and trump saw it as disloyal and unforgivable, heading to this choice, i think with donald trump was saying is who is someone who no matter what i ask to do, will say yes. who will say, yes in january 6 type scenario, mike pence said no, you look at resume that is what stands out about jd vance. he went on range of talk shows, he would stick up for donald trump. and if not urge to go further that was appealing about jd vance. >> and you can join c

doing what mike pence would not.er get over what mike pence would do. he called him a p word. -- trump assistant recounting how icky a vodka felt -- his daughter felt about the words her father used. donald trump to regret was the thing penta did not do that would have kept him in office. he's not been for a policy partner. -- j.d. vance will do the one thing penta would not. >> the other thing i think j.d. vance brings that will be consequential for the world, -- he is even more radical on the issue of ukraine then trump. trump is already promising if he is elected, america will switch sides and get out of nato. he thinks nato should collapse. is also inviting russia to attack our nato allies. he is essentially think he will support russia's ames in the ukraine war. that will be a world shaking think. to know his running mate is there to effectuate that just as much of anything else that is motivating -- will be consequential for the world. even before we have the election. i want to say for a second, tim scott is a

vance well enough, but i did watch mike pence up close and mike pence understood the assignment of thee president to donald trump and he executed and i think was a terrific messenger for donald trump and the white house and not only here domestically but on the global stage. up until january 6 i think that there was very little friction between the two men. for j.d. vance, though, i will refer to a conversation i literally just had before going on air with you that i had with matt gaetz, the congressman out of florida who is a part of the wing of the gop that has risen in prevalence inside of the halls of congress and now making his way alongside donald trump in his running mate, j.d. vance, he told me he would say the difference between mike pence and j.d. vance is that j.d. vance would be a powerful president of the senate and what does that mean? essentially j.d. vance would be the one working as the congressional liaison with the white house to ensure that the exact legislation that donald trump and his team want executed on capitol hill is executed on. you have marjorie taylor gre

hang mike pence! as his supporters stormed the capitol building, they chanted, "hang mike pence!" vice president because he refused to block the certification ofjoe biden as president. mr pence had to be evacuated from his office. donald trump cannot now be prosecuted for all the conversations in which he had been pressuring mike pence to overturn the election results. the supreme court did not say whether all the charges donald trump is facing are covered by presidential immunity, so it's going to have to be argued out in a lower court. which of his actions were official presidential acts and have immunity, and which were not, meaning he can still be prosecuted for them? trump is also facing charges in the state of georgia for trying to overturn the election result there. he phoned a local official and asked him to find more votes. so look, all i want to do is this. i just want to find, uh, 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. a court will have to rule on whether he was acting as president or not when he made that call. justice sonia sotomayor,

mike pence expanded objectively. trump's electoral base, and jay divance won't expand anything, but trump is the kind of person who does what he likes to do what suits some politico-technological reason, and by the way, no one said it's wrong, because quite often it's when you make some unexpected move that you beat the calculators, on the other hand, i don't think you and i can know who kamela harris will choose as her partner on the... ticket, because by and large, she also needs a person who will expand this electoral base, and they now the democrats will sit and count which person, say, can be important in those states where kamela harris does not enjoy the same, say, obvious popularity as , say, joseph biden enjoyed, conditionally speaking, biden and harris added to the doda. something to each other, now biden is not on the ticket, relatively speaking, kamela harris needs someone like biden, and they will watch it, while kamela harris, she is not such a ... authoritarian personality like trump, and she did not p

mike pence, typical a republican politician is an ultraconservative, but he is a politician, he is a representative of the political establishment, the very presence. mike pence in the white house told these people that nothing extraordinary will happen, that this person, she is a businessman, she is a tv presenter, i mean trump, she has never been involved in politics, but she is inclined to cooperate with politicians. mike pence objectively expanded trump's electoral base, and jay divens did not expand anything, but trump is the kind of person who does what he likes for what fits in some way political-technological reasoning, and by the way, no one said it was wrong, because quite often, it's when you make some unexpected move that you beat the calculators, on the other hand, i don't think we you and i can know who kamela harris will choose. partner on the ticket, because by and large she also needs a person who will expand the electoral base, and they will now be democrats sitting and counting, which person, say, can be important in those states where kamela harris is not enjoys t

donald trump, mike pence is kind of a villain. is that because mike pence was disloyal throughout the campaign in 2016 and throughout his vice presidency? no. he was extremely loyal. he had one point where he was confronted with something donald trump asked him on january 6, trump asked him to do something that vice president pence did not have authority to do. mike pence chose to follow his constitutional authority rather than trump's orders and trump saw that as unforgivable. heading into this choice, i think what donald trump was saying is who is someone who no matter what i asked them to do will say yes, who will say yes to january 6 than area where mike pence said no? if you look at the resumes, that is what stands out about j.d. vance. it is not his experience in office, it is not his accomplishments. what stood out about him is clearly in the way he talks about things in public, the way he was willing to go on any range of talk shows, from the far-right podcasted steve bannon to the sunday morning talk shows. he would stick

and unlike mike pence, vance said he would have carried out trump's plan to overturn the 2020 election. he supports a national abortion ban and voted against protecting ivf. and if elected, he will help implement the extreme project 2025 plan for a second trump term, which would target

with regard to the communications with mike pence and former president trump's entreaty to mike penceoverturn the electoral college votes. the court basically said those should be considered official actions, presumptively immunize, and it would be left to the government to meet the high bar of rebutting the presumption of immunity. the court is perhaps but a thumb on the scale by directing at the lower court should receive some of the evidence. with regard to the point andrew made about the evidentiary issue, i will note that justice alito we think and argument could be made should have been recused providing the crucial fifth vote for that view that any evidence or actions that were previously immunize because they were official action could not be used as evidence to prove the crimes that were not subject to immunity. that would not have been on the table of justice alito had not been in the majority and justice thomas had also been forced to recuse. >> neal, judge chutkan already took the view that everything in that indictment reads to her like a chargeable crime against a former

jd vance would have done what mike pence would not have done, that is a very scary moment. so i think for democrats you have to keep a focus on protecting democracy here at home, but what does that mean? a safe democracy does protect your reproductive freedom, it does protect an economy for all people, access to healthcare and education, robust infrastructure laws, protecting the right to vote not just for every individual but particularly for communities of color, the benefits of a protected democracy is what people really want to know about. but you only get there by defeating donald trump and jd vance at the ballot box. >> same question to you, steve, will people be remembering this seven days that we've gone through in november? how will that be? will that be front and center in their minds voting time? >> i think people will be remembering that there's talk of a national abortion ban and jd vance even wants to, at the end of the day, use the comstock act so you couldn't even ship products across state lines. i think they'll be remembering what they see in project 2025.

vance as his running mate because vance will do what mike pence wouldn't on january 6th, bend over backwards to enable trump and his extreme maga agenda." garrett haake, nbc news, milwaukee. >>> when we come back, calls for civility in a nation divided.

mike pence is| —— here nervousness. squarejd vance's attitude towards american leadership in the world with that of the republican party. jd vance is not going to be elected president, he's going to be elected president, he's going to be elected vice president, and one thing they learned very quickly as the president is in charge. while this has been an alarm to those who get... it was a somewhat less concerned because what matters is what the boss says.— what the boss says. obviously, he was the pick- _ what the boss says. obviously, he was the pick. there _ what the boss says. obviously, he was the pick. there were - what the boss says. obviously, he was the pick. there were others . what the boss says. obviously, he was the pick. there were others - | was the pick. there were others — centres are scott, marco rubio, doug bergen —— senator scott. what do you make of this involvement of donald trumpjunior? he didn't play much of a prominent role in the first term, but yvonne, and the rest to be relegated —— ivanka. but

well, mike pence was a right-wing christian whom trump chose in 2016 due to his moral issues to ease the minds of christian voters , but vance was at the moment when trump felt he needed him the most, which was the moment when he should have refused to officially confirm joe biden's victory in the 2020 election. pence refused to listen to trump's words and confirmed biden's victory. in my opinion, what trump has been looking for more than anything else is a vice president who will surely accompany his wishes in these critical moments, and therefore, to some extent, the election privileges. sacrifice karde vance will be a deputy who will not help trump's election, first of all, he is from the state of ohio, which is no longer a competitive state, where trump's victory is certain, and secondly, in cases where the democrats will try to attack trump, as if he is against american democracy more than hadad radical vance is someone who, of course, i must also say that usually the vice president has a very minimal and negligible influence on the elections, so it's not like trump is taking a

mike pence objectively expanded trump's electoral base, and jd vance will not expand anything. but trump is the kind of person who... does what he likes, what corresponds to some politico-technological considerations, and to thing, no one said it's wrong, because quite often it's when you make some unexpected move that you beat the calculators, on the other hand, i don't think you and i can know who kamela harris is going to choose as her running mate, because by and large she also needs a person who... the electoral base, and they're going to be democrats now sitting and counting, which person, say, might be important in those states where kamela harris isn't enjoys such, let's say, obvious popularity, as enjoyed, let's say, joseph biden, conventionally speaking, biden and haris were adding something to each other, now biden is not on the ticket, conventionally speaking, kamel and haris. it takes someone like biden and they will watch it. at the same time, kamela harris is not such an authoritarian person as trump. and she didn't privatize the democratic party like the trump-r

vance's position on abortion rights, and saying vance would not have done what mike pence did. vance suggesting he would not have certified the election in 2020. >>> we are tracking severe storms in the northeast at this hour. new york city, philadelphia, to washington, d.c. winds gusting up to 70 miles per hour. ginger zee is here. >>> there's news tonight about two americans found dead in thailand. initial reports this evening saying it might have been cyanide. >>> here in the u.s. tonight, newly released surveillance. a deadly crane collapse. a construction worker killed. >>> buried in the sand. the race to save a 16-year-old girl. >>> and you could call it a bear of a day for the emmy nominations. the big winners already tonight. >> david: good evening tonight from milwaukee and the republican national convention. we do begin tonight with breaking news involving president biden. there is word just in tonight he has tested positive for covid while campaigning in the battleground state of nevada. just moments ago, these images coming in, president biden boarding air force one

hang mike pence! as his supporters stormed the capitol building, they chanted, "hang mike pence!" e president because he refused to block the certification ofjoe biden as president. mr pence had to be evacuated from his office. donald trump cannot now be prosecuted for all the conversations in which he had been pressuring mike pence to overturn the election results. the supreme court did not say whether all the charges donald trump is facing are covered by presidential immunity, so it's going to have to be argued out in a lower court. which of his actions were official presidential acts and have immunity, and which were not, meaning he can still be prosecuted for them? trump is also facing charges in the state of georgia for trying to overturn the election result there. he phoned a local official and asked him to find more votes. so look, all i want to do is this. ijust want to find, uh, 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. a court will have to rule on whether he was acting as president or not when he made that call. justice sonia sotomayor, a mor

we remember that there was a lot of criticism of the previous vice president, mike pence, especiallyadar trump after the events of january 6, when the vice president at that time, mike pence, refused. to certify and approve the election results in favor of donald trump, then many in the republican party, in trump's circle , called pence a traitor, that he was not loyal to the american president, so it looks like jd vance has shown that loyalty and that became one of the reasons that trump, because of which trump chose vence as his chosen one, as his running mate, will he somehow manifest himself differently in the administration if this administration is donald's. trump, well, i think we will watch it and consider how and if it will happen at all. ostape, we have literally 30 seconds left. oh, vance's candidacy, does it increase or decrease trump's chances of still winning? so far it is difficult to say, four months before the elections there are a lot of things happening, an assassination attempt on donald trump, calls for joe biden to drop out of the race. to what extent wentz's ca

he offered the role to mike pence and then proceeded to tell chris christie he hadn't made up his mind yet, and then went back and forth and ultimately lee it was revealed publicly that pence was the pick and they had this press conference and that was that he seems to be similarly uncertain at this time, even if he hasn't actually uncertain, that's how he's behaving. am i remembering correctly that chris christie found out like from twitter or online or from a text or so that i think even found out from trump, right? he did find out from trump, but before he found out from trump, he found out from hearing that pence was being flown into teterboro and what happened was trump said that's not true i have no idea what's happening with. >> i'm paraphrasing, but i have no idea what's happening with that but turn on your television and trump called into a cable news show and said he hadn't really made up his mind and held it up as evidenced to christie that it wasn't true. and then of course it was true that he had chosen pens and pence was coming in and then trump called christie and said i

he offered the role to mike pence and then proceeded to tell chris christie he hadn't made up his mind yet, and then went back and forth and ultimately it was revealed publicly that pence was the pick and they had this press conference and that was that he seems to be similarly uncertain this time, even if he hasn't actually uncertain, that's how he's behaving. >> am i remembering correctly that chris kristie found out like from twitter or online or from a text or so that i think even found out from trump, right he did find out from trump, but before he found out from trump, he found out from hearing that pence was being flown into teterboro and what happened was trump said that's not true i have no idea what's happening with them paraphrasing, but i have no idea what's happening with that. turn on your television and trump called into a cable news show and said he hadn't really made up his mind and held it up as evidence to christie that it wasn't true. and then of course, it was true that he had chosen pens and pence was coming in and then trump called christie and said, i've chosen

he offered the role to mike pence and then proceeded to tell chris christie he hadn't made up his mind yet, and then went back and forth and ultimately mentally, it was revealed publicly that pence was the pick and they had this press conference and that was that he seems to be similarly uncertain this time, even if he hasn't actually uncertain, that's how he's behaving. am i remembering correctly that chris christie found out like from twitter or online or from a text or so that i think even found out from trump, right? he did find out from trump, but before he found out from trump, he found out from hearing that pence was being flown into teterboro and what happened was trump said that's not true i have no idea what's happening with. >> i'm paraphrasing, but i have no idea what's happening with that. turn on your television and trump called into a cable news show and said he hadn't really made it was mined and held it up as evidenced to christie that it wasn't true. and then of course, it was true that he had chosen pens and pence was coming in and then trump called christie and said

mike pence was extremely loyal until he was finally asked to do something he was unwilling to do andy hung out to dry. these guys have to know what they're getting into. i think for a lot of them, the mentality is, hey, let me just get it, and we'll figure it out. sure, that's an approach you can take, but the risks are very high, and mike pence can tell us all the story. he has many times. >> carlos curbelo, jennifer palmieri, thank you so much. that's going to do it for us this couple of hours. make sure to joining us for "chris jansing reports" every weekday, 1:00 to 3:00 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. a lot more to talk about. our coverage will continue with "katy tur reports" next. inue wi "katy tur reports" next. the itch and rash of moderate to severe eczema disrupts my skin, night and day. despite treatment, it's still not under control. but now i have rinvoq. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that reduces the itch and helps clear the rash of eczema - fast. some rinvoq patients felt significant itch relief as early as 2 days. some achieved dramatic skin clearance as early as 2 w

he knew how washington worked so he needed mike pence for that. ded pence to appease evangelical voters who were skeptical of trump back then. this time, he doesn't need a vice president to help him fill in any gaps in his head. i think you're going to see vance, be, if this ticket's elected, i think vance is going to be almost as front and center as trump is. i think he likes vance out there explaining trumpism and giving it the illusion of an intellectual thesis behind it. not everybody thinks there is one, but i think vance is somebody that trump believes you know, gives a sort of intellectual ivy league stamp of approval on what his positions are. >> there's no doubt that donald trump is impressed by his resume. but what about the other big thing that every campaign needs and that is money. can vance help bring it in? >> yeah. absolutely. vance before he became a politician or a novelist was a venture capitalist. he has deep ties in silicon valley. most notorious ties with peter tale, member of the paypal mafia. he's going to sit out the 2024 c

donald trump this time around didn't need a mike pence. he didn't need a marco rubio. he didn't need a lindsey graham. he was age to reach down to a jd vance, the puritan now of trumpism. look at the fact that mitch mcconnell got booed and kevin mccarthy isn't welcome there. matt gaetz was right go this. this party transformation is done and that's one of the significant themes we're seeing in milwaukee. >> no one has been able to answer this question for me, amanda carpenter, but i've been reading, the summer i have, i've been reading project 2025, and the loyalty test is super specific. i mean, in '16 it was sort of a morpheus, must like trump he would say referring to himself in third person and don mcgahn wanted ndas signed. this time it's on paper and the things jd vance said about donald trump go much further than eight years on this program of some of the most sort of alarm from a constitutional legal and political spectrum, i mean, jd vance has called him worse things than anyone i've ever seen and he's called him america's hitler. the plan he associated with,

because mike pence is not available, why?porters ran up on the capital and mike pence had to run for his life so this is not a normal election and everyone should calm down. >> i wish this were another cable that we could use the actual word that you wanted to use. >> i can do it on the radio but not here. >> that's a nice job. that's a nice black job you got there zerlina. you know what i'm going to do, i'm going to go to break early because whatever question i ask you we are going to be out of time so we are going to go to break early and come back and finish this conversation with my sound off panel, zerlina maxwell and rick wilson after this. this. try dietary supplements from voltaren, for healthy joints. (smelling) ew. gotta get rid of this. ♪tell me why♪ because it stinks. ♪have you tried downy rinse and refresh♪ it helps remove odors 3x better than detergent alone. it worked guys! ♪yeahhhh♪ downy rinse and refresh. >>> >>> back with me, rick wilson and zerlina maxwell, zerlina you brought up donald trump anç you know

you see mitch mcconnell, mike pence.these up here is that every day, every decision like this from the supreme court here, we're just four months out. all of this brings question marks about what a second trump term would look like. >> the question is how he uses the doj, the supreme court decision says he's wholly immune in his dealings with the justice department. you can't question it. you can't bring it up as evidence. it is absolute immunity for the president to deal with other members of the executive branch. they cite the attorney general, the acting attorney general in this opinion. if he's putting up pictures like that, saying that these people should be prosecuted, there is an open question of whether he would use his doj to perform political prosecutions. >> right, there is long standing precedent that the president is separate from the prosecution and investigation of his department of justice, and now, not only could he potentially interfere with cases directly involving him, but he could potentially order h

would it be mike pence? who would you most want to hear from and that hearing?ortant. i'm not sure any one particular witness or any piece of evidence will be determinative, but the entire tableau might be. i do think the evidence from former vice president mike pence about what happened on the day after he was pressured to delay the certification or reject the certification of the electoral college would be very important. we've talked about the different legal theories preventing it. it would be a problem. >> i'm with you on that. i would love to hear from him. melissa murray, thank you very much. appreciate it. >>> coming up, trump is doing everything he possibly can to grift his supporters. now there is a two dollars bill with a mug shot for a mere $20. you cannot make this stuff up. . that's when we called leaffilter to protect our gutters. leaffilter's patented filter technology keeps debris out of your gutters for good. they gave us a free inspection and we had the system installed that week. my only regret is not calling them sooner. now we can focus on

. >> i'm extremely skeptical that mike pence's life was ever in danger. >> reporter: and in 2021 suggestingeping changes that would install more loyalists in the federal government. >> fire every single midlevel bureaucrat, every civil servant in the administrative state, replace them with our people. >> reporter: vance now officially on the gop ticket and in the stands with mr. trump each night of the convention so far. former president trump is preparing for his own speech tomorrow night, but you can see him actually here on stage today getting ready, getting a look at the layout. his ear still bandaged and that's after last night he came to the convention hall earlier than expected according to a source familiar with his plans to watch his former rivals make the case for a second trump term. from florida governor ron desantis -- >> america cannot afford four more years of a "weekend at bernie's" presidency. >> reporter: -- to former u.n. ambassador nikki haley. >> donald trump has my strong endorsement, period. [ cheers and applause ] >> reporter: both the subject of trump insults during

. >> mike pence is going to have to come through for us. >> reporter: and local officials like this phone call to georgia's former secretary of state. >> i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have." >> reporter: are now entitled to a presumption of immunity. the liberal justices with a blistering pushback. justice sotomayor writing "when a president uses his official powers in any way, under the majority's reasoning he will now be insulated from criminal prosecution. orders the navy seal team 6 to assassinate a political rival? immune. organizes a military coup to hold on to power? immune. takes a bribe in exchange for a pardon? immune. even if these nightmare scenarios never play out, the damage has been done." >> and laura jarrett joins us now live outside the supreme court tonight. laura, what are official or unofficial actions by the president will be decided by a lower court, and that's going to push the timeline for another trump trial? >> reporter: yes, tom. judge chutkan now has a heavy burden to try to figure out what if anything remains in this indictment.

hang mike pence! as his supporters stormed the capitol building, they chanted, "hang mike pence!" used to block the certification ofjoe biden as president. mr pence had to be evacuated from his office. donald trump cannot now be prosecuted for all the conversations in which he had been pressuring mike pence to overturn the election results. the supreme court did not say whether all the charges donald trump is facing are covered by presidential immunity, so it's going to have to be argued out in a lower court. which of his actions were official presidential acts and have immunity, and which were not, meaning he can still be prosecuted for them? trump is also facing charges in the state of georgia for trying to overturn the election result there. he phoned a local official and asked him to find more votes. so look, all i want to do is this. ijust want to find, uh, 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. a court will have to rule on whether he was acting as president or not when he made that call. justice sonia sotomayor, a more liberaljudge, completely

. >> gallo is directed to hank the president, mike pence. and i think it is fair to say one of the darkest days in the history of america. >> okay, and he is referring to january sixth. werther gallows erected to hang mike pence as the president says here? >> i'm not aware of any physical gallows. i can't remember whether demonstration perspective. there may have been replica or symbol of something like that. >> that is my impression. can we show -- can we ray set up so you can see it? it looks like there was some kind of prop that was built. the construction doesn't look it lends itself to actually hanging somebody but more of a prop, i think, as you suggested, that was erected january 6th. but if the president were correct that these gallows were erected to hang mike pence, that would be a very serious allegation, wouldn't it? >> i would take it very seriously, yes. >> has anybody been arrested, or do you have any leads in conjunction with election of this gallows? we have a picture here on the screen if you can show it again. it was just

this— indiana governor mike pence. this time, _ indiana governor mike pence.all feeling relatively good but trump _ feeling relatively good but trump is a showman. love him or hate _ trump is a showman. love him or hate him. — trump is a showman. love him or hate him. he _ trump is a showman. love him or hate him, he is somebody who comes— hate him, he is somebody who comes out— hate him, he is somebody who comes out of the television business, reality tv. he said this— business, reality tv. he said this week— business, reality tv. he said this week he was to do it at the — this week he was to do it at the convention with as much fanfare — the convention with as much fanfare as possible. he said he might— fanfare as possible. he said he might announce a senator rubio in florida — might announce a senator rubio in florida and he did not but this— in florida and he did not but this gives _ in florida and he did not but this gives you a sense that he wanted — this gives you a sense that he wanted to— this gives you a sense that he wanted to happen at the conventi

donald trump, mike pence is kind of a villain.at because mike pence was disloyal throughout the campaign in 2016 and throughout his vice presidency? no. he was extremely loyal. he had one point where he was confronted with something donald trump asked him on january 6, trump asked him to do something that vice president pence did not have authority to do. mike pence chose to follow his constitutional authority rather than trump's orders and trump saw that as unforgivable. heading into this choice, i think what donald trump was saying is who is someone who no matter what i asked them to do will say yes, who will say yes to january 6 than area where mike pence said no? if you look at the resumes, that is what stands out about j.d. vance. it is not his experience in office, it is not his accomplishments. what stood out about him is clearly in the way he talks about things in public, the way he was willing to go on any range of talk shows, from the far-right podcasted steve bannon to the sunday morning talk shows. he would stick up fo

to shore up mike pence because he needs to shore up his— mike pence because he needs to shore up his _ evangelical republican base. he does not need to do that right now. he does _ not need to do that right now. he does not — not need to do that right now. he does not have a ridiculous estate were _ does not have a ridiculous estate were picking a vice president could help him _ were picking a vice president could help him dramatically he will win 0hio _ help him dramatically he will win 0hio but — help him dramatically he will win 0hio but where jd vance is from, so i 0hio but where jd vance is from, so i don't _ 0hio but where jd vance is from, so idoh't think— 0hio but where jd vance is from, so i don't think he feels he needs to supplement the ticket. what he wants is someone _ supplement the ticket. what he wants is someone he thinks he can work with and — is someone he thinks he can work with and if— is someone he thinks he can work with and if it _ is someone he thinks he can work with and if it is a generational type — with and if it is a generational type of— with and if it

when former president donald trump was making statements to then vice president mike pence in connection to the january 6 was the acting in official capacity or unofficial capacity and supreme court calling that out as what needs to have more briefing here. ash. ashley: very good, lid .y i was just reading chief justice john robert's opinion. he said a president inclined to take one cause of action based on public interest may set up for another criminal penalty made before him upon his departure from office and that's the crux of it and thank you, lydia. back to the markets on this. bring in jason katz who, look, are we going to see the dow off 16 points? what relevance will this have to the market, jason it >> returns are significantly harder to come by and not insurmountable and it's decision time for voters vs and decision time for the fed and, yes, there's other things that play that will shape the direction of the market. it of course will be the direction of earnings. it'll be whether inflation continues to abate. it'll be the outcome of the election. but above all, i think it's g

because they threatened to kill mike pence and mike pence refused to certify the election of the peopletification of an election, which is tantamount to overthrowing the government because they were overthrowing the will of the people. you got to bring that home. joe biden is running with his vice presidential candidate. mike pence had to run from his president and to save his life, and we need to keep raising that to the public so they understand the kind of person that donald trump is and the kind of president he was. >> and, of course, a reminder that vance would not have done what mike pence did. he is a guy that said he would not certify that election, and that's why he should not be allowed this that position at all. thank you all for spending time with us. greatly appreciate it. >>> when we return as the firefighter killed in the assassination attempt against former-president trump is laid to rest, the secret service is facing questions, serious questions about what went wrong. we are going to get into that after a short break. a subcutaneous injection that takes about 30 to 90 s

the next thing they say is what about trump's efforts to influence vice president mike pence? this is where the presumption comes in, that the burden is on the government to rebut that presumption but they they can see circumstances in which the presumption would fall away with respect to the efforts to influence mike pence. it's the remaining allegations that really are in that fuzzy land of judge chutkan's real authority to do additional fact-finding. with respect, and again, i'm reading from the opinion, to his interactions with persons outside the executive branch, state officials, private parties, the general public, those are allegations where judge chutkan will then have to determine whether his conduct qualifies as official or unofficial. the final category, what happened on january 6th itself. they say, look, the president possesses extraordinary power to speak to his fellow citizens and on their behalf as part of a core presidential function. on the other hand, there may be contacts in which he's talking in another official -- unofficial capacity as the party leader

that's what we saw when he picked mike pence. see mike pence in every meeting at the white house when i went to meet with president trump when he was in office. i think j.d. vance is a comfort factor for donald trump. i don't think it brings him any certain segment of the voting population. i think he matters comfort matters when you are president a lot more than it does to win the election. stephanie: i think this was an interesting play because it was not necessarily about expanding the president's base, because he has his base secured. the republican party more united today than i have seen them in years. i think it's a senate play. ohio is going to be much harder for sherrod brown now that j.d. vance will also be on the ticket. i think that was a smart play on behalf of president trump and his team. sumi: we are watching the nomination take place. those are the loud noises behind us. stephanie, sherrod brown of course the democrat senator from ohio who is seeking reelection. what do you think this means for what we will see f

mike pence, for instance, has already testified in a grand jury, so the issue of executive privilege has come and gone, so this will be a bit of an uphill battle for donald trump, but it is also really notable that he obviously does not want the facts to come out. i mean, if you thought the facts were going to be good for you, you would not be objecting so strenuously to having this kind of pretrial hearing. >> but, we can't be surprised, right? any hearing is not going to be good for donald trump, and successfully blocking or delaying has been a huge success for him thus far, so wouldn't it make perfect sense that he would go this way? >> absolutely. this is -- delaying is the thing to do but this is one where the language of the supreme court case is very much against donald trump's position in terms of having a factual hearing, and again, i do think this plays into joe biden's hands to say, what are you hiding? in other words, why do you not want to have a hearing for people who are -- remember, these witnesses are going to be republican witnesses who are all part of his administr

on briefings and then if that fails and the special counsel pushes for witnesses and people like mike pencestrategy is to basically litigate his way through and delay it until after the divorce -- election and it will look like pence to assert a debate clause protection and then get other people connected like john eastman and like roman charged to say their fifth amendment concerns couldn't possibly testify as to whether trump was acting as candidate trump leading up to january 6 are acting as president trump but the aim is to prevent prosecutors from making that argument because it is up to prosecutors to show the judge that the presumptive immunity for any official act could be overcome. >> how will he do that?'s how will he honestly challenge testimony from key witnesses like his former vice president and what is a legal argument for that? >> i think what he will try to do is basically not have the hearing. the worst possible thing for him is essentially a mini trial. the problem, stephanie is the supreme court decision as horrendous and untethered and unprincipled it is, does say that

where is mike pence? mike pence is not there.either is his former chief of staff is former secretary of defense. i could go through so many who were part of those who worked most closely with the president or not at the convention but to not think he should be president. have said so publicly. the thing that most frightens me and should a lot of americans is, pence is not there because he saved our democracy. he said, i'm going to move forward and certified an election that even donald trump's highest election officer said was a fair election. and so, we now have a vacancy v he picks somebody that should we be in s that position again, a lawful election in the united states of america as was movin' by court t challenge after cour challenge after courtha challen, that noble republican state actors like we saw in georgia have to fight against the president's t unjust efforts to- to interfere in the election. hen picked somebody who has sa publicly if i was in the same space as pence i would not do the right w thing, i would not the

mike pence did nothing. so special, he simply implemented the results of the presidential election in in the united states, when trump opposed this implementation, he actually ended his political career, although he is a man of extremely conservative views, which correspond to the views of most members of the republican party today, but this man did not obey trump, and this is enough to will never support her again, this is a completely new republican party, i repeat, there was no such republican party. never, and the democratic party remains what it always was and what the republican party used to be, that the debate party, it's a party where joseph biden is the leader, but a person who can give advice, and any of the, let's say, respected democrats, nancy pelosi or barack obama or whoever, can give advice to joseph biden, and as you understand, donald pramt doesn't need... advice, the people who meet with him from the ranks of the republicans, they meet with him only to report to him, they only convince him until the moment when they don't care does not threaten, and it must be clea