and keep in mind he built monticello twice. before he went to france, he went to france, decided he fell in love with french architecture and he rebuilt it. when he got tired that he built another mansion outside of lynchburg. then he spent $30,000 on a meal in a canal at the bottom of monticello mountain. said that never really restrained him from anything that he wanted to do. one of the historians who studied, i think it was -- stephen, said if jefferson hadn't decided to make it rather reckless investment of $30,000 in an outcome he probably would've been able to ride out the financial storms of the early 19th century. and another analysis of the financial records show that jefferson, a slaves actually were very productive farmers. and that in one of the first decades of the american agricultural economy, jefferson lost very little money on his farming operation. and so, the slaves were really holding their phones when commodity prices were plunging, and so, i mean and jefferson just kept spending -- the nail in the coffin

. >> reporter: elizabeth is curator at monticello.his room that were made by slaves? >> yes. in the joinery or the furniture-making wood shop in jefferson's later years was run by a slave named john hemmings. hemmings ran the joinery and made many pieces of furniture that are in monticello today. he was very highly skilled. he was freed by jefferson in his will and given the tools of his trade. >> reporter: john hemmings is remembered because of his craftsmanship. unlike so many other jefferson slaves. >> to be able to sort of have an image of jefferson that we all know and behind him the names of the 600 people that he owned in his lifetime really means that we have to understand slavery in order to understand jefferson. >> reporter: this man heads the smithsonian's national museum of african-american history and culture, sponsor of a traveling exhibition about slavery at monticello. >> what's powerful is quite candidly we only know the first names. and there are some that we just have as unknown. >> reporter: lucy, lucy. it's almost

it was a couple of days' ride from monticello to washington. he stopped at an inn and falls into a conversation with a fellow guest and they have a lovely, wide ranging discussion the next morning the other guest mr. jefferson is up and out and the other guest had never called his name and he said to the inn keeper who was that and he said who did you think it was? for a while and you knew so much about medicine i thought he was a doctor. then we talked about theology and he seemed as though he might be a priest though a shaky one. i thought he could have been certainly a farmer because of everything he knew and he said i thought you knew mr. jefferson. he was a master of so many different worlds and he was indefinitely curious at the time when human curiosity and the ability to lead us to our own destiny to fulfil in many ways our greatest potentials to discover, to explore was new in the world and this was the enlightened era. they had been a day before yesterday. for the first time ever, priestley and princely authority was in the dhaka, and

he traveled through a couple of days' ride from monticello to washington. he stopped at an inn, he falls into conversation with a fellow guest at the inn, and they have a lovely, wide-ranging discussion. the next morning the other guest, mr. jefferson's up and out, the other guest had never caught his name, and he said to the innkeeper, who was that? and the innkeeper said, well, who did you think it was? he said, for a while -- he knew so much about medicine, i thought he was a doctor. and then we talked about theology, he seemed like he might be a preels, though kind of a shaky one -- [laughter] i thought he could probably a farmer. and the innkeeper said, well, i thought you knew it was mr. jefferson. he was a master, and he was endlessly curious at a time when curiosity and the ability to allow reason to lead us to our own destiny to fulfill our greatest potentials to discover, to explore was new in the world. and this was the enlightenment era. the scientific revolution had been the day before yesterday. for the first time ever, priestly and princely a

he certainly got to know the various monticello slaves and their were monticello slaves that were part of jefferson's white house that prevent heart of madison's white house. one fellow in particular named john freeman was purchased by president madison from president jefferson at the transition to the administration and he was married for a member of monticello's well-known family. there was plenty of interaction between the two plantations. jennings wrote in his memoir that jefferson and madison were as intimate as any two brothers could be. >> let me ask a question about does the author, does he characterized present madison, does he write a character sketch of him? >> he does. you have to remember that there are issues of candor in the memoir like this. john boruk forceful was an amateur historian and he got to learn about the back story of his co-worker in the pension office and i can hear him approaching paul jennings and saying i understand you used to work for president madison. what was that like? i think you have to remember how that might, what jennings talks and does not ta

you go to monticello, and you feel you're kind of in conversation with him. he's a very vivid figure. it's hard to imagine having a drink with george washington. barnicle did it. and you can tell. >> he was a good guy. >> and john adams, barnicle wrote a couple columns about him back in the day. >> and his son. i knew his son when his son was in day care. >> john w. adams. yeah. but i think it's his renaissance question. and then i think also he representeds the best of us and the worst of us. and i think people, when we're being honest with ourselves, we all know we have our hypocrisies, and we have our contradictions. and the fact that someone who had such evident contradictions is still worth paying attention to i think resonates. >> and there's some contention over the weekend about how great a man thomas jefferson is. we're going to talk about that a little bit later. >>> but we've got big news this morning. four weeks from today is new year's eve when the fiscal cliff comes. lawmakers now have less than a month to compromise and to avoid a year-end dead

he is seen as this great figure in monticello. the author of the declaration of independence and the founder of the university of virginia. >> he doesn't care about being president or anything else. >> my argument is that's an act of misdirection. he knew that those things were going to be harder to argue against. equality and conscious and enlightenment. hard to get a caucus up against those. >> that was his legacy? >> oh, my god, of course he was. absolutely. that's to me what is the most interesting thing. the founders for them, the word fame meant representation and they thought that you and i would be sitting here talking about it. if the experiment survived, they knew they would be talked about forever. jeffer in politics for 40 years knew that everything he did in politics because politics is say 51-49 business, he didn't want 49% talking about what he didn't do right. >> why do you think it's been of all the founding fathers, jefferson is both political parties want to claim a party of jeffersonianism as to why they are de

he goes on to monticello and doesn't fire a shot in the war and goes home to watch the slaves from theplantation. >> so they fell out later on in their political lives later when both jefferson and john adams falters had retired the began corresponding with each other and formed a warm friendship. but john quincy adams never -- he voted for jefferson. he was first -- the only federalist to vote for jefferson 's louisiana purchase when he was the center, but then turned around and fought jefferson's attempt to impeach and remove samuel chase from the supreme court. samuel chase was a strong federalist, and jefferson was intent on getting control of the entire government. he was a republican. he now had a republican majority in the house of representatives come slight majority in the senate. he wanted to remove the federal list from the bench to get republicans on that and get control of the entire government and the republicans in the house impeached him. he went to trial, samuel chase went to trial in the senate coming and when the arguments were finished, the first one to vote was joh

i went to monticello last week and had an opportunity to see jefferson's home.his guy who talked about try to look out for each other, tried to do what was right. he's a great leader and a great man. there was a great book and i just enjoyed reading your book on john f.k. >> i do think you were a very popular governor. and ill think i talked to you lieutenant governor on an airplane a while back and he said if you stayed there, you'd still be there. did you like that job? >> oh, it's a great job. absolutely. i talked to bob graham about it and he said charlie, when you're governor of the state, it's like being the quarterback of the football team. you have the opportunity to call a lot more plays than you do when you're serving in the u.s. senate. you're more of a spectator. >> where was he when you needed him five years ago. if he would have advised you to do that, you'd still be governor. >> well, maybe so. i had the wonderful opportunity and my wife did, and they are lovely people. he is a great floridan and a great friend. >> if you had to advise somebody, w

by the time i had turned 15, i had visited jefferson's monticello or truman's independence, visited steinbeck's home in salinas, i was able to go to the reed willow cabin and go to red cloud, nebraska. so i think living on the road for family vacations three months in a trailer got me very interested in american history. >> with literature comes very important thing; community. as one old friend used to say, a writer is someone who has readers. i always thought that was a good, simple line, a good, simple definition of what a writer is. but that effort of creating a community through an art form and enhancing that community, enhancing that general imagination makes having the writer's institute not only a worthwhile thing, but i think a very important thing. and what we've done, i think, across the years is we've not only exposed people to excellent artwork and writing in particular, but we've educated people. to become more discriminating, to become more effective judges of what makes something good. and people read, people buy books. this is a very book-loving community, and i think the write

then he went home to monticello city could be this way. every winter the revolutionary war, george washington suffering through the freezing weather valley forge was martha washington with her white bonnet. by starting the first ladies beget new insights on on the presidents and new insights on other things. apropos to my book washington -- -- alexander hamilton one of the chapters in the book talks about hamilton's history of womanizing. for example bill clinton was not the first and bill clinton was not the worst when it comes to misbehavior in high office. there's a long history of it and arnold schwarzenegger and john edwards, david petraeus had nothing on alexander hamilton. if you read for example letters written by martha washington going to the winter camp, she didn't complain about the weather. she didn't complain about the harsh conditions but she did complain about one thing. there was a was a tomcat one winter that was misbehaving and it was noisy and kept her awake at night so she nicknamed the tomcat alexander hamilton. becau

i mean, i went to monticello last week and had the opportunity to see jefferson's home.now, this guy who talked about trying to look out for each other, trying to look out for people, trying to do what was right and, you know, he's a great leader and a great man. and there is a great book on it john meacham just wrote and i enjoyed reading your book on jfk. >> welcome aboard i suppose to the center left. let me ask you about your potential here. i do think you were a very popular governor. and i think i talked to you're lieutenant governor on an airplane a while back and he said if you'd stayed there, you would still be there. so did you like that job in tallahassee as governor of florida? >> oh, it's a great job, absolutely. you know, i talked to bob graham about it. he said, charlie, when you're governor of the state, it's like being the quarterback of the football team. you have the opportunity to call a lot more plays than you do when you're serving in the u.s. senate. you're more of a speck taker of what's going on. >> where was he when i needed him? where was he wh

she won the 2009 pulitzer prize in history for her book, "the hemingses of monticello: an american familyf the professor freed, we just saw a long line snaking around the national archive. the event is one thing. how come an object has that kind of power? >> well, it's an iconic document in american history. and americans like to look at things like that to remind us the sort of journey we've been on from the beginning of the country's foundation. the declaration of independence, the emancipation proclamation, are the touch stouns for where we have been and where we hope we are going. >> suarez: i have seen people wait an hour to see, in effect, words. if you go to ancient cathedrals in europe, let's say, they may wait in long lines to see objects that connect to saints, kings and queens. are we a republic of words? are they so important that we'll wait a long time to see them? >> well, people have said that america is a country that is founded upon ideals and ideas that are expressed in worsd. and so it makes sense that people would look at these words, as i said, to try to tell white ho

. >> monticello is the picture on our cover this week. >> osgood: when we launched sunday morning ink out. >> progress is not inevitable and the melting pot doesn't always melt very well. >> reporter: richard reported the facts, yes, but what a way he had with words. what a way leroy niemann had with a brush, an artist as colorful as his canvases. he painted the good life and the sporting life. (phone ringing). >> madison manor, oscar the beautiful speaking. >> osgood: in the odd couple jack includingman was everybody's image of a slofnly sports writer. his oscar was a lovable grouch. >> the legendary hector macho comacho. >> reporter: if ever a fighter was deserving of his nickname it was hector macho. he was famous for his speed and his style. alex carrus showed both speed and style as tackle for the detroit lions. and he was a knockout in blazing saddles. >> hey, you can't park that animal over there. it's illegal. >> osgood: because of his looks, ernest borgnine was typecast as a heavy. but as marty, borgnine proved there was more to him -- and perhaps more to all of us -- than m

she won the 2009 pulitzer prize in history for her book, "the hemingses of monticello: an american familythe professor freed we just saw a long line snaking around the national archive. the event is one thing. how come an object has that kind of power? >> well it's an iconic document in american history. and americans like to look at things like that to remind us the sort of journey we've been on from the beginning of the country's foundation. the declaration of independence the emancipation proclamation are the touch stouns for where we have been and where we hope we are going. >> suarez: i have seen people wait an hour to see, in effect words. if you go to ancient cathedrals in europe, let's say, they may wait in long lines to see objects that connect to saints kings and queens. are we a republic of words? are they so important that we'll wait a long time to see them? >> well, people have said that america is a country that is founded upon ideals and ideas that are expressed in worsd. and so it makes sense that people would look at these words, as i said, to try to tell white house we a

see world and disneyland we would visit the historic sites so by the time i turned 15i visited monticello or truman's independence and got to read the home and go to the red cloud nebraska. so i think living on the road for a family that goes through the trailer got me very interested in american history. >> literature is a very important thing in the community. as my friend used as a writer is someone who has readers. it's a good simple line, but simple definition but that through the art form and enhancing that community and enhancing that general imagination makes having a writers institute not only a worthwhile thing that very important. and what we have done i think across the years is not only expose people to the accidental art work and writing in particular but dedicated people to become more discriminating, to become more effective judges by what makes something good come and people read, people buy books, this is a very book loving community and i think the writers institute has done a lot to enhance that to create the environment in which people can explore literature especiall

host: i am, from monticello, minn.. republican line. good morning. diane, are you there?aryland to a democratic line, wade. caller: good morning. these people keep talking about the slow recovery compared to previous recoveries, but nobody considers how many jobs -- how many companies have shipped jobs out of the economy. there are fewer jobs. how will people find jobs? host: mr. michael tanner? guest: the number of jobs shipped overseas is much smaller than people realize, but it is no longer global to be a high- school dropout and getting manual labor job. we are moving from that manual labor, low-skill jobs environment, to one in which he will have to have more education and skills. that is the reality of globalization, and i do not think you will have to avoid that. where to put more attention to and on getting people the skills -- we have to put more attention and getting people the skills. we will never have thousands of people sitting at sewing machines making t-shirts. host: another area where your groups seemed to disagree is whether the unemployment insurance cr