mr. egerton: i can answer that. i should say here everything i know about frederick douglass -- my wife is writing a book this spring. hi honey. [laughter] mr. egerton: it is called "women in the world of frederick douglass." he and johnson are bitter enemies immediately. he admires grant but he decides it's better to be an activist where he is and not be part of the political system. even in central new york it is complicated. as popular as he is in rochester he could not have been elected to congress. he would have to be in the south to do that and get one of the black belt counties. he sees grant as an ally and johnson as an enemy. he always remains just an activist. he believes his pen and voice are his weapons. ms. waugh: he is a great campaigner in 1872 for grant. ms. medford: but his agitation is the most important thing he had. that was his role in society. he is the leader of black america, undisputed in this part of the 19th century. he is there to agitate. he is there to bail out white men who let the fre

mr. egerton: let me survey echoing joan. we had dinner with president lincoln and that doesn't happen very often. also last night my friend catherine ward biggest geeks slowly which is not one of my skills. especially when you're given three minutes to answer a long question. i will probably talk fast. in my book i tried to write about black white, north, south, east, west, and you have conservatives like andrew johnson that don't use reconstruction. then you have white republicans using the term reconstruction. even the so-called radicals, when you asked what reconstruction is, they say it's a policy for the defeated confederacy. when you ask frederick douglas, it is a national policy. douglas says this is a war for national reclamation. bear in mind, we had lincoln's last speech at richmond. he said he believed voting rights was something to be earned. he got the 179,000 men in blue uniforms had earned that right. lincoln's modern critics are not impressed. ok. there are 4 million freed americans at that moment, half of wh